Help me choose a bigger wood stove

[hawkfan9]

Hello, and it's been a while. I got a lot of help from this forum when I bought my current Grandma bear wood stove, with glass doors, quite a few years ago. Here's my conundrum. I love the Grandma bear, and watching the flames is soothing, but I'm using this wood stove to heat my workshop. My shop is 1600 square feet, insulated, with 12' ceilings. I have a main air filtration unit, hanging from the ceiling, which filters and circulates the air in the space very, very well, many times per hour. Problem is, this stove is just too small for the volume of space in the workshop during the really cold days.

I'm looking to purchase a larger stove, and I'm limited to a used stove. As much as I'd love to buy a newer large catalytic stove with long burn times, I can't justify the cost of $3000 to $4000 for the stove. I'm looking to stay well under $1K if I can. The Grandma bear is going to stay with me and go into another future smaller workshop space, and it'll do fine in there.

I've looked for a Grandpa stove, but they aren't easy to find, some people really think they're worth more than they are to me. Saw one recently for over $1000. That's just too much for me.

I installed the steel baffle under the top 8" exit for my grandma bear stove, and it really helped a LOT with heating efficiency. I would do the same with a larger stove, if I can find one. I suppose a catalytic type stove, like a Blaze King King model would be great, but haven't been able to find one.

What I'd like to do is find a larger stove that can offer me longer overnight burn times, if possible. I feed the grandma bear every couple of hours. Coals are basically done in about 4 to 5 hours. Can I do better with a different stove?

I have an 8" chimney, and no funds to change that, so whatever I buy, it has to work with my current 8" black pipe, switching to triple wall through the attic and out the roof. It draws excellently with the Grandma bear. That has never been an issue.

I only burn very well dried hardwood. I have a small firewood business on the side, and burn oak, locust, maple, ash, and some fruitwood species, too. All very well seasoned a year and a half to 2 years, minimum.

I'm open to any brand stove that won't cost a lot of money to buy, works with my 8" chimney, and can increase an overnight burn time so the shop is above freezing temps in the morning when I go back to work.

Thanks for any help you can provide.

 

[Frankdozer]

Where do you live? I could have a Papa Bear for sale , really nice one with not much use

 

[PA Mountain Man]

Hello, and it's been a while. I got a lot of help from this forum when I bought my current Grandma bear wood stove, with glass doors, quite a few years ago. Here's my conundrum. I love the Grandma bear, and watching the flames is soothing, but I'm using this wood stove to heat my workshop. My shop is 1600 square feet, insulated, with 12' ceilings. I have a main air filtration unit, hanging from the ceiling, which filters and circulates the air in the space very, very well, many times per hour. Problem is, this stove is just too small for the volume of space in the workshop during the really cold days.

I'm looking to purchase a larger stove, and I'm limited to a used stove. As much as I'd love to buy a newer large catalytic stove with long burn times, I can't justify the cost of $3000 to $4000 for the stove. I'm looking to stay well under $1K if I can. The Grandma bear is going to stay with me and go into another future smaller workshop space, and it'll do fine in there.

I've looked for a Grandpa stove, but they aren't easy to find, some people really think they're worth more than they are to me. Saw one recently for over $1000. That's just too much for me.

I installed the steel baffle under the top 8" exit for my grandma bear stove, and it really helped a LOT with heating efficiency. I would do the same with a larger stove, if I can find one. I suppose a catalytic type stove, like a Blaze King King model would be great, but haven't been able to find one.

What I'd like to do is find a larger stove that can offer me longer overnight burn times, if possible. I feed the grandma bear every couple of hours. Coals are basically done in about 4 to 5 hours. Can I do better with a different stove?

I have an 8" chimney, and no funds to change that, so whatever I buy, it has to work with my current 8" black pipe, switching to triple wall through the attic and out the roof. It draws excellently with the Grandma bear. That has never been an issue.

I only burn very well dried hardwood. I have a small firewood business on the side, and burn oak, locust, maple, ash, and some fruitwood species, too. All very well seasoned a year and a half to 2 years, minimum.

I'm open to any brand stove that won't cost a lot of money to buy, works with my 8" chimney, and can increase an overnight burn time so the shop is above freezing temps in the morning when I go back to work.

Thanks for any help you can provide.View attachment 275694

You will get more heat out of a Papa Bear.
What is R value of ceiling and walls? At 12' ceiling you're adding 50% more heat loss at the walls than what the Fisher's were claiming to heat. With 1600 sf of ceiling, you need a lot of R's
Can you close air intakes on a hot fire to the point that you get smoke out of the chimney? If the door seals are not working correctly you could be sending excess heat up the chimney.

 

[bholler]

Hello, and it's been a while. I got a lot of help from this forum when I bought my current Grandma bear wood stove, with glass doors, quite a few years ago. Here's my conundrum. I love the Grandma bear, and watching the flames is soothing, but I'm using this wood stove to heat my workshop. My shop is 1600 square feet, insulated, with 12' ceilings. I have a main air filtration unit, hanging from the ceiling, which filters and circulates the air in the space very, very well, many times per hour. Problem is, this stove is just too small for the volume of space in the workshop during the really cold days.

I'm looking to purchase a larger stove, and I'm limited to a used stove. As much as I'd love to buy a newer large catalytic stove with long burn times, I can't justify the cost of $3000 to $4000 for the stove. I'm looking to stay well under $1K if I can. The Grandma bear is going to stay with me and go into another future smaller workshop space, and it'll do fine in there.

I've looked for a Grandpa stove, but they aren't easy to find, some people really think they're worth more than they are to me. Saw one recently for over $1000. That's just too much for me.

I installed the steel baffle under the top 8" exit for my grandma bear stove, and it really helped a LOT with heating efficiency. I would do the same with a larger stove, if I can find one. I suppose a catalytic type stove, like a Blaze King King model would be great, but haven't been able to find one.

What I'd like to do is find a larger stove that can offer me longer overnight burn times, if possible. I feed the grandma bear every couple of hours. Coals are basically done in about 4 to 5 hours. Can I do better with a different stove?

I have an 8" chimney, and no funds to change that, so whatever I buy, it has to work with my current 8" black pipe, switching to triple wall through the attic and out the roof. It draws excellently with the Grandma bear. That has never been an issue.

I only burn very well dried hardwood. I have a small firewood business on the side, and burn oak, locust, maple, ash, and some fruitwood species, too. All very well seasoned a year and a half to 2 years, minimum.

I'm open to any brand stove that won't cost a lot of money to buy, works with my 8" chimney, and can increase an overnight burn time so the shop is above freezing temps in the morning when I go back to work.

Thanks for any help you can provide.View attachment 275694

If a Grandma isn't putting out enough BTUs a blazeking certainly won't. I would recommend a wood furnace. Btw what is the shop used for? Is there any gasoline or flammable vapors present?

 

[hawkfan9]

I live in Northern Illinois, in McHenry County.

Yes, workshop is insulated. R19 walls, R40 ceiling.

Yep, I'm certainly aware of the extra volume of air that the 12' ceiling creates. I'm just looking for help to know what older stoves will put out more heat than the mid-sized grandma bear. I'd love to find a Grandpa bear, but I've only found one for sale, and the price is more than it's worth to me.

I'm hoping that the worst of this winter is over, so I've got all spring, summer, and fall to find something.

bholler, I'm aware of everything in my workshop and the dangers of a fire. Thanks. Been heating with wood for a very long time, just looking for some input on other stove brands besides the Fisher that are well thought of. I've owned a Blaze King King model, and this Fisher. The Blaze King was a busted up unit, and I didn't know it at the time when I bought it. Catalytic area was basically completely rusted out of it, and I didn't want to take the time to re-fabricate it, so I junked it.

 

[hawkfan9]

Frankdozer, Maine is a long way from here, but thanks.

 

[coaly]

I just need to know if that glass was cleaned for the picture or if it stays that way.

I see you're keeping the tach on the right side.

400 or 500 should get you a wood furnace with blower. Induction fan gets you going fast. They don't seem to sell as fast as wood stoves.

Papa Bear if you want a freestanding stove gets my vote. Ceiling fans to keep the heat down? Big 3 blade type.

 

[coaly]

A big Bullard, Double door Huntsman with the 6 intakes on front, Frontier the size of a Grandpa, Kodiak, Old Mill, Timberline, Baker, Sierra all competed with Fisher and are not junk. Many other brand names, you need something in the 30 inch wide category. (Papa is a 30 inch deep box and has better burn characteristics in my opinion)

Here is an XL next to a Papa on left and Grandpa III on right, then Grandma I to the right. Far right is a Grandpa I. It looks lower without ball feet. The XL is the largest Fisher for heating 3000 sf. They made a regular Fir Tree door that sells cheaper.

This gives you a good size comparison of the Fisher lineup.

Sellers may not know what an XL is and call it a Grandpa. They have a 10 inch outlet and an arched doorway at the top to match the door arch. That's the size you need. They were only made in Utah, but are found nationwide.

 

[bholler]

I live in Northern Illinois, in McHenry County.

Yes, workshop is insulated. R19 walls, R40 ceiling.

Yep, I'm certainly aware of the extra volume of air that the 12' ceiling creates. I'm just looking for help to know what older stoves will put out more heat than the mid-sized grandma bear. I'd love to find a Grandpa bear, but I've only found one for sale, and the price is more than it's worth to me.

I'm hoping that the worst of this winter is over, so I've got all spring, summer, and fall to find something.

bholler, I'm aware of everything in my workshop and the dangers of a fire. Thanks. Been heating with wood for a very long time, just looking for some input on other stove brands besides the Fisher that are well thought of. I've owned a Blaze King King model, and this Fisher. The Blaze King was a busted up unit, and I didn't know it at the time when I bought it. Catalytic area was basically completely rusted out of it, and I didn't want to take the time to re-fabricate it, so I junked it.

I am not really asking about fire safety. I am asking about that because if those things are present using a woodstove is a clear code violation. That means if anything were to happen your insurance would be justified in denying the claim meaning all that equipment is a complete loss.

I am just trying to give you all of the applicable info so you can make an informed decision.

I have burnt fishers a blaze king and lots of other stoves. And blaze kings are great at low and slow not big btus. Fishers are good at one thing big btus.

 

[Hoytman]

Coaly, how common were the XL’s?

 

[Hoytman]

Some of those big Army Cannon heaters or Station Agents would heat that place easily. Might need a forest to feed them though. LOL.

 

[Corey]

Just out of curiosity, are you maximizing the heat out of the Grandma? Couple of points:

- I don't see a fan on the stove - possibly one in the back? If you don't have a fan, setting up any way to force air over the stove you'll get a lot more effective heat into the shop.

- Looks like the temp gauge on the thermometer is pretty far in the red. Lot of heat going up the flue. If the flue is exposed, then you're getting some of that heat back, but a damper might help keep more heat in the stove where you could extract it with a fan.

- Ceiling fan in the shop? If no fan on the stove and no ceiling fan in the shop, then you're effectively heating from the ceiling-down by convection/ Though you likely only use the bottom 5-6 feet of the shop - which would be the coldest part. If you can distribute the hot air at the ceiling more efficiently, it will feel warmer overall.

- Secondary air injection on the stove? Several on this 'classic' forum have made their own (me included) from stainless or iron pipe. Doesn't take too much to weld up, or screw together a quick manifold of pipes and duct in some secondary air. Might help the stove burn a bit hotter - and definitely more efficient.

 

[BKVP]

Hello, and it's been a while. I got a lot of help from this forum when I bought my current Grandma bear wood stove, with glass doors, quite a few years ago. Here's my conundrum. I love the Grandma bear, and watching the flames is soothing, but I'm using this wood stove to heat my workshop. My shop is 1600 square feet, insulated, with 12' ceilings. I have a main air filtration unit, hanging from the ceiling, which filters and circulates the air in the space very, very well, many times per hour. Problem is, this stove is just too small for the volume of space in the workshop during the really cold days.

I'm looking to purchase a larger stove, and I'm limited to a used stove. As much as I'd love to buy a newer large catalytic stove with long burn times, I can't justify the cost of $3000 to $4000 for the stove. I'm looking to stay well under $1K if I can. The Grandma bear is going to stay with me and go into another future smaller workshop space, and it'll do fine in there.

I've looked for a Grandpa stove, but they aren't easy to find, some people really think they're worth more than they are to me. Saw one recently for over $1000. That's just too much for me.

I installed the steel baffle under the top 8" exit for my grandma bear stove, and it really helped a LOT with heating efficiency. I would do the same with a larger stove, if I can find one. I suppose a catalytic type stove, like a Blaze King King model would be great, but haven't been able to find one.

What I'd like to do is find a larger stove that can offer me longer overnight burn times, if possible. I feed the grandma bear every couple of hours. Coals are basically done in about 4 to 5 hours. Can I do better with a different stove?

I have an 8" chimney, and no funds to change that, so whatever I buy, it has to work with my current 8" black pipe, switching to triple wall through the attic and out the roof. It draws excellently with the Grandma bear. That has never been an issue.

I only burn very well dried hardwood. I have a small firewood business on the side, and burn oak, locust, maple, ash, and some fruitwood species, too. All very well seasoned a year and a half to 2 years, minimum.

I'm open to any brand stove that won't cost a lot of money to buy, works with my 8" chimney, and can increase an overnight burn time so the shop is above freezing temps in the morning when I go back to work.

Thanks for any help you can provide.View attachment 275694

I like your old mill machine!

 

[BKVP]

Maybe a wood furnace?

 

[hawkfan9]

Thanks for all the input.

Coaly,

I've never cleaned the glass. It stays pretty clean just from burning. I burn very dry wood, and maybe that has something to do with it. This photo is an older photo, and I've since learned to keep the temperature more in the middle green range.

Yes, I have 2 ecofans blowing heat in 2 different directions in the workshop. I also have an air cleaner up at ceiling height that distributes and cycles the air in the shop, and moves the heat around. None of this is shown in that picture.

This shop is where I spend all my days. I'm a custom cabinet and furniture maker, and I also have metalworking machinery in the shop, as well. I like vintage machinery, and my entire shop is filled with vintage machines I restored myself. I have a Monarch metalworking lathe and 2 different mills to make parts for my business, and to make parts for machine restorations when something is missing or broken.

I've chosen to live my life on my terms. I accept the risk of a fire by having a wood stove. I wouldn't have it any other way, and I don't give 2 hoots about an insurance claim. My agent is well aware of the wood burning stove. Honestly, I shouldn't even have to defend this......so I'll stop.

Here's a few pictures of my shop, for those of you that are interested...... Baxter Whitney 105 24" planer on the left, 16" Yates American #1 jointer on the right. Oliver 91D mortiser in the background on the left

Kearney and Trecker 2K universal mill-metalworking Monarch Series 61 18 1/2" X 54" toolroom lathe to the left. These have both been since moved to the other side of the shop, but this is the best photo I have of them.

1936 Yates American Y30 snowflake 30" bandsaw

1964 Powermatic 72 14" tablesaw. Full cast iron table extension.

Shop shot before some of the machines got moved around

Not all the wood goes in the stove

Thanks for all the help, gang.

 

[JaroMato]

This looks like a perfect candidate for a Rocket mass heater!

How often do you need to use the shop? Having the shop get to freezing temps over night must be hard!
Definitely will not cost 4000$

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Here thomas built a rocket mass shop heater.
Rocket mass shop heater

 

[hawkfan9]

Coaly,

I'd gladly buy a Papa bear if I could find one. I think I found a Grandpa bear....4 hour road trip each way. We'll see........I don't mind a good drive North.

 

[Hoytman]

Thanks for all the input.

Coaly,

I've never cleaned the glass. It stays pretty clean just from burning. I burn very dry wood, and maybe that has something to do with it. This photo is an older photo, and I've since learned to keep the temperature more in the middle green range.

Yes, I have 2 ecofans blowing heat in 2 different directions in the workshop. I also have an air cleaner up at ceiling height that distributes and cycles the air in the shop, and moves the heat around. None of this is shown in that picture.

This shop is where I spend all my days. I'm a custom cabinet and furniture maker, and I also have metalworking machinery in the shop, as well. I like vintage machinery, and my entire shop is filled with vintage machines I restored myself. I have a Monarch metalworking lathe and 2 different mills to make parts for my business, and to make parts for machine restorations when something is missing or broken.

I've chosen to live my life on my terms. I accept the risk of a fire by having a wood stove. I wouldn't have it any other way, and I don't give 2 hoots about an insurance claim. My agent is well aware of the wood burning stove. Honestly, I shouldn't even have to defend this......so I'll stop.

Here's a few pictures of my shop, for those of you that are interested...... Baxter Whitney 105 24" planer on the left, 16" Yates American #1 jointer on the right. Oliver 91D mortiser in the background on the left
View attachment 275735

Kearney and Trecker 2K universal mill-metalworking Monarch Series 61 18 1/2" X 54" toolroom lathe to the left. These have both been since moved to the other side of the shop, but this is the best photo I have of them.
View attachment 275736

1936 Yates American Y30 snowflake 30" bandsaw

View attachment 275737

1964 Powermatic 72 14" tablesaw. Full cast iron table extension.

View attachment 275738

Shop shot before some of the machines got moved around

View attachment 275739

Not all the wood goes in the stove

View attachment 275740

View attachment 275741

View attachment 275742

Thanks for all the help, gang.

Great post and rant.

 

[bholler]

Thanks for all the input.

Coaly,

I've never cleaned the glass. It stays pretty clean just from burning. I burn very dry wood, and maybe that has something to do with it. This photo is an older photo, and I've since learned to keep the temperature more in the middle green range.

Yes, I have 2 ecofans blowing heat in 2 different directions in the workshop. I also have an air cleaner up at ceiling height that distributes and cycles the air in the shop, and moves the heat around. None of this is shown in that picture.

This shop is where I spend all my days. I'm a custom cabinet and furniture maker, and I also have metalworking machinery in the shop, as well. I like vintage machinery, and my entire shop is filled with vintage machines I restored myself. I have a Monarch metalworking lathe and 2 different mills to make parts for my business, and to make parts for machine restorations when something is missing or broken.

I've chosen to live my life on my terms. I accept the risk of a fire by having a wood stove. I wouldn't have it any other way, and I don't give 2 hoots about an insurance claim. My agent is well aware of the wood burning stove. Honestly, I shouldn't even have to defend this......so I'll stop.

Here's a few pictures of my shop, for those of you that are interested...... Baxter Whitney 105 24" planer on the left, 16" Yates American #1 jointer on the right. Oliver 91D mortiser in the background on the left
View attachment 275735

Kearney and Trecker 2K universal mill-metalworking Monarch Series 61 18 1/2" X 54" toolroom lathe to the left. These have both been since moved to the other side of the shop, but this is the best photo I have of them.
View attachment 275736

1936 Yates American Y30 snowflake 30" bandsaw

View attachment 275737

1964 Powermatic 72 14" tablesaw. Full cast iron table extension.

View attachment 275738

Shop shot before some of the machines got moved around

View attachment 275739

Not all the wood goes in the stove

View attachment 275740

View attachment 275741

View attachment 275742

Thanks for all the help, gang.

No you don't have to defend it at all. I am just giving you information and making sure you know it is against code and the risks involved. I know them and chose to install a woodstove in my garage dispite the risks.

I also chose not to install one in my woodshop or my business shop because I determined the risk of loss was to great.

That is a decision for you to make. But be aware your agent will have no say in the outcome of a claim. That is up to adjusters and fire investigators or other inspectors they may call in like me.

 

[bholler]

And great looking shop with some fantastic old equipment as well. I was a custom cabinet maker for years before selling that business to work with my father in the chimney buisness

 

[clancey]

You people are so talented. I do not know anything about stoves but I found a fisher pa bear on e-bay that sells for 300.. Don't know one stove from another but I read the post and trying to help.. Your shop is beautiful and lots of love in it...clancey

Wood Heating Stoves for Sale - eBay

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For Sale - Fisher Grandpa Bear stove

this stove is in a house I bought, I do not burn wood. 1) what is it worth ??? if I list it locally?? 2) if you are interested in it and willing to...

firewoodhoardersclub.com

Sorry that second one looks like a old ad or something but it gives a little history on it..Sorry..Most likely not for sale anymore.

 

[coaly]

Coaly, how common were the XL’s?

Not very. They were also called the Restaurant Model. They come up for sale rarely on eBay and Craigslist. It took years to document 10 owners, a few here. I’ve seen a few sell under 500 with the regular Fir Tree doors. The Sun doors were available in nickel or brass and demand a premium. I have the only known new, unfired one that came from CA to PA off eBay for $1125 with shipping years ago.

 

[hawkfan9]

Picking up a Grandpa Bear stove tomorrow. It's gonna need a complete workover, but that's fine with me. I'll sandblast, repair any damage, and repaint.

What is a good quality black paint for a Fisher stove? Do you guys just use the Rustoleum high heat product, or is there a preferred paint? Thanks for any guidance. I have spray equipment here, so that's not an issue. I don't need to buy a rattle can.

 

[bholler]

Picking up a Grandpa Bear stove tomorrow. It's gonna need a complete workover, but that's fine with me. I'll sandblast, repair any damage, and repaint.

What is a good quality black paint for a Fisher stove? Do you guys just use the Rustoleum high heat product, or is there a preferred paint? Thanks for any guidance. I have spray equipment here, so that's not an issue. I don't need to buy a rattle can.

Stove brite or perkins the rust-oleum stuff is crap. I always just use rattle cans it isn't worth the effort of cleaning up a gun for the little bit of money savings. I just don't see that s grandpa is going to make much difference from a grandma

 

[coaly]

Picking up a Grandpa Bear stove tomorrow. It's gonna need a complete workover, but that's fine with me. I'll sandblast, repair any damage, and repaint.

What is a good quality black paint for a Fisher stove? Do you guys just use the Rustoleum high heat product, or is there a preferred paint? Thanks for any guidance. I have spray equipment here, so that's not an issue. I don't need to buy a rattle can.

StoveBright Satin Black was original. It's available in quarts.
Your brown Grandma was StoveBright Metallic Brown. Still available. That was called the Brass and Glass stove too.

Here's where the optional blower mounted on the rear shield. It was bent with a curl at the top to direct heat forward.