Hello. I am experienced with wood stove heat using wood logs. Recently I stopped using wood and sold my Hearthstone after 14 continuous winters. I miss burning and now I think I want to get a coal stove. I live in western Pennsylvania coal country. I have found a Heatrola for decent money and I’m asking if anyone can guide me on whether it can be used. Thanks in advance.
Heatrola. Should I Heat With This (Using Anthracite)?
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Why not? Unless you miss the cutting, stacking, bugs, bark and mess inside, and loading every few hours, you'll love it.
Coal is much easier with more even heat. Of course it depends on the chimney too. Get a good damper. (barometric)
Learn coal burning when it's below 40*f so you have enough draft since it takes lots of air moving up through the coal bed. You should be able to establish a coal fire within 1/2 hour, 15 minutes when you get good at it. Most make the mistake of trying to get a good bed of coals from wood and putting coal on the glowing coals. You need small kindling with flames, and sprinkle coal over it so the flames are ripping up through the coal. It will ignite easily and you continue to add more until the fire is covered. It's strange looking at a fire with no flames and it looks like you're killing a wood fire covering it with stones. You will only see a glow from the bottom up through the grate until it glows up through the pile and lights coal gas with a blue flame on top. The more air, the more blue flame. It can be frustrating at first, then you have steady 24/7 heat until you let it go out.
COALPAIL.COM is the old "NEPA Crossroads" coal burners website where you will find others burning Estate heaters.
https://coalpail.com/coal-forum/
Coal is much easier with more even heat. Of course it depends on the chimney too. Get a good damper. (barometric)
Learn coal burning when it's below 40*f so you have enough draft since it takes lots of air moving up through the coal bed. You should be able to establish a coal fire within 1/2 hour, 15 minutes when you get good at it. Most make the mistake of trying to get a good bed of coals from wood and putting coal on the glowing coals. You need small kindling with flames, and sprinkle coal over it so the flames are ripping up through the coal. It will ignite easily and you continue to add more until the fire is covered. It's strange looking at a fire with no flames and it looks like you're killing a wood fire covering it with stones. You will only see a glow from the bottom up through the grate until it glows up through the pile and lights coal gas with a blue flame on top. The more air, the more blue flame. It can be frustrating at first, then you have steady 24/7 heat until you let it go out.
COALPAIL.COM is the old "NEPA Crossroads" coal burners website where you will find others burning Estate heaters.
https://coalpail.com/coal-forum/
That’s a great summary of what I am thinking. Add in my advancing age and receding energy level, and the coal stove is looking pretty good. On top of that, I live in western Pennsylvania coal country. So why not indeed! My thrifty side always resists spending money so I’m watching Craigslist and hoping for an end of season bargain. I happened on a Heatrola ancient model for $300. If someone knows the stove, is there a weak point That I should note? I should look for a stove guy in my area to consult. Thanks for the thoughtful reply.
I have enough property that accumulates dead trees and storm damaged wood to heat with wood most years. I would need to get rid of it anyway. One wood and one coal is our only heat source, so some years I take a break and burn 2 tons of coal in a Hitzer with self feeding hopper. 1 bucket a day when mild, 2 buckets a day when cold for PA averages 2 tons a year heating just under 2000 sf. here. At just over $200 / ton that is far easier than wood and very steady heat. You'll notice stack temps extremely low compared to wood. Starting on wood you see it spike to 300 or more and as coal starts, it drops all the way down to 100* on low and about 150* on high. That's pipe surface temp where it connects to chimney. Very little loss up the chimney like wood.
Ash doesn't have the Potash qualities like wood ash for plants and soil, as a matter of fact it has nothing to add to soil but also does no harm. I use it heavy around poles and fence posts to keep weeds down. Forget storing it for ice in winter. It rots through any metal container and absorbs moisture from the atmosphere and becomes like cement even trying to keep it dry.
Grates and the plates that form a type of "basket" are the parts that rust away. Always keep ash cleaned out below grates since the incoming air below them is the only thing that keeps them cool. These things are true with any coal stove. If someone allows the ash to come into contact and stop the air flow grates warp and melt. Some coal is more corrosive than others. I'm in North Eastern PA where a breaker called Old Company Lehi was always the best you could buy. I tried other brands and found either more ash or sulfur smell and to extreme one brand went through a stainless chimney cap a year! So masonry chimney is best, and if you have metal be sure to clean it very well at season end. I even run rags with drain oil in mine after cleaning and got 25 years out of a Dura-Vent before a screwdriver could be put through the inner flue pipe. That was Blaschak coal I didn't care for, but like fuel in different vehicles other stoves may be fine with it.
Some other tips; Wipe the glass inside DAILY if it looks like it needs it or not. When you shake grates the fly ash that becomes airborne sticks to the glass and will etch into it making it cloudy looking. A damp rag when at its coolest wipes it clean.
Those who claim "coal is dirty" are not shaking it properly. And some stoves tend to leak around the shaker handle..... There are many motions to shake down a fire and after years of practice you find what works best. In the morning when ash is deep under fire, slow full stroke rocking motion is needed to get ash to fall through until air can get up through firebed. Not enough to become airborne, just enough to get air through the fire to kick it up and get the chimney hot. Then when you have a good draft you can shake more violently until the fire is down to the grate. This prevents airborne flyash from getting inside with a strong draft to take it up the stack. Stop as coals start to fall through and let it kick up and get burning good, then pour coal on top (that's stoking) and let a little hollow spot like a well in one place where you always have flame. If you cover entire fire, the coal gas accumulates and lights with a poof when you open door as it gets air above fire.
Avoid any holes in the fire since all the air moves up through the hole without being forced through the coal. That's what makes it burn. This is most peoples problem starting a coal fire which only needs to be done once a season. The entire grate must be covered even if you are putting coal on a grate with no fire under it, any opening allows air to be pushed through firebox into chimney without doing the fire any good and cools the stack. Plug the holes in grate to force air through coal and it will take right off.
Depending on your model, You should have an upper air intake which is secondary air. The primary air comes in the bottom under grate and at times can use up all the oxygen coming through fire. So a little added to the top allows the gasses that escape from the coal as it heats to ignite on top. (blue) You end up trying different ways of loading such as thicker around the sides with a shallow spot in the middle (such as firing boilers to keep side sheets from an air leak cooling the sheet) or mounding in the center keeping it shallow on the edges. Level is OK, but always keep that shallow spot to have a "pilot" flame to prevent gas build up. It doesn't take much air up top, and too much only slips up the chimney without being used and cools the flue, so don't overdo secondary air.
When you get the hang of it, you can use the fines from the bottom of bin on warmer days. The larger the coal pieces, (you should use chestnut) the more air gets between pieces so the faster it will burn. You get the same BTU per pound out of any size coal, the size only changes the burn rate so it takes longer to get the BTU out of smaller pieces that has less air in contact between the pieces.
Ash doesn't have the Potash qualities like wood ash for plants and soil, as a matter of fact it has nothing to add to soil but also does no harm. I use it heavy around poles and fence posts to keep weeds down. Forget storing it for ice in winter. It rots through any metal container and absorbs moisture from the atmosphere and becomes like cement even trying to keep it dry.
Grates and the plates that form a type of "basket" are the parts that rust away. Always keep ash cleaned out below grates since the incoming air below them is the only thing that keeps them cool. These things are true with any coal stove. If someone allows the ash to come into contact and stop the air flow grates warp and melt. Some coal is more corrosive than others. I'm in North Eastern PA where a breaker called Old Company Lehi was always the best you could buy. I tried other brands and found either more ash or sulfur smell and to extreme one brand went through a stainless chimney cap a year! So masonry chimney is best, and if you have metal be sure to clean it very well at season end. I even run rags with drain oil in mine after cleaning and got 25 years out of a Dura-Vent before a screwdriver could be put through the inner flue pipe. That was Blaschak coal I didn't care for, but like fuel in different vehicles other stoves may be fine with it.
Some other tips; Wipe the glass inside DAILY if it looks like it needs it or not. When you shake grates the fly ash that becomes airborne sticks to the glass and will etch into it making it cloudy looking. A damp rag when at its coolest wipes it clean.
Those who claim "coal is dirty" are not shaking it properly. And some stoves tend to leak around the shaker handle..... There are many motions to shake down a fire and after years of practice you find what works best. In the morning when ash is deep under fire, slow full stroke rocking motion is needed to get ash to fall through until air can get up through firebed. Not enough to become airborne, just enough to get air through the fire to kick it up and get the chimney hot. Then when you have a good draft you can shake more violently until the fire is down to the grate. This prevents airborne flyash from getting inside with a strong draft to take it up the stack. Stop as coals start to fall through and let it kick up and get burning good, then pour coal on top (that's stoking) and let a little hollow spot like a well in one place where you always have flame. If you cover entire fire, the coal gas accumulates and lights with a poof when you open door as it gets air above fire.
Avoid any holes in the fire since all the air moves up through the hole without being forced through the coal. That's what makes it burn. This is most peoples problem starting a coal fire which only needs to be done once a season. The entire grate must be covered even if you are putting coal on a grate with no fire under it, any opening allows air to be pushed through firebox into chimney without doing the fire any good and cools the stack. Plug the holes in grate to force air through coal and it will take right off.
Depending on your model, You should have an upper air intake which is secondary air. The primary air comes in the bottom under grate and at times can use up all the oxygen coming through fire. So a little added to the top allows the gasses that escape from the coal as it heats to ignite on top. (blue) You end up trying different ways of loading such as thicker around the sides with a shallow spot in the middle (such as firing boilers to keep side sheets from an air leak cooling the sheet) or mounding in the center keeping it shallow on the edges. Level is OK, but always keep that shallow spot to have a "pilot" flame to prevent gas build up. It doesn't take much air up top, and too much only slips up the chimney without being used and cools the flue, so don't overdo secondary air.
When you get the hang of it, you can use the fines from the bottom of bin on warmer days. The larger the coal pieces, (you should use chestnut) the more air gets between pieces so the faster it will burn. You get the same BTU per pound out of any size coal, the size only changes the burn rate so it takes longer to get the BTU out of smaller pieces that has less air in contact between the pieces.
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Search "Heatrola" with only '"search this forum only" selected for other threads and owners.
You can click on any member name in the box at left and click "start a conversation" that will allow you to type into a box like posting here, but is a private message to them as well as an email to view the conversation.
A similar search at the coalpail website will give you more owners there since that is a coal burning site and this is primarily a wood burning website.
Yep, thanks for that reply. I did do that already. Got done good info and good for thought.
I am not sure on a heatrola. I do know that western PA bituminous coal burns good in a warm morning stove. Unlike hard anthracite which is what I heat with most of the season, bituminous has much more volatile matter and can give you some spectacular puffbacks/ small explosions if you dont let the fire catch properly with a fresh batch of coal. Several people report blowing their pipes apart at the seams if you get a real good one! Make sure you screw your stove pipe together! Bit coal typically burns with nice yellow flames vs the blue flames anthracite burns with. Bit will get some blue later in the burn however. The advantage to bituminous coal is it lights MUCH easier than anthracite and is typically much cheaper per ton. The downside is Bit coal will give some smoke out the stack on reloads where ant doesnt. Either way I say do the coal! I love burning coal. Right now in this warmer weather I am heating my house for about 70 cents to a dollar a day with anthracite. I run a Hitzer 50-93 gravity hopper stove with a bi metallic draft. Check out Coalpail.com. Thats a great source for information and has a whole section dedicated to Bit coal. I actually made a treck out to Latrobe last winter and bought a heap of bituminous coal that I burn in a home made basket in my fireplace. Works fantastic
My father used to buy ‘cannel coal’ when I was a kid to burn in the fireplace. It was hard coal I think. I was loaded with gas an would sputter and split into halves like shale. It made a very hot fire. I think m going to get a load of biuminous for next winter. That idea of getting a basket sounds good. I do have a log burning fireplace as well as a separate chimney for a wood or coal stove. When we built this house back in 2000, I put in three clay lined chimneys. I do like to burn! Thanks for the nice reply!
Do you have any idea how dangerous burning coal in an open fireplace is? Especially bit.
I guess I don’t. The last reply I read apparently does not either. I have burned wood in a fireplace for about 40 years and had various woodstoves too I’m just starting to explore using coal in a stove and maybe in the fireplace. As I said I’ve burned cannel coal and last week I bought a bag of anthracite nut coal. Thanks for the heads up! I need to do more reading.
A stove that is designed for burning coal and is set up properly is one thing. An open fireplace is totally different. No matter what you are burning and how you burn it be sure you have a good quality reliable co alarm. And know how it works. Not all are created equal.
CO poisoning coal puts out tons of it through the whole burn even when there is little heat being produced to supply draft. That danger is always there but much more so in an open fp
Cannel coal is the softest of coal. That stuff is like burning balls of grease. Anthracite coal is hard coal. If you smash a piece it looks like shiny black glass. That’s the best stuff for home heating followed by bituminous coal.
Bholler thanks for the concern, but I’ll continue doing what I have been for a long time. There were tons of fireplace made to burn coal back in the day. My chimney draft is strong even without a fire. I also have 3 CO detectors in my house. One in the outlet by the fireplace, one in the hallway above the fireplace, and one next to my bed. Burning wood also produces CO, as does any fuel when it’s burned. If your using anything other than electric you should have a co monitor. I attached an image of one of my typical coal fires
Bholler thanks for the concern, but I’ll continue doing what I have been for a long time. There were tons of fireplace made to burn coal back in the day. My chimney draft is strong even without a fire. I also have 3 CO detectors in my house. One in the outlet by the fireplace, one in the hallway above the fireplace, and one next to my bed. Burning wood also produces CO, as does any fuel when it’s burned. If your using anything other than electric you should have a co monitor. I attached an image of one of my typical coal fires
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Tacey DO NOT be afraid to burn coal. One of the nicest things about anthracite is you don’t have to worry about making your chimney a Roman candle. Anthracite produces 0 creosote.
Bituminous coal will make soot though That has to be swept out occasionally depending on the quality of the Bit you find. There are big differences out there
Bituminous coal will make soot though That has to be swept out occasionally depending on the quality of the Bit you find. There are big differences out there
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Yes i am fully aware that burning anything produces co. But nothing else that we burn to heat our homes produces it in the levels that coal does. And nothing else does it through the whole fire. Yes people heated with open coal fires for years but that doesnt mean it hasnt killed lots of people in the process. It is good that you have co detectors but how do they read levels? What level do they go off at?
Anthracite chimneys need cleaned as well. The dirt that comes out of an anthrecite chimney is typically much lighter than bit dirt but similar quanitites.
To be clear i am not saying dont burn coal. I did for years i live and work in central pa which is coal country. It is still a good fuel but you need to be aware of the possible dangers
Yes all my chimneys are swept yearly. If I remember I will take a picture and post it up of a shot looking down my chimney flue before I sweep it this year. With anthracite you will typically get most of your accumulation in the stove pipe especially at your 90s. In the actual chimney itself you MIGHT get a tablespoon of dirt that you brush out. I’ve burned coal 17 years and you do not get even close to the same accumulation in an anthracite chimney as you do burning wood or bituminous coal that is a fact. Wood gives creosote obviously and bituminous coal gives fluffy black soot from the bitumen which is the tars in bituminous coal. OP if your planning to burn western pa bituminous there are some very high grades of coal around. There are also very low grades which can plug up your flue pipe in a couple days. Kentucky has some excellent coal as well. There is good info for bituminous coal dealers and coal quality reports on coalpail.com. There are dangers with anything. Wood stoves burn houses down from chimney fires coal has poisoned some people. Common sense goes a long way. Sweep your chimney, crack a window when your burn, etc but it sounds everyone here is a seasoned solid fuel burner so they already know that.
Bholler my CO detectors have digital displays on them and beep when a dangerous level is sustained for more than 3-5 minutes. They also beep if a low level (low enough not to affect healthy person) is sustained for more than 15 minutes. The only time I’ve ever had a co issue was idling the stove low when it hit 85 degrees outside a couple of weeks ago after I turned on a bathroom exhaust fan.
OP if you get the heatrola post up some pics!!
Bholler my CO detectors have digital displays on them and beep when a dangerous level is sustained for more than 3-5 minutes. They also beep if a low level (low enough not to affect healthy person) is sustained for more than 15 minutes. The only time I’ve ever had a co issue was idling the stove low when it hit 85 degrees outside a couple of weeks ago after I turned on a bathroom exhaust fan.
OP if you get the heatrola post up some pics!!
It sounds like you have pretty good co detectors then which is good. I have gone into houses with cheap co detectors and the one on my belt has gone off sometimes with pretty high levels.
Now as far as the buildup goes you are comparing your experince with your one setup to mine cleaning many hundreds of chimneys a year. I have taken more than 5 galons out of chimneys servicing anthracite burning appliances. Yes if your chimney is not set up properly a chimney fire from a wood stove can start a structure fire. But if your setup is up to code the risk is very low. And if you are burning good fuel correctly there is little to no combustible material in the chimney to burn.
On the other side if your chimney is not right a coal appliance can easily start a structure fire as well.
And no not everyone here is a seasoned burner. And many seasoned burners dont understand the dangers involed in what they are doing. So assuming people know the basics can be very dangerous.
This came out of a chimney today with a keystoker running into it. Now to be fair half of that or about 2 gallons came out of the pipe. But the other half came out of 19 feet of chimney. And we clean it yearly. You can see that clearly is fly ash from anthracite.
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