Fireview in a cold climate?

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snowleopard

Minister of Fire
Dec 9, 2009
1,495
So hello, and no rudeness intended if this is seen as a dram-o-rama intro, but aaaaack! Just put a deposit down Monday morning on a Fireview after months of shopping and thinking and perseverating and functioning under the assumption/delusion that most people want to talk about woodstoves and now . . . [breathes into paperbag, puts head between knees] . . . am second-guessing this decision after reading a thread wherein a resident of Sterling, AK (a.k.a. the banana belt of AK) was advised not to get a Fireview. So jokes aside, I am a single parent homeowner in an unforgiving climate, and feel the responsibility to get things right the first time.

Locale: Fairbanks, so -30, -40 for sometimes extended periods is pretty much a given most winters, -50 noteworthy but not exceptional. Not the coldest part of the state, but cold enough for the likes of me. (How cold is -50? Best way I know to explain is that -50 makes -20 seem pretty mild.)

My house: 2000sf, two-story, bottom story is earth sheltered to the north and half the east-west sides, 8' ceilings throughout except in staircase, one semi-open staircase on the north side. Mid-eighties super-insulated, ducted (4" joe-homeowner) for an HRV that was never installed (looking at an Eko 1.5, but yeah). Tight. When I run the kitchen fan, I can hear the motor pitch change if I open the door. Many large windows to the south functioning very effectively as dehumidifiers when it gets to -25 or colder. System 2000 in detached garage. Infloor heating downstairs, very comfortably warm; not-enough baseboard upstairs, too cool when it's -30, cold when it's -50 (run electric heaters for supplementary heat). Open floorplan downstairs, not so much so upstairs. Kitchen-diningroom-sunroom-livingroom downstairs, bedroom-baths-familyroom-laundry upstairs, so we occupy both stories all day long when we're home. Sunroom is long and narrow, runs 2/3 length of house, floor is a good heatsink, ceiling fan distributes heat somewhat. Fuel use for house & garage average between 815-840 gpy over the last couple of decades (I've only been in it for two years, but have records). It's mostly finished, which is kind of unusual, country house, vaguely Craftsman in style, lots of hand-crafted wood trim, deep windows, etc. Plumbing all on inside walls, drain-able in the event of emergency or extended trips to Hawaii in mid-winter.

Family: single parent, two teenagers, one dog. Teenagers take many showers, forget to leave fans on, etc. One has promised to help with firewood if I get a woodstove. The other wants to move someplace warm. We are all on the run a lot--school, work, activities, except dog who just hangs out most of the time. Lots of houseplants in the sunroom (aka the hyperbaric chamber), so more moisture from them.

Lived w/a variety of woodstoves: my favorite was a wood cookstove, least favorite was a tin-walled Ashley with a funky thermostat. Lived w/barrel stoves, cast-iron, steel, wanted a soapstone from the first time I saw one, but never lived with one. Want a woodstove as a secondary-that-can-be-primary heat source for the just-in-case independence, bun-toasting ambiance, hopefully cut down on fuel use, cleaning up my property which has a couple of cords of cut, stacked wood, a lot of trees down that still have burnable parts, and a lot of standing deadwood on it (mostly poplar, alack). Also hoping it will dry out the house a bit when the weather gets cold. Work an office job, have summers off, have an old pickup and I'm not afraid to use her, so I would plan on gathering my own wood rather than buying. No chainsaw at this time, but watching for one. My strategy is to let other people drop the big trees and take the trunks in the public woodcutting areas, and I come along behind and glean all the limbs they leave behind.

So did my homework on a lot of stoves, thoughtfully considered Blaze King, but something about the looks just didn't suit. Liked the Oakwood, but the 77" hearth was going to eat more of the corner of my dining room than I wanted to dedicate. Almost went locally w/the Hearthstone dealer, just because they are local and really good people to do business with, but the construction of the Woodstock seemed to be better, liked the cat (although I respect arguments to the contrary), liked that the surface allegedly gets hot enough for cooking, and that it burns cleaner than most. Still a few lingering doubts about whether this is going to be adequate. No stovepipe/hearth in, planning an install. Going to place the stove about central to the house, downstairs in the dining room, across the room from the stairs. Semi-open to kitchen, double-doors into sunroom, open to downstairs livingroom. Hoping to get the upstairs warmer, and use an Eko to get air circulating (one of the ducts for the HRV that isn't runs into dining room ceiling about 3' from where the stove will be located.

That's about it, and it's time to get the kids up for school anyway. Any thoughts on the adequacy of the Fireview for this application? I appreciate the input.
 
We have a drafty 2100 sq ft colonial In North of Boston, MA and use a Fireview. Its really not big enough for house when it gets much below 30 degrees F. I wanted a Blazeking but my wife does not like the looks. So I burn it as hard as I can
and supplement with furnace. I'm gonna try replacing windows next year - hope this helps.
 
Will the stove heat 100% of the house 100% of the time, probably not. But it will heat the whole house a lot of the time. During those ungodly cold weeks it may need some supplement from the oil heat, but that is ok. It will still provide a nice warm area in the house. Not too bad considering the arctic conditions.

From the tight house description, it sounds like an OAK will be required, probably with a snorkel.
 
Welcome to the forum. I know WS rates their Fireview for only 1600 sq ft, but I think that is pretty conservative. I know people that are heating a little over 2000 sq ft but none of them have the extreme winter temp you have. I think if your house is as tight as you say and you install the stove centrally it will heat your home most of the time but may need some help when you hit those very cold temps. A good thing about Woodstock is they stand behind their product and if it doesn't work out you can send it back for a full refund.
 
Thank you, all, for replies.

fire_man, I get what your wife was thinking. Blaze King is not exactly a girly stove; even the one called Princess clearly does not shave her legs, wears combat boots, and arm-wrestles for beer in dive bars. Would you know what it takes to heat your house when you're not using wood? I realize the fuel oil thing doesn't translate very well because of the length of our heating season; 800 gallons probably sounds like a lot, but is actually about half of what is typical for this climate for house this size.

BeGreen, thank you. As I think you deduced, I am not aiming for 100%-100%--but 60-60 would be a delight. Snorkel won't work because there's a sunroom between the dining room and the nearest fresh air, and OAK is *not* advised w/cats at extreme cold temps because you don't want to be cooling down the firebox that much--so I'm told. Local stove shop man (in business 25+ years or so) recommends getting fresh air in the general vicinity, and letting vacuum pressure take care of the rest. So I'm looking at finding a way to make the hole for the kitchen fan (running a six-inch duct, go figure) flap both ways. It would then vent from the center of the kitchen ceiling, which would be about 10' from the stove location, and there is a BIG pass-through window between dining-room and kitchen right to the side of where the back of the stove will be. I was thinking that having the fresh air suck in at that level would help minimize stack effect.

Thank you, Todd, for the welcome. I've visited the reviews on hearth.com for years, just discovered the forums a few days ago--too soon old, too late smart. I am planning on keeping the boiler running, as it heats my hot water and my garage as well as house. If I could reduce my fuel use by half I'll be thrilled, and then there's just the peace of mind that comes w/knowing that we can get by if we have to w/o electricity or fuel oil. Two learning experiences:
*Winter came here one year in early September, heavy snow when the birches were still fully leafed out. The resulting power failure left a lot of people without electricity for a month, temperatures dropped, houses froze up. A very strange winter--kept expecting it to melt off, and it didn't until spring.
*Heating fuel hit $4 a gallon last year, and thieves were hitting people's fuel tanks regularly. I'd call them pond scum, but that seems like an insult to algae.
That 6-month money back definitely put a thumb on the scale for me--I didn't see anyone else standing behind their product like that. Thanks for that reminder about that aspect of the decision. It's not the kind of thing you take back if it makes your butt look fat, but at that price, it's good to know it's an option.
Even if this doesn't turn out to be *the* stove I need, I can get through the winter, and be set up w/hearth, stovepipe, and a little more wisdom for my next purchase. Who knows? Princess might start looking a whole lot purtier come February. [Folds paperbag, puts in safe place.] Feeling better. My bedroom's the coldest in the house, and if I get too chilly on the super-cold nights, I can always camp out in front of the fire. The rest we can figure out as we go along. Now I can amble off and figure out what I'm going to do about what my daughter described as a "big oopsie" regarding the garage door. jaysus mary and all the saints it never ends . . .
 
Do you already have your wood supply on hand? Catalytic stoves especially require dry wood to operate properly. If you don't have a year's worth of wood on hand already, then you'll have a pretty stove that you can only look at, unfortunately.
 
[quote author="snowleopard" date="1260449305"]Thank you, all, for replies.

fire_man, I get what your wife was thinking. Blaze King is not exactly a girly stove; even the one called Princess clearly does not shave her legs, wears combat boots, and arm-wrestles for beer in dive bars. Would you know what it takes to heat your house when you're not using wood? I realize the fuel oil thing doesn't translate very well because of the length of our heating season; 800 gallons probably sounds like a lot, but is actually about half of what is typical for this climate for house this size.
It takes about 900 gallons of home heating oil (with no wood usage) to heat my drafty 2100 square foot Colonial in a typical Boston Winter. We got that down to about 150-200 gallons with the Fireview, but the house was much colder. I think my wife would rather be cold than deal with the looks of a Blazeking. I just can't figure that one out.
 
I think you may want to change the title of this thread to "Blaze King in a cold Climate?" If you need to heat your home in the cold get the King stove. It has dropped below 0 for the first time this year and my Princess insert has kept my house at 69 degrees all night in the living room running on a low setting.

Come on you drive a pickup truck not a Lexus. Good luck on staying warm.
 
Welcome to the forum snowleopard.

Glad to hear you are looking at wood heat. It does sound like the Fireview will work for you but much depends upon your fuel supply. You state, "My strategy is to let other people drop the big trees and take the trunks in the public woodcutting areas, and I come along behind and glean all the limbs they leave behind." I'm not so sure that is a good strategy but it depends upon the size of those limbs. You definitely need wood that requires a chain saw to cut through. If you only get little stuff, you will need much more than if you had splits and it will take a lot longer to gather, so more work and less time for other things. Also, the wood really should be in a stack for a year or more. I always recommend a 2-3 year supply on hand as the ideal.

Again, you stated, "Lived w/a variety of woodstoves: my favorite was a wood cookstove, least favorite was a tin-walled Ashley with a funky thermostat." Our last stove was one of those big Ashley stoves! So how does the Fireview compare to the Ashley? Easy answer; there is hardly any comparison. Since installing the Fireview we burn only half the amount of wood we used to and we stay a whole lot warmer.

I hope this helps just a little. As you stated, one very nice thing about Woodstock is their guarantee. You will not find that guarantee anywhere else. They make a high quality product and will work with you to see that you are satisfied.
 
Thanks for the replies and the welcome.

I inherited stacks of cut wood (some split) w/the house when I bought it--probably about two cords at least. I assumed it was rotted out, but checked it out and the first couple of courses on top are in pretty bad shape, but to my surprise, the stuff underneath looks/feels decent. There is also a lot of stuff that has been dropped but not cut to length, some of which is useful. More standing dead (dry dead) as well as wet-dead. So if I can get a saw in here before I get much snow, I think I've got enough right here to help a lot with the rest of this winter and into next. Figuring things out from there.

What I've seen happen a lot in the public woodcutting lands is that people *love* to drop trees. Something about the noise, or fuss, or yelling "Timber!". They then cut up the trunk and lop off limbs that are 6"-8"-10" in diameter and leave them laying while they lug the big stuff back to their trucks, take it home, split it, and stack it. There's a lot of heat in what they leave laying around.
 
800 gallons sounds excellent for your climate. Next week I'll be moving into a small cape that uses 700 gallons/yr. in NY. I'll be working on knocking that down quite a bit, but put in perspective, your house is pretty efficient!

Matt
 
BeGreen said:
Will the stove heat 100% of the house 100% of the time, probably not. But it will heat the whole house a lot of the time. During those ungodly cold weeks it may need some supplement from the oil heat, but that is ok. It will still provide a nice warm area in the house. Not too bad considering the arctic conditions.

That description is me. I heat much of the house, most of the time. If I ran the stove better, with better wood, with never letting it run out, I bet I could get close to 100% for 24/7. Below zero would be a challenge. 5 degrees windchill right now and she is hummin like a 'souped up' NASCAR on a full load of oak and maple, with some splitter trash. My goal for this year is to never lose the retained heat in the walls. Stove room at 75*, Kitchen at 72* and the bedrooms at 65* for night night.

Never let it go out til it hit 50*, is my vow.
 
Lanning said:
I think you may want to change the title of this thread to "Blaze King in a cold Climate?" If you need to heat your home in the cold get the King stove. It has dropped below 0 for the first time this year and my Princess insert has kept my house at 69 degrees all night in the living room running on a low setting.

Come on you drive a pickup truck not a Lexus. Good luck on staying warm.

Ah, but I didn't explain~it's a 1981 Toyota, red: a girly truck. Thanks for the well wishes for keeping warm, and please accept mine in return. Shopping now for a nice delicate chain saw. Husqvarna: orange is the new pink . . . what can you say about a company that makes sewing machines *and* chain saws?
 
EatenByLimestone said:
800 gallons sounds excellent for your climate. Next week I'll be moving into a small cape that uses 700 gallons/yr. in NY. I'll be working on knocking that down quite a bit, but put in perspective, your house is pretty efficient!

Matt

Thank you for this info--that helps put things into perspective. How big is your small cape? Buying or renting?

Last winter when it hit the `ungodly cold weeks' (yes) I spent part of the afternoon puttering in my sunroom, enjoying the blue sky and sunshine without, and the greenery within. After the sun passed the yardarm, I decided to make a grocery run. Went out of the hills and down into town, and descended into the darkness where the air thick and dark with this weird purple-black ice-fog that builds up during temperature inversions. Cars with headlights on that barely pierced the darkness in time to be seen. Found people in the grocery store wandering dazed in the produce section with a 40-mile stares on their faces. Bumped into a friend who was buying things to make bread, as her house was cold and her furnace wasn't keeping up. Her house is very small, and her fuel consumption about 1000 gpy. Invited her up to my house to enjoy some sunshine. Made me very aware of how fortunate I am. Getting the woodstove here, and installed, will put me over the moon.
 
Sounds like the EPA needs to visit Fairbanks with an equal opportunity burn ban. %-P

Getting the woodstove here, and installed, will put me over the moon.

Getting anything to Fairbanks is a minor miracle. I'm sure you will appreciate and enjoy the stove more than most.
 
Some where I saw a listing of several wood stove specifications, btu's, burn times, catalytic, non catalytic, pipe size etc.
searched but can't remember where I saw it.
Had blaze king, vermont, soapstone & others.
I was a good comparison on the stoves,


Maybe someone here nows where to find it. ???
 
BeGreen said:
Sounds like the EPA needs to visit Fairbanks with an equal opportunity burn ban. %-P


Oh, you missed the party! We had a big run a few years back on people purchasing those big `outdoor boilers' for $5-6K, and then the neighbors rising up in arms and trying to get an ordinance passed against them. Local politics--when you just can't sack and pillage anymore . . . The rest of it is mostly vehicles and heating buildings, increased in quantity because many people idle their cars and trucks for an hour or more while shopping, etc., and the increased need for heat, etc. Trap it all in w/an inversion, and you have a real stewpot.

Getting anything to Fairbanks is a minor miracle. I'm sure you will appreciate and enjoy the stove more than most.
I've wanted soapstone for years; very excited. I'm just hoping the stove comes out as pretty as the pix, and works as well as they claim. Trying not to think at the moment about just how much of a miracle this is going to take to get it delivered, installed, operating. I'm sure you'll be seeing me around the forum regularly . . .


bogydave said:
Some where I saw a listing of several wood stove specifications, btu's, burn times, catalytic, non catalytic, pipe size etc.
searched but can't remember where I saw it.
Had blaze king, vermont, soapstone & others.
I was a good comparison on the stoves,


Maybe someone here nows where to find it. ???

Is this what you mean? http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/wscompha.htm
 
snowleopard said:
Thank you, all, for replies.

I realize the fuel oil thing doesn't translate very well because of the length of our heating season; 800 gallons probably sounds like a lot, but is actually about half of what is typical for this climate for house this size.

I'm impressed by your insulation. When I bought my 1960s split level, 2300 sqft, walking distance to the Mason-Dixon line, it pulled ~1100 gallons/year of oil just for space heating.

I think the oil usage is the perfect gauge for your question--as the master says, a BTU is a BTU. If there is someone here with the Fireview, previously burning 800 gallons, and now offsetting most of that comfortably (i.e. not burning too hard) then that will be your proof that everything is aok. In fact, because of your longer season, your max daily heating demand might be lower than someone in the 48 who also burns 800 gals....

Anyone out there heating a whole house that previously pulled 500-600 gals/year, with a FireView? How hard do you have to burn it?

I think you made the right choice, and you'll be fine if your wood is ok.
 
snowleopard said:
EatenByLimestone said:
800 gallons sounds excellent for your climate. Next week I'll be moving into a small cape that uses 700 gallons/yr. in NY. I'll be working on knocking that down quite a bit, but put in perspective, your house is pretty efficient!

Matt

Thank you for this info--that helps put things into perspective. How big is your small cape? Buying or renting?

Last winter when it hit the `ungodly cold weeks' (yes) I spent part of the afternoon puttering in my sunroom, enjoying the blue sky and sunshine without, and the greenery within. After the sun passed the yardarm, I decided to make a grocery run. Went out of the hills and down into town, and descended into the darkness where the air thick and dark with this weird purple-black ice-fog that builds up during temperature inversions. Cars with headlights on that barely pierced the darkness in time to be seen. Found people in the grocery store wandering dazed in the produce section with a 40-mile stares on their faces. Bumped into a friend who was buying things to make bread, as her house was cold and her furnace wasn't keeping up. Her house is very small, and her fuel consumption about 1000 gpy. Invited her up to my house to enjoy some sunshine. Made me very aware of how fortunate I am. Getting the woodstove here, and installed, will put me over the moon.

The cape is your typical post war cape. About 1000sf downstairs. The upstairs has not been finished off yet. I'll be taking care of that when the time comes. It's mine. I'll be putting my current house on the market after some paint, etc.
 
woodgeek said:
.

I'm impressed by your insulation. When I bought my 1960s split level, 2300 sqft, walking distance to the Mason-Dixon line, it pulled ~1100 gallons/year of oil just for space heating.

I think the oil usage is the perfect gauge for your question--as the master says, a BTU is a BTU. If there is someone here with the Fireview, previously burning 800 gallons, and now offsetting most of that comfortably (i.e. not burning too hard) then that will be your proof that everything is aok. In fact, because of your longer season, your max daily heating demand might be lower than someone in the 48 who also burns 800 gals....

Anyone out there heating a whole house that previously pulled 500-600 gals/year, with a FireView? How hard do you have to burn it?

I think you made the right choice, and you'll be fine if your wood is ok.

Okay, perfect works for me, and your optimism on my behalf does as well. I've been very surprised to hear that houses down there can have comparable appetites for fuel. Interesting reformulation of question; I didn't think of it that way, and I hope to hear from people who have this info. Thank you.


Sen. John Blutarsky said:
That description is me. . . . she is hummin like a 'souped up' NASCAR on a full load of oak and maple, with some splitter trash. My goal for this year is to never lose the retained heat in the walls. . . .

Better wood than oak and maple? I already have a celebrity crush on your woodpile . . . spruce is the firestarter fuel here, and birch gives you the burn times, but I'll be cleaning up mostly poplar for the rest of this winter. You use *hardwood*? for burning? [leans over velvet ropes and sighs in awe as the maple casually strolls from limo to firebox]

Retained heat, I get that. Coziest houses I know are well-heated log cabins. Not because the logs have particularly high R-values, but because the logs are such lovely heat sinks. How circuitous is the route from the stove to the bedrooms in your house?

Sláinte Mhath
 
I'm heating somewhere between 2200 and 2400 sqft here in eastern MA. I think I must have above average insulation for the area - plus we haven't kept our house as warm as some folks I know. My oil burn prior to wood heating was in the 600 gallon range for heating.

Although this is my first year with the Fireview and it is still rather early to draw conclusions I believe I'll be able to offset 95% or more of that burn this year - perhaps even close to all of it (exception being times when we are out of town naturally).

We're in our first real cold spell - cold of course being a VERY relative term eh? I've been burning 24/7 for a week now and have not had the backup heat kick in. We're warmer on average than we were before although heat distribution is not as even as with the forced hot air. I've not yet really started pushing the stove either - running stove top temps around 400 which leaves quite a bit of room to pump out heat when it gets colder. At the moment we hit 20f last night and high is 30f - our January (coldest month) the normal expected range is to have lows perhaps near single digits and highs around 30 on average. Thus I expect I will be able to handle those temperatures. Time will tell.

I'm burning harwoods of various types. All well seasoned although it was scrounged from so many sources this spring that I have found a couple pieces in there that are less dry. I expect that with my wood I can burn through about a cord a month quite comfortably getting good heat out and not pushing the stove - i.e. loading 3-4 good loads a day and letting them cycle through the burn cycle to coals.
 
I had a fireview in my last home and it did fine.
But.... It was a strawbale home (cozy warm super insulated).
The coldest it ever got was -18C but a dampish cold.
Rancher style home around 1800 square feet.

I would go with a Blazeking. Seems to be popular with the Alaska/NWT folks.

Way longer burn times. I was hard pressed to get an overnight burn on that stove.
 
So I schlepped out to the woodpile in the last of the daylight, and checked out the woodpiles left behind by prior owner. Wood's in pretty good shape, alas, though, cut to length at 18", give or take. drats. does this mean I need to trim it all down, or is there some flexibility w/that 16" spec?

Thanks again for all the posts. Too late for the Blaze King, but thank you for your input. I will be watching that stove and switching out if it's not what I need. Makes sense to start with the one that offers a six-month trial run. I'm a great fan of strawbale houses, and would like to build one someday. Bucket list.
 
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