Donor Program: Class A and Double Wall Needed

[Corie]

So, does anyone have any of the aforementioned supplies available at low cost or free?

I just got back from the second family to receive a stove in the PA stove donor program. Turns out the chimney she thought we could install the stove into is already being used by the gas furnace and water heater! DoH!

So I have to run a complete class A system and I also have to again use double wall because of clearence issues. Thankfully she has the hearth building supplies already on hand and is going to start building the hearth this weekend, so I can bring her the stove on monday. I have to fabricate heat shields for the Vigilant because it doesn't have any, but I can get Villanova to donate the steel for that.

I'm wondering if anyone has spare class A laying around from a change out, or maybe a scratch and dent type of thing? I would certainly be willing to put up some money for it, if necessary, but I'm not in great financial shape either, being a poor college kid, so once agian I'm reaching out to you guys.

The stove being installed here is the Vigilant that was given to me by Todd (Harley). Craig this family lives in a rowhouse on Malvern Ave in Philly, I'm sure you know the area!

Thanks in advance,

Corie

PS - Due to scheduling issues, the first donor stove is now being installed this Monday! I will have plenty of pictures to follow.

 

[Roospike]

Just curious ..........Wouldn't it be cheaper to re-run the gas furnace and water heater pipes and use the chimney for the stove VS getting all new class A ss pipe ?

I knew some one that had the same issue with a gas hot water heater and a small NG stove up stairs ............it was less than $150. to reroute the NG exhaust pipes VS $800.00 for a stainless steel class A pipes/T/cap/ect..

Just a thought.

 

[Corie]

Hrm. I had not thought of that Roo.

But, rerunning those pipes would mean cutting holes in floors and walls. I don't quite know how I feel about that.

 

[suematteva]

Corie/Craig and other forum contributors,

Is there someway a cash donation fund can be set up?

Due to the wide geographic spread of forum members it might make sense for many to donate some cash vs. supplies and materials...Would be good to have some basic administration guidelines and to provide some oversight..Realize this is starting at the grass roots level but believe it will strengthen what members have started.

 

[Harley]

I just got back from the second family

Don't you ever sleep????? 3:15 AM??


That's a good idea, Vintage.... Corie/anyone..... would something like a paypal type account work for this?

 

[webbie]

Malvern Av!

That's where webwidow is from.....6447!

That's where I used to pull up my ride to and go grab the webwidow - when she was 16! That is where....OH, forget it!

OK, as far as pipe - consider the stuff sent to you recently to be part of my donation. Also, as mentioned do you have a paypal account of some other easy way of taking donations? I'll be glad to take them through my paypal until you get something set up!

I will also forward this post to the marketing guy at Selkirk...who knows?

 

[tutu_sue]

All I have is an elbow strap and two galvanized adj. wall brackets. If you ever need them for the program, let me know. I'll hang on to them.

Yeah, Paypal would work great. Donors could use credit cards or draw directly from a bank account.

 

[Selkirktim]

Corie I believe I can help you out. Please shoot me an email and we'll discuss.

[email protected]

Regards,

Tim

 

[kevinmoelk]

Good to see the manufacturers helping out.

Just out of curiosity, is the donor program set up as a non-profit organization? If not, that may be beneficial to you folks in the long run. Not that I wouldn't be willing to send over a few bucks anyway, but if you were indeed non-profit, that would of course allow me to write off the donation on my taxes. More importantly, it would allow the manufacturers to donate and write off on their taxes.

I'm sure this idea is nothing you fellas haven't thought about, but just thought I'd ask. Let me know when if/when/how to make a donation and I'll be happy to help out the cause.

-Kevin

 

[CountryGal]

I would be happy to donate some $$ for this great program. Pay it forward!!

 

[Harley]

Good point, wrench.

I was thinking about this a little earlier, but then some annoying work got in the way.

For both Elk and Corie and your respective donor programs:

In theory, the cash and/or stove/parts donations to the program COULD be considered (all in all very unlikely) taxable income to you. Its really very unlikey, but if some real good size dollars come rolling in (stoves from manufacturers) there could be a problem. It really all depends on where you think the size of the program may go.

Maybe worth considering setting up a non-profit entity to protect yourselves from this. It's really not that much of a PIA to set up, and the tax returns are pretty easy to do.

PM me if either of you want to go through what would have to be done - I'd be happy to help with the forms, etc.

 

[Corie]

Wow, the responses here are absolutely unbelievable.

First, I do have a paypal account that could receive donations, but as Harley and others have said, perhaps it would be best to set up a non-profit organization for the donor program. I'm hoping the program can continue to grow and with donations from manufacturers like Elk has received and which it looks like I may receive for this installation, it does seem possible. Harley, if you PM me or call me and let me know what the first step towards doing this would be, that would be spectacular.

Craig, Thank you so much for the pipe and money you provided for the hearth construction, along with creating this website. The heating help we are provided for these people would aboslutely not be possible without you! Also, that's way too funny that this is the same road your wife lived on when she was growing up. Diane lives just a few houses down from the house where your wife grew up!

Tim,
I will write you an email in just a few minutes detailing the situation and what we will need, etc. I can't tell you how much I appreciate a big company like Selkirk steeping forward and offering to help with this program. What I at first thought was going to be an impossible installation because of the need for a full class A system is now looking quite feasible and I can't tell you how excited Diane will be when I give her the news!

 

[Harley]

Corie:

I'll start to pull together some of the stuff. I need to do a little more looking into PA requirements (I'm more familiar with MA) - little bit busy at work, but I'll get to it.

 

[Gooserider]

Uhm... Does there need to be several non-profits for the different programs? I'd think that as long as there was just one, you could process all the paperwork through it, regardless of who handled the hardware?

It would seem simpler if there was just one entity.

Gooserider

 

[Harley]

Uhm... Does there need to be several non-profits for the different programs? I'd think that as long as there was just one, you could process all the paperwork through it, regardless of who handled the hardware?

It would seem simpler if there was just one entity.

Gooserider

Funny you should ask, Goose - was just thinking the same thing. It would be fairly easy to do - have to see if there's enough interest to get it going.

 

[suematteva]

Would it be possible to have a button on hearth.com "HEAT A HOME FOUNDATION" where a page or two would describe the program..LIke harley and goose one entity..

have a couple vouluteer members oversee the cash disbursements and who the stoves go to, keep track of volunteers, inventory, who can donate time, wood and whatever else comes along.

 

[webbie]

Corie, due to the relatively small amount of money involved now, if I were you I would take the paypal and other stuff before you attempt to set up a corp. It takes a long time to do so.

If the amounts are very small, I would suggest just forgetting them - not much different than a neighbor lending you or giving you something - you really don't have to declare it. If you do want to declare, the tax consequences would not be big (or anything) because you are not making any profit. In other words, if you - for instance - are thinking of going into stoves as a career - this could be considered the beginning of your business and it is common for business to lose money for the first couple years.

My thought is just don't let paperwork get in your way. Forge ahead with good intentions and I think things will be OK. Most little guys like me that contribute product - well, that's just my cost of goods. As a business I am allowed to have goods which I sell at any price I want (even for a penny) - and then selfishly consider all the free promo I am getting.

My guess is also that your present income is not very high - so it is doubtful any tax would be due anyway.

So, my advice is "Damn the Torpedos".....

 

[Gooserider]

In the short term I'd agree Craig. There are a lot of hassles and bookkeeping headaches involved in setting up a non-profit, especially if trying to get 501c* status, which is what you need to be tax deductible.

Long term though, I think that if folks are serious about the donor program it is something that should be looked into. It packs a lot more credibility with potential donors if you have the tax structure set up as it shows legitimacy as opposed to a few guys trying to scam free stoves for their buddies...

In terms of the free advertising, you can tell your customers about it, and maybe put a blurb here, but that's about as much as you'd want. OTOH someone like VC might want to mention it in their annual reports, and possibly in their other advertising and that almost requires the recipient to be a 501c*

It might not matter much to small scale folks like us, but it can make a big difference to potential big time donors like VC that have to justify such things to upper management and stockholders - not to mention the gov't types. Right now, a stove maker (VC, New Englander, or ???) has nothing to show for a donation but a stove going out the door that they didn't get paid for. They need to justify that to the management, the stockholders and the IRS. W/ non-profit status, they get a tax deduction, so they have at least some return on the cost of the stove, plus a lot easier time explaining it to everyone as a charitable donation.

I suspect that getting a non-profit setup would make a big difference between the current status of a tiny handful of stoves and being able to do a larger number.

Gooserider

 

[webbie]

I hear ya! But you know the old story - once something becomes official, then it often gets ruined! A real org is likely to be more than anyone can handle - because sooner or later Corie will get a job in the industry and that may be that.

Although I do know some orgs that actually work, my general experience is that helping people on a one to one basis gets more done for the dollar spent.

When it comes to a serious program, there is a need....but it would take someone - or someone along with a Board of Directors - to clarify the vision and come up with the grand plan.

 

[BrotherBart]

I am reminded of the late Bill McGowan that built MCI and took on the Bell monopoly. He is said to have told assembled new employees that he knew some of the with their business school educations were already making org charts and thinking up policies. He said that he would hunt down every one of them that was and fire them.

 

[Gooserider]

Craig, I agree with both you and BB about the problems of doing a formal organization. Believe me, I agree that one on one charity is better and that I don't like the notion of the big operations trying to run things. However the reality is that the effect of our gov'ts regulations is to make private charity very difficult, especially when trying to deal with corporate level donors.

The only solution that I know of is to try to set something up that would be a minimal structure to get all the Hearth.com projects done through in terms of paperwork. (whether it's Corie or Elk or someone else doing the grunt work) It wouldn't be perfect, but it would be something.

Gooserider

 

[kevinmoelk]

Is there some other organization that Corie and Elk can "latch on to" just to receive the non-profit status? A church maybe? In that sense they wouldn't have to go through all the hassle, and manufacturers could still donate and get their refund. The church would simply be a supporting sponsor. Just an idea.

-Kevin