DEEP Grant Program Aims to Replace or Remove Inefficient Outdoor Wood Burning Furnaces

[Bad Wolf]

Not sure how this will play out but at least they are trying to help with cost rather than just saying "get rid of it".

http://www.ct.gov/deep/cwp/view.asp?Q=551284&A=4568

 

[hobbyheater]

REGULATIONS Legislated Solutions more often end up being poorly representative of what initially was intended.
Our sleepy little town of Port McNeill, population 2,500. Once the wood burning season arrives, the smoldering Air Tight stove becomes king. Times when there is little or no wind, the town is blanketed with wood smoke from these smoldering stoves - reminiscent of sawmill towns with a Bee Hive burner - burners which have been outlawed in this province.
Our town now has a bylaw that requires all wood burning appliances to be EPA Phase II compliant, but when the biggest phase II stove possible is purchased and the firebox loaded to the hilt and left to smolder for the next day or how ever long it will smolder, the purpose of being phase II compliant does not have the desired effect.
Clean wood burning technology has been around since the early 80s but remains for most and especially for those unschooled in the art of the burning of wood JUST TOO EXPENSIVE!

 

[mustash29]

Great, more "smart" things from Hartford.

Why can't things be simple.
Gross polluter 24/7?
1st offense - warning.
2nd offense - fire dept makes it stop smoldering.
3rd offense - concrete company makes it so you can't fill the firebox again, problem solved.

 

[BoilerMan]

REGULATIONS Legislated Solutions more often end up being poorly representative of what initially was intended.
Our sleepy little town of Port McNeill, population 2,500. Once the wood burning season arrives, the smoldering Air Tight stove becomes king. Times when there is little or no wind, the town is blanketed with wood smoke from these smoldering stoves - reminiscent of sawmill towns with a Bee Hive burner - burners which have been outlawed in this province.
Our town now has a bylaw that requires all wood burning appliances to be EPA Phase II compliant, but when the biggest phase II stove possible is purchased and the firebox loaded to the hilt and left to smolder for the next day or how ever long it will smolder, the purpose of being phase II compliant does not have the desired effect.
Clean wood burning technology has been around since the early 80s but remains for most and especially for those unschooled in the art of the burning of wood JUST TOO EXPENSIVE!

Very well said!

TS

 

[BoilerMan]

Great, more "smart" things from Hartford.

Why can't things be simple.
Gross polluter 24/7?
1st offense - warning.
2nd offense - fire dept makes it stop smoldering.
3rd offense - concrete company makes it so you can't fill the firebox again, problem solved.

I agree, and do share your mindset toward those "unschooled wood burners".

It would be so hard to implement though. If you had a neighbor who didn't like wood (or owned an oil company) they could get pictures of your chimney when you are just getting a fire going with smoke-a-billow. Then it could happen to you.

TS

 

[Pologuy9906]

I inquired about this program. Nothing applies to simply adding a gasification unit. They did tell me about another program through the lung cancer association. I will gather more info and post it today. I believe it's only for residents in Litchfield and Wyndham counties I'm in Fairfield county.

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

Any money spent IMHO is a waste. They usually put so many Caveats in that the original purpose is lost. NH has more e-classics because of their program. Kind of defeated the purpose there!

 

[infinitymike]

I inquired about this program. Nothing applies to simply adding a gasification unit. They did tell me about another program through the lung cancer association. I will gather more info and post it today. I believe it's only for residents in Litchfield and Wyndham counties I'm in Fairfield county.

I have a friend who lives up in the NW corner of CT, he has a gasification burner.
He has it in his barn. which is right on the property line.
It is piped underground to the house.
The neighbor made a complaint...
Well now, the DEEP put a cease and desist order on him.
They are considering it an OWB because it does not heat the structure it is occupying.
If it were in his house, which he doesn't have the room for it, it would be no problem.
I showed him this news yesterday, maybe he can get the state to pay for it to be removed.
Then he will build a little attached structure to his his and reinstall it.

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

He has it in his barn. which is right on the property line.

This does not sound like a wood burning issue. Sounds like a zoning issue that has come to light with the addition of the boiler. Is this gasification boiler an indoor model or an OWB?
I would argue that the boiler heats both structures especially if the system includes divorced storage.

But if this is an OWB inside it would appear to be skirting the rules. lots of variables there.

 

[infinitymike]

This does not sound like a wood burning issue. Sounds like a zoning issue that has come to light with the addition of the boiler. Is this gasification boiler an indoor model or an OWB?
I would argue that the boiler heats both structures especially if the system includes divorced storage.

But if this is an OWB inside it would appear to be skirting the rules. lots of variables there.

It is definitely an indoor boiler. Its a Wood Gun.

Even if he put a heat loop in this completely un heated structure, it wouldn't satisfy the code. It needs to be in the building that is the primary heated structure

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

It is definitely an indoor boiler. Its a Wood Gun

Is he burning to storage?

not bashing: but not sure this was a wise choice of boiler for his proximity to neighbors(based on concept). If he is not burning to storage he has the same issue you had/have with your install.
A garn in this same barn? Would the complaining neighbor be satisfied? Then apply for money swap out appliance-IMHO silly world we live in.

The municipality will not be solving the issue by allowing the current boiler to be moved to primary residence most likely.
I think the method is the cause here.

 

[infinitymike]

Is he burning to storage?

not bashing: but not sure this was a wise choice of boiler for his proximity to neighbors(based on concept). If he is not burning to storage he has the same issue you had/have with your install.
A garn in this same barn? Would the complaining neighbor be satisfied? Then apply for money swap out appliance-IMHO silly world we live in.

The municipality will not be solving the issue by allowing the current boiler to be moved to primary residence most likely.
I think the method is the cause here.

No storage,.

And I'm not so sure we can put all the blame on the Wood Gun, in and of it self.
Even when I am gasifing and burning perfectly, without a hint of smoke, there is still a smell, which the neighbor could possibly complain about. And I gotta believe ANY wood burner has to have a smell of some sort.

Please let's turn this thread into a Wood Gun bashing frenzy, but stay focused on the ever continuing and over bearing rule of the system, known as a free democracy

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

No storage

JMHO-Bingo! its the method!

My Grandpa is not noticeable when he Burns Flatout!

Smell is a different nuisance for sure! but one huge advantage I see with burning to storage is that it allows one to burn at times that would be less objectionable. especially during shoulder or summer use.

 

[infinitymike]

but one huge advantage I see with burning to storage is that it allows one to burn at times that would be less objectionable. especially during shoulder or summer use.

This is true.

But to shut him down ONLY because THEY consider it an OWB is the over bearing ruling I'm tired of.
Moving it 50' and putting it in the house won't change a single thing

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

But to shut him down ONLY because THEY consider it an OWB is the over bearing ruling I'm tired of.
Moving it 50' and putting it in the house won't change a single thing

Not bashing,BUT: it works currently like an OWB, it is not always the appliance that causes the problem.
walks like a duck, sounds like a duck!
Regulations need to be case specific and each situation has its design challenges. So education is most important! HOBBYHEATER has beaten us all! he adopted the principle early with an old boiler!

 

[infinitymike]

Not bashing,BUT: it works currently like an OWB, it is not always the appliance that causes the problem.
walks like a duck, sounds like a duck!
Regulations need to be case specific and each situation has its design challenges. So education is most important! HOBBYHEATER has beaten us all! he adopted the principle early with an old boiler!

No bashing taken,

I'm sure if you put ANY gasifier in the same barn with or with storage CT would classify it as an OWB

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

I'm sure if you put ANY gasifier in the same barn with or with storage CT would classify it as an OWB

yes, now! But how many are out there that no one has noticed? I think its an attorneys dream.

 

[infinitymike]

yes, now! But how many are out there that no one has noticed? I think its an attorneys dream.

Sad, so sad.

If they really want to save people and the enviromemt, they should outlaw cigarettes and alcohol, they kill a hellava lot more people.
But now that's a thread for the ash can

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

I have a friend who lives up in the NW corner of CT, he has a gasification burner.

you guys should get together and sell biomass to the municipality that has this rule. I bet the definition will change when they save thousands for themselves and the complaining neighbor!

 

[Bad Wolf]

Don't have all of the details but they are probably getting him on the 200' to the nearest structure not served by the boiler. Makes no sense, my Tarm (inside) is maybe 90 feet from my neighbor, but if I had an OWB it would have to be 200’ into the woods in back of my house with a 40’ elevation change.
The way they look at it if its outside the main house its an OWB.

 

[bigbobs]

I think he should replace it with an OIL BURNER, they can smell worst than a wood burner....just to spite his neighbor!

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

I think he should replace it with an OIL BURNER, they can smell worst than a wood burner....just to spite his neighbor!

not sure this wood have a positive outcome.

I think the hearth could come up with a solution or recommendation to this situation if all variables are honestly put on the table in a new thread. there are many variables to consider here and that is most likely why the rule is so stringent. This is a stressful situation for both the neighbor and the wood burner I would assume. especially since winter is approaching.

 

[BoilerMan]

I'm really not sure what I'd do if someone told me I couldn't burn wood.

The detached building is just their definition of "OWB" so he falls into it, no matter what kind of boiler it is gasser or not.

Some of the sad things that can't be done with laws and regulations. Things need definitions to be clear, but in turn someone out there will inevitably twist those words in black and white to suit their needs or their lawsuit. It happens all the time with codes (which I believe we need to some extent). In my trade there are so many things that just end up costing a lot of time and wa$te labor and material$ just to satisfy some code which has absolutely no bearing on real-world safety.

But with no standard the free-for-all would be nightmarish. Standards (codes, regulations) are needed but the interpretation is where the proof really is. "By the Spirit not by the letter" to borrow from a well known book..........

TS

 

[Fred61]

Most of these rules are made by the ignorant and uninformed.

 

[NE WOOD BURNER]

Most of these rules are made by the ignorant and uninformed.

Most rules have a caveat for variance or special exception. This particular case at the end of August is poor timing for a cease operation. I think it creates a financial hardship if you have your wood prepared and your fuel is technically prepaid.
It will take too much time to get a ruling before heating season.
so I would post the specifics of the dwelling and outbuilding and see what the hearth can come up with for a reasonable solution.