flame size and temp concern

[Shane and Jessica]

We keep the stove on room temp mode, the guy that installed it said to keep the feed rate at 4 and we set the thermostat to 59-60. It keeps the room about 62-64. We are going through about 2 bags a day keeping it this low and also there seems to always be a huge flame! I’m talking huge! Attacking the glass and going up as high as it can go in the box. Is this normal!? To us it just doesn’t seem normal but we have never had a pellet stove, so we do not know. And about the thermostat being so low and burning through so many pellets, is is correct to assume that if we tried to keep it at 67 in there we would burn through even more pellets??

 

[briansol]

Doesn't sound right. Sounds like you don't have enough air.

 

[mralias]

Welcome. Put your stove type in your signature so we know what stove you have. Generally speaking the flame should be 4 to 6 inches out of the burn pot with no black tails. It should be bright and not lazy but active.

 

[Shane and Jessica]

Welcome. Put your stove type in your signature so we know what stove you have. Generally speaking the flame should be 4 to 6 inches out of the burn pot with no black tails. It should be bright and not lazy but active.

Harman P68

 

[CT Pellet]

Shane,....Is your flame constantly"Super-Sized" or is it intermittent? I know that when the Harman starts up initially, the flame will look huge, and every so often, as pellets feed, it will increase and then decrease in size. It is tough to see without being there, but if your application is greater than what the stove is capable of doing, then it will eat up pellets like a boss! Understand that your stove is one of the bigger stoves on the market, so unless you are trying to heat 3000 squear feet of poorly insulated construction, I can't imagine that this is the case. Tell us about your house and snap some pics of the stove and the flames. We'll get this figured out for you. And change your font to something easier on the eyes...You're giving me vertigo over here

 

[MikeG]

From the sounds of this, with a P68 and flames the size you are talking about (as long as they are active, sharp tip flames), it should be 80+ degrees in your stove room as long as you do not have a lazy or dirty flame and the flame continues to always be that high and doesn't ramp down when you are not in the room. It almost sounds to me like your stove might be stuck in "Fireplace" mode which is where you can see a large flame for aesthetic purposes, but little heat is produced into the room because the distribution blower is turned off. So like if you had company over at your house for a get together and really wanted to display a nice size fire for them but didn't want to roast them out, this is what you would set your stove to run at. So is the distribution blower working? Can you feel a good amount of hot air being blown out of the top front of the stove into the room? If not, then it sounds like the distribution blower is either not working correctly, is stuck in "fireplace mode", or maybe the quality of pellets you are burning really do not have a good BTU output. But a P68 should be cranking out the heat no matter what the temperature is outside and I bet you could burn the lowest quality pellets and still get the stove room to be at least 70.



I know in my Harman manual, to get the stove in fireplace mode, you have to set the dial to stove temp mode, have the temperature dial set below 3 (which would also be in the 63 to 64 degree mark on the knob), and have the toggle switch set to manual. So I would double check those 3 settings to see if maybe this might be where it is currently set. I know you said you have it set in room temp mode, but maybe you have either mistaken, someone else other then you changed it since you last check it, or maybe the stove is malfunctioning, or perhaps whoever assembled the stove at the factory accidentally mounted the stove temp / room temp control knob upside down which would make the stove temp mode on the bottom and room temp mode on the top?? If this knob was accidentally mounted up side down, then your off selection would be at the 9:00 O' clock position instead of the 3:00 O' clock position. Check those few things out and let us know what you find.

Attached is the particular page out of the Harman Manual talking about the fireplace mode settings:

 

[Harman Lover 007]

From the sounds of this, with a P68 and flames the size you are talking about (as long as they are active, sharp tip flames), it should be 80+ degrees in your stove room as long as you do not have a lazy or dirty flame and the flame continues to always be that high and doesn't ramp down when you are not in the room. It almost sounds to me like your stove might be stuck in "Fireplace" mode which is where you can see a large flame for aesthetic purposes, but little heat is produced into the room because the distribution blower is turned off. So like if you had company over at your house for a get together and really wanted to display a nice size fire for them but didn't want to roast them out, this is what you would set your stove to run at. So is the distribution blower working? Can you feel a good amount of hot air being blown out of the top front of the stove into the room? If not, then it sounds like the distribution blower is either not working correctly, is stuck in "fireplace mode", or maybe the quality of pellets you are burning really do not have a good BTU output. But a P68 should be cranking out the heat no matter what the temperature is outside and I bet you could burn the lowest quality pellets and still get the stove room to be at least 70.



I know in my Harman manual, to get the stove in fireplace mode, you have to set the dial to stove temp mode, have the temperature dial set below 3 (which would also be in the 63 to 64 degree mark on the knob), and have the toggle switch set to manual. So I would double check those 3 settings to see if maybe this might be where it is currently set. I know you said you have it set in room temp mode, but maybe you have either mistaken, someone else other then you changed it since you last check it, or maybe the stove is malfunctioning, or perhaps whoever assembled the stove at the factory accidentally mounted the stove temp / room temp control knob upside down which would make the stove temp mode on the bottom and room temp mode on the top?? If this knob was accidentally mounted up side down, then your off selection would be at the 9:00 O' clock position instead of the 3:00 O' clock position. Check those few things out and let us know what you find.

Attached is the particular page out of the Harman Manual talking about the fireplace mode settings:



View attachment 90708

How old is that illustration of the CB? My P61A is set up exactly the way you describe as "wrong" or "upside down". RT on top, ST on bottom and off is at 9 o'clock. My Temp dial doesn't look like that either.....

Here is the complete manual for a P68, go to page 17...
(broken link removed to http://hearthnhome.com/downloads/installManuals/P68.pdf)

 

[MikeG]

From reading this Harman page over again, it also looks like you could get your stove into fireplace mode in the room temperature mode as well as stove temperature mode, just as long as your temperature dial is set to either 3 or below, and the toggle switch is set to manual. If I were you, I would set it on room temp high, toggle switch to manual, and turn your temperature dial up to 72 degrees and leave it there for about 3-4 hours and see if the room heats up to 72, and then if the flames start to ramp back down to a smaller height once the ideal room temperature of 72 is achieved.

So after reading this in the manual again, I am almost 100% convinced that your stove is running in fireplace mode (since your temperature dial is so low and below the #3 setting), and it will keep producing large flames with little output until your temperature dial is increased or the toggle switch is changed over to auto.

But if for some odd reason you do not want your room temperature to be higher then 62 or 64, then I would just keep the temperature dial set to where you currently have it, and just flip your toggle switch over to auto to take it out of fireplace mode. Then the flames will get significantly smaller. Might even shut off for a little while until the room cools down below 62, then it will start back up again until it gets the room back to 62 or 64.

 

[Shane and Jessica]

Thanks everyone for all of your input. i am going to look into this tonight and take some pics.

 

[Shane and Jessica]

From the sounds of this, with a P68 and flames the size you are talking about (as long as they are active, sharp tip flames), it should be 80+ degrees in your stove room as long as you do not have a lazy or dirty flame and the flame continues to always be that high and doesn't ramp down when you are not in the room. It almost sounds to me like your stove might be stuck in "Fireplace" mode which is where you can see a large flame for aesthetic purposes, but little heat is produced into the room because the distribution blower is turned off. So like if you had company over at your house for a get together and really wanted to display a nice size fire for them but didn't want to roast them out, this is what you would set your stove to run at. So is the distribution blower working? Can you feel a good amount of hot air being blown out of the top front of the stove into the room? If not, then it sounds like the distribution blower is either not working correctly, is stuck in "fireplace mode", or maybe the quality of pellets you are burning really do not have a good BTU output. But a P68 should be cranking out the heat no matter what the temperature is outside and I bet you could burn the lowest quality pellets and still get the stove room to be at least 70.



I know in my Harman manual, to get the stove in fireplace mode, you have to set the dial to stove temp mode, have the temperature dial set below 3 (which would also be in the 63 to 64 degree mark on the knob), and have the toggle switch set to manual. So I would double check those 3 settings to see if maybe this might be where it is currently set. I know you said you have it set in room temp mode, but maybe you have either mistaken, someone else other then you changed it since you last check it, or maybe the stove is malfunctioning, or perhaps whoever assembled the stove at the factory accidentally mounted the stove temp / room temp control knob upside down which would make the stove temp mode on the bottom and room temp mode on the top?? If this knob was accidentally mounted up side down, then your off selection would be at the 9:00 O' clock position instead of the 3:00 O' clock position. Check those few things out and let us know what you find.

Attached is the particular page out of the Harman Manual talking about the fireplace mode settings:



View attachment 90708

as someone else said, this diagram is not the same as my stove. i do have a manual with the diagrams in it and i have read through it completely. it just never mentioned anything about flame size. and the diagrams are def opposite of what you have showed me. thanks for all of your input and i will be taking some pics. the flame does go down sometime, but last night was -10 degrees out so maybe the thing was just working in full-force mode!

 

[MikeG]

How old is that illustration of the CB? My P61A is set up exactly the way you describe as "wrong" or "upside down". RT on top, ST on bottom and off is at 9 o'clock. My Temp dial doesn't look like that either.....

Here is the complete manual for a P68, go to page 17...
(broken link removed to http://hearthnhome.com/downloads/installManuals/P68.pdf)

This illustration was taken off of Harman's web site today, which is for the current production XXV which is the model I have. My actual hard copy manual though is identical to this and also matches the stove's controls to a "T". My XXV though is also only 4 months old. Maybe the P61A is set up differently? Or maybe the year you have has since been changed? I will have to go back onto Harman's web site right now and look at the current manual for the P61A to see if it is different then the one I posted.

 

[CT Pellet]

the flame does go down sometime, but last night was -10 degrees out so maybe the thing was just working in full-force mode! ​

That is very telling right there...Most pellet stoves under these conditions, are going to work hard.

 

[MikeG]

Yeah, no problem Shane / Jessica. Even though your control panel might look different then the attached picture or is set up differently, the settings should all still be the same for fireplace mode as per the numbers and modes. Take a look at your manual tonight and find the section where it talks about a large viewing fire with little heat output. Then figure out if the settings your stove is currently set on matches this description. Then if it does, just change it to get it out of this fireplace mode and you should get a lot more heat, a lot lower flame height after a while, and use up a lot less pellets.

 

[Harman Lover 007]

This illustration was taken off of Harman's web site today, which is for the current production XXV which is the model I have. My actual hard copy manual though is identical to this and also matches the stove's controls to a "T". My XXV though is also only 4 months old. Maybe the P61A is set up differently? Or maybe the year you have has since been changed? I will have to go back onto Harman's web site right now and look at the current manual for the P61A to see if it is different then the one I posted.

I already posted the P68 manual for them. The P68 CB is the same as my P61A. I just didn't want them to be confused by the XXV control board pic!!

 

[MikeG]

I already posted the P68 manual for them. The P68 CB is the same as my P61A. I just didn't want them to be confused by the XXV control board pic!!

Gotcha. No problem. Understand completely.

 

[MikeG]

as someone else said, this diagram is not the same as my stove. i do have a manual with the diagrams in it and i have read through it completely. it just never mentioned anything about flame size. and the diagrams are def opposite of what you have showed me. thanks for all of your input and i will be taking some pics. the flame does go down sometime, but last night was -10 degrees out so maybe the thing was just working in full-force mode!

Shane and Jessica,

Harman Lover 007 posted the link to the P68 manual. From that, I found and I attached the page in the manual that deals with the stove being set in "fireplace" mode. See bellow.



According to your manual here, your stove would be in fireplace mode if the temperature setting is set anywhere at or bellow a #4 (70 degree mark), the toggle switch is set to manual, and the control knob is in the stove temperature mode. So to get it out of this mode so you can have a lower flame height, have more heat output, and use a lot less pellets, you can either increase the temperature knob above a #4 (70 degree mark), flip the toggle switch over to auto, or turn your control knob over to room temperature instead of stove temperature. Or you could do all 3 of these things or a variation. What ever works best for you, and what ever is needed to get it out of this fireplace mode so you can actually enjoy your heat from your stove instead of actually just enjoying the visual effects of the flame.

 

[nikeseer]

Welcome. Put your stove type in your signature so we know what stove you have. Generally speaking the flame should be 4 to 6 inches out of the burn pot with no black tails. It should be bright and not lazy but active.

Is the flame supposed to be intermittent? If on the Quad CB1200i if it is too high how do you adjust the flame or air intake? The feed is closed as far as it can go and still have a high flame. My father is going through about 2 bags a day.

 

[mralias]

Is the flame supposed to be intermittent? If on the Quad CB1200i if it is too high how do you adjust the flame or air intake? The feed is closed as far as it can go and still have a high flame. My father is going through about 2 bags a day.

On a CB1200i it is not uncommon for the flame to fluctuate. As long as after start up the flame is active, about 4 to 6 inches out of the burn pot on high and no black tails. Adjust it on high by the feed rate control in your hopper. Instructions are in your manual. Keep in mind that the type of pellet you burn can also alter your flame. Case in point; I was burning MWP just before the cold snap and my feed rate was wide open on medium setting. Switched to Okies and had to turn it down a little over a quarter of the way in.

 

[Mr. Spock]

No worries I think. My harman is wide open right now and the flame is huge, touching the top of the fire box. Base is blue with bright orange body and sharp active tips. Leaving a white powdery ash on the heat exchanger. 9 deg currently.

:: edit :: the flame size also shrinks and grows depending on how close it gets to satisfying room temp.

 

[nikeseer]

On a CB1200i it is not uncommon for the flame to fluctuate. As long as after start up the flame is active, about 4 to 6 inches out of the burn pot on high and no black tails. Adjust it on high by the feed rate control in your hopper. Instructions are in your manual. Keep in mind that the type of pellet you burn can also alter your flame. Case in point; I was burning MWP just before the cold snap and my feed rate was wide open on medium setting. Switched to Okies and had to turn it down a little over a quarter of the way in.

We are only burning MWP and they seem to be a really good batch. The manuals do not get into as many specifics as I'd like. Our feed is closed and were still getting high peak flames. The manual the company has the most recent on s says for me cab50 should be a 2 but my manual says 4 and that's what mine is set at. For the quad cb 1200i they said it should be a 1 not 2. Tried calling them back and 44 min later decide to leave a message and no room in voice mailbox to do so. Not happy right now

 

[nikeseer]

No worries I think. My harman is wide open right now and the flame is huge, touching the top of the fire box. Base is blue with bright orange body and sharp active tips. Leaving a white powdery ash on the heat exchanger. 9 deg currently.

Wow! Mine is fluctuating like its supposed to. Thank goodness. Just concerned its not working as efficiently as it can and after speaking to them once today I'm more confused now than before.

 

[mralias]

We are only burning MWP and they seem to be a really good batch. The manuals do not get into as many specifics as I'd like. Our feed is closed and were still getting high peak flames. The manual the company has the most recent on s says for me cab50 should be a 2 but my manual says 4 and that's what mine is set at. For the quad cb 1200i they said it should be a 1 not 2. Tried calling them back and 44 min later decide to leave a message and no room in voice mailbox to do so. Not happy right now

A Quad CB1200i has no control other than the feed rate control which is not numbered.

 

[DexterDay]

A Quad CB1200i has no control other than the feed rate control which is not numbered.

This isn't related to this thread, but yes, a newer (clear control box) has a Knob on it (inside the stove, behind a panel) that can increase the fuel feed by 10%.

As to the OP.. It's a Harman P-68.,,. When it's burning, it's burning and that flame will be HUGE Keep on keepin on

 

[boosted3g]

First thing to do is read the sticky at the top of the page. Check to see exactly what mode you are running on. Stove temp auto will always make a lot of heat and i only use it on temps under 20 degrees otherwise it will cook us out of the house. I dont know your home but a p68 can throw some rediculous heat so i cant imaging it keeping up. It will burn pellets up but it will throw some serious heat. Heck on my P61 i had my wifes sweater vest sort of cape thing start to catch fire because she was standing too close and i was only running in stove temp 4

 

[Shane and Jessica]

No worries I think. My harman is wide open right now and the flame is huge, touching the top of the fire box. Base is blue with bright orange body and sharp active tips. Leaving a white powdery ash on the heat exchanger. 9 deg currently.

:: edit :: the flame size also shrinks and grows depending on how close it gets to satisfying room temp.

that is what we have going on too. i contacted my dealer as well and he said he was not concerned and it sounded normal. he said he was going through 3 bags a day to heat his 2500 sf home. which would be correct for us if we kept the house warmer