Greenwood 200 draft/ smoke problem

[nhdblfan]

Hi all,
its not mine,I have a,new Harman pellet stove,XXV works great.
My neighbor also went with a new heating system this year.He just installed a Greenwood 200 and is having problems;

Lots of smoke when he opens door to load wood.
Also seems to build up a lot of creasote in flue and vent pipes as well as inside firebox(above on the excahnger tubes(?)).

We installed a "draft inducer" last night and it did help a bit but still has smoke when he loaded it.

Thanks in adavnce for any help,also happy to give more info on system if needed

 

[ISeeDeadBTUs]

Install the GW outdoors and you won't mind the smoke.

Make sure he is not overloading the unit. This will make for more smoke and creosote formation.

Use dry, solid wood.

Be very careful to keep the surface area to mass ratio as low as possible.

I know it's a bit late for this but . . . Why did he get the 200 instead of the 100? How much space is he heating? Heat delivery medium? Heat loss?

 

[nhdblfan]

Hi IseedeadBTU's

and thank you for the input.

I just called him to get some answers and he related that after I left lask night the creosote was pouring out the back of the stove so he turned the thermostats up to 80 and it got smoky again.

He is heating about 2800 square ft, he is loading the stove with split (left over from grapple load bought two years ago and split for wood stove-he is gogin to cut next load as full logs), dry wood to just about bottom of door.

"Be very careful to keep the surface area to mass ratio as low as possible." I am sorry but could you explain?


He was going for the 100 but switched to the 200, it was quite the project getting that thing lowed down the bulkhead into the basement !

The flue pipe is reduced down to 7" (from the 8" output flange) and then does go through a thimble to a 8" chimney flue could that be an issue?

thanks

 

[ISeeDeadBTUs]

I would be very suprised if the 200 is sized properly, based on what little you've given us. I am heating 4k[] and I RARELY have my oil come on. I have a GW100. But you need a heat loss calc. Well, actually, mnaybe you don't, since it's already installed.

In my opinion, the GW should not be in living space. These units tend to smoke out the load door. It's a function of design.

Two things that he can change right away. Don't reduce the pipe diameter. Go 8" into 8" SS chimney all the way. Has he measured the draft?

Second, and most important to the creosote/smoke issue . . . . STOP OVERFILLING THE DAMN THING If his weather was anything like upstate NY yesterday, three small ROUNDS in the back of the box would probably produce usable heat for 8 hours. Do not use splits. 'Be very careful to keep the surface area to mass ratio as low as possible' That's technical speak for using small loads of quality +6" rounds.

And start planning that outside building/wood storage system to put in over the summer so the smoke can be outside next year.

 

[91220da]

I agree with ISeeDeadBTUs, Small hot fires are better than loading the box expecting the logs to catch right away. They will smolder and smoke alot. When I get home from work in the afternoon I will rake the coals and add 1 or 2 small splits just to get a good flame and draft. I then go in the house and change into my play clothes. Buy the time I go back outside it is hot and roaring so then I add 1 or 2 rounds. Tell him to follow the directions in the manual. Open the door slowly and only and inch or so to let the pressure equalize in the firebox. I add a log and close the door in between each trip to the wood pile. If you leave the door open the smoke will roll out. If he just fired it for the very first time the moisture (looks like creosote) will drip out of it for probably 2 days. Mine looked like a light rust colored water. That is the moisture baking out of the refractory. I also hope it is not oversized for the house. All of Greenwoods research shows that if it idles to much it will smoke and produce creosote. I was told that it is better to undersize the unit and have it burn hot than be to big and idle all the time.

 

[nhdblfan]

Thank you,

It has indeed been warmer then normal here in central NH for Dec and I suspect,from what your saying he is indeed overloading it (guess its hard to tone donw from feeding one,sometimes two woodstoves-he goes though about 8 or 9 cords a year in the past.)I also bet he went bigger then he needed,man that was one heavy unit to get in his basment and all the pipe work for e the zones-ouch!

The chimney is 8x8 flue and we could repipe it and get a bigger thimble in there.Its a short run and just 2 90's but anything to help get that flue working better.He did borrow a draft meter and it was .5 (the minimum?) without the inducer.

Thank you for all the help and I will let him know about it all.

 

[henfruit]

hey dead did you pipe yours 8 inch pie all the way??? do you run your circulater from the wood shed to the house 24/7?

 

[Steaming Pile]

I agree with deadbtu. Greenwood in the basement = disaster. Mine is in the garage but I am working on a smoke hood made from an old range hood (basically just to keep the fine ash from floating around). Actually it's done , just waiting for a nice day to cut a hole through the roof. Sounds like this guy better start kicking the same idea around. Truth is if you are careful and stage your wood in front of the loading door,quickly load it and shut he door it's not that bad. Only open the door when your temps are low and the draft door is open (no peeking to see how it's burning). This means it's time to load 'er up again. As far as going with the 200 model it's crazy unless you plan to heat like 6000+ sq. ft. The 100 model can easily pump out 150,000 btu's with a larger circulator. Just my .02!

 

[henfruit]

yup did the inside deal smoke gets in your eyes and every thing else. owell whats another new door in the cellar to get it out. and a trench 2 broken septic lines, 130 yards of fill 7 yards of concrete and a nice new 12x 30 wood shed boiler room . that all could have been done the first time but no they said it would work inside. they lied .

 

[Steaming Pile]

yup did the inside deal smoke gets in your eyes and every thing else. owell whats another new door in the cellar to get it out. and a trench 2 broken septic lines, 130 yards of fill 7 yards of concrete and a nice new 12x 30 wood shed boiler room . that all could have been done the first time but no they said it would work inside. they lied .

Yep. A lot of mis-information an half truths comes along with owning one of these things. Sounds like we all have had to learn the hard way. I wonder how many lawsuits Greenwood has pending?

 

[taxidermist]

see page 6 greenwood recomends a draft inducer. http://www.greenwoodfurnace.com/PDF_Documents/TechBulletin3_Chimney_Installation.pdf


just a fyi Eko do the same thing. My wife would kill me if my house smelled like my shop.

 

[Steaming Pile]

see page 6 greenwood recomends a draft inducer. http://www.greenwoodfurnace.com/PDF_Documents/TechBulletin3_Chimney_Installation.pdf


just a fyi Eko do the same thing. My wife would kill me if my house smelled like my shop.

Got one!! It barely helps.......if at all.

 

[JMann]

Is the location of the wood important (in the firebox) when loading? ISeeDeadBTU's said to place rounds near the back, close to the vents. I've been keeping mine near the front. When I go out in the morning to reload, that's where most of my live coals are waiting.

 

[nhdblfan]

Hi all,
and I apologize for the delay,we had a "bit" of ice up here and have all been busy feeding generators and being sure all the neighbors are ok.We just got power back last night.He has cut way down on the wood load and its made a big differnce,very big.Still smoke but not anywhere as much.Also has put the wood to the back of firebox and when he can get a chance he is considering moving the furnace back 6 ft and using the other chimney with the bigger (8") flue and do the all 8" flue.

Thanks again all who helped,and sorry for delay getting back,its a real mess up here but they,we have crews for Quebec,Ohio and other states working with PSNH getting the power back up

 

[ISeeDeadBTUs]

The only time I load wood all the way from the back to the front is when it's >20 and I want an 8+ hour burn. The fuel near the front of the box doesn't produce that much heat, but forms the base for the next fire once the coals are moved to the back of the box.

Yes, I am 8" from the GW outlet to the atmosphere. Currently 2 pipe 90's plus the Metalbestos T . . . plan to go with straight 8" pipe into the Metalbestos T next year. Back when I first got the unit and was freaking out because the oil burner was coming on, I bought a Terjlund draft-inducer. It still sits on top of the GW collecting dust. Kinda' like my generator, but that is collecting snow :roll:

Possibly some clarification here . . . when you say your friend's unit is smoking . . you mean out the load door? or out the stack?

Those of you that put your GW's inside the residence . . . "Where do you go to eat stuff that's bad for you/check out the bottom of the Wild Turkey bottle/Call your GF/hang out with yer buds???" Women will go to the basement looking for you . . .they will NOT go outside to find your sorry ass when it's cold and snowy out ;-)


Jimbo