Defiant fireback replacement

[Tommymc]

I have one of the original Defiant Parlor stoves. It came with the house which was built in the late 70's. I don't know the exact model... but it's a 1, 1A, or 1A1. Shortly after moving in...about 24 yrs ago, I rebuilt the stove because of a cracked fireback. The kit included the 2-pc fireback and required a new door as well as a 2 pc end baffle with a "leg". I vaguely remember being told that the conversion would simplify replacing the fireback in the future.

Well, the future is here, and the lower fireback is cracked again. (I guess I shouldn't complain after 20+ yrs) Now I'm wondering if (since I did the conversion) the replacement can be done without a complete disassembly. Anybody have experience with this?

Thanks....

 

[claydogg84]

I can't answer your specific question, but I can give you advice in case you do repair it. The main reason for the firebacks cracking is lack of maintenance. Make sure you clean out the ash behind the fire back every year.

 

[Tommymc]

I can't answer your specific question, but I can give you advice in case you do repair it. The main reason for the firebacks cracking is lack of maintenance. Make sure you clean out the ash behind the fire back every year.

Thanks for the reply. I *do* clean behind the upper fireback every year when I sweep the chimney. That's accessible through the smoke collar by removing the smoke shelf. It's the lower section that cracks. That's the air intake and not accessible any way that I can see......at least not without removing the fireback. There shouldn't be much ash in there, as I try to empty the ash before it reaches the air holes......which are at the base of the lower fireback. The crack originates at the top of the lower section. My suspicion is that it's more likely caused by the occasional overfiring....those times we forget to put the handle down fast enough.

I'm not complaining about getting *only* 20+ yrs out of the rebuild, just wondering the least invasive way to replace the part.

 

[claydogg84]

You're right, 20 years is definitely a good run. I had the same stove myself, but not long enough to rebuild it. Hopefully someone will chime in with help.

 

[Tommymc]

Just to follow up, I spoke with the guy at the local stove store yesterday. He confirmed that the conversion kit to the 2-pc back allows the replacement without total dis-assembly. I'm not quite sure how it's done, and cementing the secondary air channel will be a bear, but I guess I'll give it a try. If anybody has specific experience with this (almost) antique, please chime in.

 

[clothman]

I'm watching this thread with interest. I too, have a Defiant 1A with a cracked lower fireback. It's a "hairline" crack from the top of the lower fireback going toward the finned area of it. It should be fine for this winter as it's so small I can't see ash and whatnot getting back there to mess airflow up, but I will want to replace it this spring I think. Do I need to totally tear this thing apart or is there a way I can just take the top and left side off the stove to access the fireback pieces?
Thanks for any advice for both of us.

 

[claydogg84]

I'm watching this thread with interest. I too, have a Defiant 1A with a cracked lower fireback. It's a "hairline" crack from the top of the lower fireback going toward the finned area of it. It should be fine for this winter as it's so small I can't see ash and whatnot getting back there to mess airflow up, but I will want to replace it this spring I think. Do I need to totally tear this thing apart or is there a way I can just take the top and left side off the stove to access the fireback pieces?
Thanks for any advice for both of us.

The OP of this thread didn't get an answer here, so it's unlikely he will return with an update, unfortunately.

 

[Tommymc]

The OP of this thread didn't get an answer here, so it's unlikely he will return with an update, unfortunately.

Sorry for the lapse.....I did go to the local stove shop and asked about the repair. I was assured that it's possible on the "converted" stoves to do the lower fireback replacement without disassembly. Looking at the exploded view, it looks tricky. Also applying stove cement to the lower part of the air channel seems problematic. The top is accessible through the stove pipe ring.

I haven't made a decision yet as to whether to replace the entire stove. The new VC Encore looks great and is more appropriately sized for our house.....but I'm wary of all the refractory brick parts. It looks like one log dropped with too much force (it's a top loader) would do damage. This fear re-inforced by the experience of a friend who bought one last year.

For now, I've just patched the fireback with stove cement (like I did last year)

 

[claydogg84]

Sorry for the lapse.....I did go to the local stove shop and asked about the repair. I was assured that it's possible on the "converted" stoves to do the lower fireback replacement without disassembly. Looking at the exploded view, it looks tricky. Also applying stove cement to the lower part of the air channel seems problematic. The top is accessible through the stove pipe ring.

I haven't made a decision yet as to whether to replace the entire stove. The new VC Encore looks great and is more appropriately sized for our house.....but I'm wary of all the refractory brick parts. It looks like one log dropped with too much force (it's a top loader) would do damage. This fear re-inforced by the experience of a friend who bought one last year.

For now, I've just patched the fireback with stove cement (like I did last year)

Thanks for coming back and updating. Please do some research before purchasing a new VC stove. They are known to need expensive rebuilds much more often than other secondary tube style stoves.

 

[Tommymc]

Thanks for coming back and updating. Please do some research before purchasing a new VC stove. They are known to need expensive rebuilds much more often than other secondary tube style stoves.

Thanks.....yes, I have done research and am aware of the issues. It's a dilemma for me. Since I live in VT and have had a good run with the old Defiant, I have some (probably misplaced) loyalty to the brand. I also find the VC stoves to be the most aesthetically pleasing. After all, the stove holds a prominent position in the living room. The Defiant is really oversized for our house, so it makes some sense to downsize and upgrade rather than repair the Defiant. I just can't seem to find one (yet) that meets my standards for reliability and beauty...... I'm open to suggestions, though.

 

[claydogg84]

Thanks.....yes, I have done research and am aware of the issues. It's a dilemma for me. Since I live in VT and have had a good run with the old Defiant, I have some (probably misplaced) loyalty to the brand. I also find the VC stoves to be the most aesthetically pleasing. After all, the stove holds a prominent position in the living room. The Defiant is really oversized for our house, so it makes some sense to downsize and upgrade rather than repair the Defiant. I just can't seem to find one (yet) that meets my standards for reliability and beauty...... I'm open to suggestions, though.

I myself switched from the classic Defiant to a new EPA stove. I chose the Jotul Oslo in the Blue/Black enamel, and couldn't be happier. I agree that the VC stoves are easy on the eyes, but the issues that come with them made it a no brainier to not spend my money on one. If you're thinking of just doing a replacement, I'd suggest starting a new thread. There are a ton of guys on here that will be able to recommend stoves much better than me.

 

[Tommymc]

Here's an update on the original post. I procrastinated through last winter and just patched the crack temporarily (again) with stove cement. Probably could have limped through another winter, but decided to go ahead with replacing the lower fireback. I dug out the VC instruction book that came with the rebuild/update kit I installed 20+ years ago, and it clearly states that after installing the "update" kit, all the interior parts can be replaced without disassembling the exterior. Having the instructions and diagrams made a world of difference.

It wasn't exactly a cakewalk, but I did the job yesterday afternoon. The original instruction booklet was for a ground-up rebuild, with a newer one page insert for the "Update". I've uploaded the update sheet. Disassembly is just the reverse. Note that after the update, the fireback(s) are removed by tilting the baffle out of the way. I removed it entirely to allow more room to work. On reassembly, the tricky part is applying the stove cement to the back side of the lower fireback and working blindly on the bottom air channel.

The whole project, including a tube of stove cement cost just under $90.

 

[Tommymc]

Here's the page from the rebuild book which shows how to cement the air channels. If anybody needs the entire rebuild manual, feel free to contact me.

 

[fbelec]

i have to do the change from my defiant 1 to the 2 piece. i understand about changing the left side door but was the baffle different from the original or could the old baffle be used? the kit thru woodmans parts is $550.00

 

[fbelec]

my fireback is in 4 pieces tried the cement when it was just 1 crack and got a month out of the cement. one more question. does the 2 piece fireback have a gasket between the lower and upper fireback?

 

[defiant3]

Generally, even if the baffle is serviceable it's unlikely to mate up with new parts that are perfectly straight so save the headache, go for new baffle and baffle support. also the old baffle is all 1 piece, which doesn't allow future fireback replacement w/o total disassembly.

No gasket or cement between fireback upper and lower.

wahoo, rebuild party time

 

[Tommymc]

also the old baffle is all 1 piece, which doesn't allow future fireback replacement w/o total disassembly.

You'll appreciate the 2-pc baffle the next time you replace the fireback. It allows you to remove all the interior parts without disassembling any of the exterior. Big savings in time. No cement needed between the upper and lower firebacks, but you do need to cement the air channels in the lower fireback to the rear of the stove. See the page from my previous post.