Hearth Pad design details -- I don't even know what to search for.

[Annalea]

Hi everyone!

I'm back again, looking for help with my hearth. I'm not even clear on what search terms to use, so please forgive the utter newb-ness of this post.

Here's where the stove is going:

(broken link removed to http://www.flickr.com/photos/thepassionatemind/11802536714/)

(What's the trick for making Flickr photos show up? I only get a broken link gif, no matter which link I put into the image pop up. I've attached the pic, too. Anyway . . . )

The hickory floor is 3/4" thick, and that's 3/4" OSB T&G under all the presents. The joists below are about 16" OC.

Due to the space constraints (the outside corner of the hearth pad is in the traffic pattern between the kitchen peninsula and the stove), I really need the hearth to be level with the floor. (We have children, and my parents will probably live here after we move into the house we're in the planning stages of.) I like the idea of building up a small platform under the stove, which would lie outside the traffic pattern. Less bending to build a fire, and a little more ability to build up the heat protection.

I was reading somewhere about a type of backer board/heat protective board that's really thin, yet has a much higher R value than Hardi or cement board. My local Home Depot doesn't have it, and I can't remember what it's called. Is it this? (broken link removed)

We're planning on running the heat-resistant backerboard & tile up the walls, as well. We're not quite sure how far . . . 3-4 feet? I'd like to put a mantle of some kind along the top of the tile, so it can't be too low for heat reasons. (I have some ideas on how to build it up/out to make it look nice without spending a fortune if it needs to be stone . . . Or could it be wood?)

 

[Annalea]

P.S.) Here's a pinboard I've started for inspiration, and to give y'all an idea of what I'm talking about. )

http://www.pinterest.com/annalea/hearth-corner/

 

[cableman]

What stove are you going with? Does it need a hearth with an r value? If it did i would look into cutting out the area needed for the hearth down to the floor joists and 3 layers of durarock should bring it flush and that alone has an r value of 1.17. I would think you will need to add support to the existing floor under it also, is it excessable?

 

[begreen]

Have you chosen the stove yet? The hearth needs to meet or exceed the minimum stove requirements. Knowing the stove is step one. There is no problem exceeding the size or insulation requirements for the stove. That is often a good idea. But don't go under the minimums.

Be careful planning a mantel. There are clearance requirements there too. At least one of the stoves pictured on Pinterest appears to be in violation of this requirement.

 

[Annalea]

This is the stove I'm planning on. (We'll be buying it later this summer.)

(broken link removed to http://www.hearthstonestoves.com/store/wood-products/wood-stoves/tribute-soapstone)

I'm pretty sure the floor is fine for the stove. I would feel just fine having four good-sized adults stand in that spot. The OSB is securely nailed, and the joists are engineered, not solid wood.

I would really love the Heritage (mostly because it's got a side door), but I'm not sure we can get the clearances down enough to fit it in. We've got 51" wide x 30" deep (stove clearance), with a flush-with-the-floor hearth able to extend out to 47".

As I said earlier, I'm just fine with building up a smaller platform for the stove to rest on, if we need additional protection. But, from the specs at the Hearthstone site, it looks like tile will be good (so long as we hit an R value of .6). Isn't there some kind of thin reflective stuff you can put under tile to send the heat back into the room, instead of letting it down into the subfloor?

 

[lostDuck]

For a low hearth I used Micore 300. Which had an R value greater than 2.0 per inch.

 

[begreen]

Tom has very good installation guides for Hearthstone stoves here:
(broken link removed to http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/chstribute.htm)
With an R=.6 requirement you can use two layers (1") of 1/2" Durock NexGen cement board. That will give you R=.78.

The Tribute is small. If you want a larger, closer clearance stove maybe consider a cast iron clad stove like the Quadrafire Yosemite, PE Alderlea T5, Jotul F45 or Enviro Boston.

 

[cableman]

Your looking to corner it? I would do a 6" or so raised hearth coming out 47" on both sides, then cut the hickory out 4" more all around the front to meet the 51" side. With durarock and tile make that 4" extension flush with the floor. Use the guild line that BG linked from chimneysweeps but the whole hearth doesnt have to be raised.

 

[Annalea]

begreen, I'm pretty set on my stove . . . this is a <800 sq ft home, and I absolutely have to love looking at everything in it. Taking care of the family and house is a monster job, and before we started this house, I vowed I wouldn't put myself through taking care of things I don't love. It's just not worth it. We've lived in rentals for the lion's share of our 15 years, and while I don't insist on the top of the line, I just really need to love it. I've looked over lots and lots of stoves (I posted about it a year and a half ago, lol, this project has moved FAR more slowly than I hoped), and have thought and researched since then. The Tribute is where it's at for me . . . it has good enough efficiency, is sized well for the space, and it fills the "makes me happy when I see it" requirement without breaking the bank.

cableman, I don't think there's room for cornering it. The alcove has two walls, the back one (facing the camera in the photo above) is 51" wide, the wall on the right is 30". To corner it, I'd need to bring the hearth out further, and I'm not sure I'm up for that--the hickory is nailed within an inch of its life, and pulling it up would be a PAIN. The area we left open is plenty large enough for a straight install, and with Micor on the walls, the stove can sit back close enough to be out of the way.

It seems like the hearth would only have to be raised in an area about 31"w x 21", which is about 3.5" out from the edges of the stove. Am I interpreting that chart correctly in that?

 

[cableman]

Ok that changes it i thought you were cornering it! I also though the small wall was 47", must have read that wrong.
The hearth still has to be 40d x 29"w and thats using double wall pipe

 

[Annalea]

Hmmm. Here is another option, with ember protection only hearth reqs: (broken link removed to http://www.hearthstonestoves.com/store/wood-products/wood-stoves/craftsbury-cast-iron)

I'm not as excited about it, but it would work, and is still cast iron, so there's some thermal mass to mitigate temp swings . . .

 

[begreen]

I less fond of the Craftsbury than the Tribute. There have been complaints in the past about the Craftsbury latch assembly and small firebox. I'd sooner see you get an Alderlea T4.
(broken link removed to http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/pacaldert4.htm)

 

[Fireshoppe]

The Craftsbury is redesigned this year to be more like the Shelburn and both are great looking stoves as well as performers. Annalea have you looked at the Castleton? This is a terrific looking stove that should fit your application with 6" of rear clearance and with a proper wall treatment you could set it with the side clearance as low as 12". According to the literature the floor protection can be 36.5D x 31.5W. All Hearthstones are going on sale soon AND it has a 1.9cu firebox which means you spend less time tending it and more time just being warm.

Has anyone explored the ceiling/roof system to know if the chimney can go straight up from the stove on through the roof without cutting joists or rafters. If the roof system is built with trusses the chimney will have to go around them which may mean an offset in the black stove pipe below the ceiling.

If you don't know have your dealer come out and inspect and plan the installation for you. This way you know what you are getting into. Good luck and enjoy!

 

[Annalea]

Fireshoppe, thank you so much for the tips. Our local shop isn't known for its customer service , but I'll try calling. I've been in once, and the owner is an older man, and I had a really hard time feeling he listened to me or, once he seemed to be really paying attention, understood what I was trying to explain about my project constraints. I was planning on buying either online or from a brick and mortar shop in Coeur d' Alene or Spokane, since we have friends that were treated well at shops in those towns. We have a contractor (who did the structure and roof on this place) who is going to come put the chimney in. It's right near the peak of the roof, which is trusses with metal roofing.

I looked at the Castleton (which I like pretty well), but it's too deep. The front of the stove really needs to sit less than 30" from the rear wall. (Sorry I didn't mention that earlier.) The traffic pattern comes from the stairs (where the gate is on the left of the photo), comes around the corner and then goes off to stage right in the photo. The 30" wall on the right of the alcove is the water heater closet, and that determines the flow of foot traffic. I'd like a cushion between that line and the front of the stove, so kids aren't habitually walking too close to the stove. (You know what they say about children and dogs: they WILL take the shortest route between two points, even if it's through your petunias or too close to the wood stove.) So, that's why the Tribute was so attractive. I've emailed Hearthstone, asking if they're planning on making the Tribute an ember-protection only stove, or if they could custom make one. I know the firebox is smaller, but this is a really little place, and an eight-hour heat life will work just fine. (We have backup electric heat, as well.)

The Alderlea T5 looks interesting, (mostly due to the cooking angle--we don't have a big stove or oven), but I'm still not sold on it . . .

 

[Fireshoppe]

FWIW the top of the Castleton is 21" so with DW pipe & rear heat shield it could sit at 27". But the Tribute is very cute.

 

[Annalea]

What's a DW pipe?

I think I'll need to make some cardboard mock-ups and see what I think. I should probably get the Christmas tree down, eh?

 

[Fireshoppe]

Double Wall connector pipe reduces the standard clearance to 6"

 

[Annalea]

Ahh. Got it.

I was thinking about outside air . . . the stove isn't where we can run a pipe out through a wall, but it's over the unheated garage. Is it okay to draw air from a space like that? (There's a heavy-duty exterior door from the garage to heated space.)

 

[Fireshoppe]

No. You may not pull combustion air from a garage as combustible gasses may be pulled into the stove. But a sealed combustion air duct may run through the space to the outside.

 

[Annalea]

Thanks.