Dirty glass

[WOODNUT358]

I have a Harman XXV pellet stove.The glass seems to get dirty rather quickly.I was wondering if anyone else has this problem,and if there is a fix.I do not have an OAK installed,but I know several others that don;t,and do not have this problem. Thanks!

 

[mralias]

I have a Harman XXV pellet stove.The glass seems to get dirty rather quickly.I was wondering if anyone else has this problem,and if there is a fix.I do not have an OAK installed,but I know several others that don;t,and do not have this problem. Thanks!

First solution to dirty glass is see my signature and follow the directions. All kidding aside, cleaning is key first and formost. I would also look at blocked airwash, door adjustment (gasket replacement time? dollar bill test), air flow increase and/or have you changed the type of pellet you have been burning and then noticed an increase in the dirty glass? Glass will get dirty after a period of burning time. So is it more that this is something new or were you concerned that your stove is the only one that the glass gets dirty?

 

[kinsmanstoves]

How fast does it get dirty, one day, three days, five days?

Lets go over all easy info
1.) Did you read the owners manual?
2.) clean the stove
3.) clean the vent, yes you have to run a brush down it or take it apart.
4.) What is your EVL? If you do not know what an EVL is refer to #1

Eric

 

[WOODNUT358]

First solution to dirty glass is see my signature and follow the directions. All kidding aside, cleaning is key first and formost. I would also look at blocked airwash, door adjustment (gasket replacement time? dollar bill test), air flow increase and/or have you changed the type of pellet you have been burning and then noticed an increase in the dirty glass? Glass will get dirty after a period of burning time. So is it more that this is something new or were you concened that your stove is the only one that the glass gets dirty?

Yes it gets a thorough cleaning weekly.I run a brush through the vent pipe.Clean fines compartment,motors,glass,clean out at tee etc...It doesn't matter what pellets I use,it gets dirty the first day,after I clean it.

 

[mralias]

Yes it gets a thorough cleaning weekly.I run a brush through the vent pipe.Clean fines compartment,motors,glass,clean out at tee etc...It doesn't matter what pellets I use,it gets dirty the first day,after I clean it.

Then I would be thinking about what Eric stated above. What is your EVL? Pics of your venting and glass would be most helpful.

 

[MikeG]

Woodnut, I have a very similar problem with my XXV as well. See my pictures and read my issues here:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/xxv-airwash-reducer.82008/#post-1232529

Once I clean my whole stove (everything), the glass gets these very distinctive streaks on them in a matter of a few minutes after the cleaning is done, and I am also burning very decent pellets too (Turmans), so I doubt it is because of the pellet quality. I also have a friend that has an XXV, and he burns some really cheap pellets, but he can still go about 4 days to a week before seeing soot on his glass. I have done the dollar bill test around the whole door also and the door gaskets seems to be fine with that test, but from the looks of the streaks, it appears like either air is leaking in around the door gasket and might be causing a disturbance with the air flowing out of the airwash therefore concentrating the soot in these areas, or a malfunction in the actual airwash itself. My stove is also practically brand new since it was just installed 4 months ago in October and only 2.5 tons of pellets have been through it. I noticed this problem though from day one.

Besides that though, the stove is running fine. So I plan to deal with it for now and wait out the season until the pellet dealer's technicians are slower, and then I plan to call them to come out and figure this thing out for me before the warrantee runs out.

 

[kinsmanstoves]

Glass should be wiped daily so that is not a warranty issue unless there is component specifically related to that problem and I do not see it.

Eric

 

[CT Pellet]

The XXV is a beautiful stove. But in the XXV, the burn pot sits much closer to the glass than it does in the P61 or P68. If you run your stove on a low setting, with a smaller flame, you will be able to go longer without having to clean the glass. But for those people who runn the XXV "like a boss," their glass will soot up quicker. I crank my XXV...Always have. I have also been burning the "best" wood pellets that money can buy. And I have never, ever been able to keep my glass from sooting up within a day or so. Fortunately for me I don't care.

 

[MikeG]

Thanks Eric. I would agree 100% with you that the glass should be wiped daily, but I find it hard to believe that there would not be a component issue (with either the door gasket, the airwash system, or something else) since these streaks form and are very noticeable after only 20 minutes of use. You can actually faintly see them starting just after 5 minutes of burning after a complete wet wipe down of the glass. If this didn't happen so fast, then I might think it would not be a component issue. Also if everything was working fine, then why would Harman spend money on engineering an airwash system if all it bought you was 5 minutes of clean glass? I know if I was the owner of Harman and my engineers told me that they designed an airwash system that would keep the glass clean for 5 minutes, I would either tell them to go back to the drawing board and get that time increased to hours, or forget it completely and not waste time and money on putting this into production for a measly 5 minutes of clean glass. Not worth it.

 

[kinsmanstoves]

streaks in the airwash after five minutes is an air flow issue. It can be as easy as the air was being blocked at this part or further into the system. It can be as complicated as a lack of air flow into the stove or a blockage in the venting. With something being "broken" in the stove to cause dirty glass I do not know how that could happen.

 

[MikeG]

I agree. I just do not know enough about the airwash system to correctly diagnose this as the issue. But since it has happened from day one, I don't think it would be caused by a soot, pellet debris, or ash blockage, but maybe a mechanical defect by not getting enough air to start with from the outside? I know during the last cleaning I stuffed a pipe cleaner down into all of the airwash holes to try and push out any debris / blockages they might have had in them, but going beyond these 20 or so holes, it is beyond me. But when I fired it back up again, it happened all over. So it is definitely not a blockage in any of these 20+ holes. But maybe it is not getting enough air from the source? Maybe there is a blockage farther down the airwash system of some sort of manufacturing debris? Could be. So I thought I would just deal with it for now, and in the spring / summer, I would give the dealer a call to see if they can stop out and diagnose it.

 

[kinsmanstoves]

I would say no to the MFG debris. The airwash is connected to the combustion blower so if you are not getting a burn issue I would not worry about that. There is a flapper in the feeder assembly that "might" not be opening all the way you can check that by removing the left rear panel and check with a flash light. Is there outside air hooked tot he unit???

Eric

 

[kinsmanstoves]

part 44.4 is the flapper

 

[MikeG]

Yeah, no burn issues at all. Could it be a blockage though between the combustion blower and the 20+ holes at the glass? Or if it was, would I notice a bad burn because of this? Yes, it is connected to an OAK. Would this flapper then be on the opposite side of the feeder assembly from where the fines compartment lid is? I will have to check this out then tonight once I get home.

 

[MikeG]

Perfect thanks!

 

[MikeG]

Yes I know exactly where that flapper is then. I can actually hear it open and close sometimes when I open and close the glass lid on the hopper. I can hear it make a little noise from moving from the suction created in the hopper.

 

[kinsmanstoves]

If you are hearing that I would say it is not blocked. Remember air that goes out of the stove needs to come into the stove. If your house is tightly wrapped it is not flowing like it should so that will cause a dirty burn. If your vent pipe has an extended run (EVL) the flow is being obstructed and this will cause a dirty burn. It can be the installation and not the stove. 95% of stove issues are a dirty stove or a improper installation.

Eric

 

[Mr. Spock]

Friends and I see the same pattern -right side extending over top of glass. I did notice it will darken up a little bit quicker since a damper install to prevent the "woofing" but it takes a good week before it gets so dark you can't see through it. Never seen the center get dirty so I would say the air wash works. Be interesting to hear what the dealer says though.

 

[MikeG]

If you are hearing that I would say it is not blocked. Remember air that goes out of the stove needs to come into the stove. If your house is tightly wrapped it is not flowing like it should so that will cause a dirty burn. If your vent pipe has an extended run (EVL) the flow is being obstructed and this will cause a dirty burn. It can be the installation and not the stove. 95% of stove issues are a dirty stove or a improper installation.

Eric

Thanks Eric. Yeah besides the 2 streaks across the glass, I have not seen any other evidence of a dirty burn going on. The 60% of the rest of the glass stays clean for weeks before I start noticing a slight deposit of soot on it. While the fire is also burning, I have also never noticed any smoke at all inside the burn area, and I have also never visually seen any smoke exiting the exhaust either with the exception of the initial start up for a minute or 2. I have a 3" diameter pipe, that ends up being about a 6' run in total from the stove to the outside screened cap. The house is also not too tightly wrapped either. The stove is also heating our entire 2200 sqft home.

Also, I clean the whole burn area once a week, and I do a total clean of the complete stove and pipe after every ton which includes burn area complete scraping, brushing, and vacuuming, ignitor cover removal and ash cleaned out, ash pan emptied, combustion fan removal and cleaning, distribution fan cleaning, ESP probe removal and cleaning, feed cover removal to clean out fines, leaf blower trick on the pipe, as well as running a brush through the whole pipe as well and then doing the leaf blower trick yet again after the brush has gone through. Pipe is then completely shiney on the inside afterward.

So I am pretty baffled by this. Oh well. I will have the techs come out in the spring / summer, and I will let you know what they ended up doing or not doing about it. Thanks for the input though!

 

[WOODNUT358]

Thank you all for your replies,they were much appreciated.I will look into the flapper issue if there is one when,I do a thorough cleaning,which will be soon.I will also call a dealer near by,to see if there have been any issues they dealt with on this matter.If I should find anything out,I will surely post them here.