Help My head hurts

[fishing]

My wife and I are going to buy a wood stove to put into our house. We have an older home with all its problems. 1800sq. We want it to be our main source of heat. The layout of our home is shaped like a "V" with the stove placed in the middle. Now the problem is which stove. I would like a top loading stove, but not a priority. I like the lopi cast, the Quadra Isle Royale and the Jotul Fire? Anyway which is the best stove and would the lopi be big enough. I also thought about the Quadra 3100,4100 series. I live in Colorado at an elevation of 7600ft and winters that hit -30. I will be burning fur. looking for 24/7

Any advise would be greatly appreciated

 

[webbie]

Hopefully, MSG will check in with stoves that work well at high elevations!

If burning softwood, you are probably going to want a large firebox - over 3.25 cubic feet would be real nice. Those are all good brands, but Jotul is probably the top-of-the-line as far as quality and experience goes...in cast stoves. It's hard to beat 150 years of making stoves (Jotul) plus Norwegian castings. I think the other two are using Asian castings, which are fine (these days), but only a Jotul is a Jotul. Of course, there are other factors involved in your case (elevation)....ask your dealer if any problems are had with these stoves at elevation. Or, if MSG does not respond to this thread, send a PM (Private Message) to MSG - he lives at that elevation in Co. and was a stove dealer for many years.

 

[jtp10181]

We have quite a few Isle Royal's out there and have not really had any problems.

There is one out there with the (now discontinued) creme finish that has random patches of it falling off, its about two years old. One year out of the normal "finish" warranty. After seeing the pictures Quadrafire is replacing the unit with the customers choice, black or mahogany. Basically what I'm saying, is that I know Quad stands behind their product. I have done a few warranty replacements over the last couple years and it always goes smooth. FYI the % of replaced units is very small compared to how many we sell.

If need be I can call Quad and ask about your situation. Do you know about how much chimney you will end up with (height)? Will there be any offsets?

 

[BrotherBart]

That Isle Royale ought to be all the stove you ever need. Large capacity for the fir, top loader and everybody here that has one seems to love'em.

It is a bunch of stove for that size house but -30 is, well, -30 after all.

 

[nshif]

I dont know about the Isle but the 4300 doesnt recomend any offsets above 4000' . But I think you only need 12- 14' of height. Should be a fine stove for your location but we will see what MSG has to say. ( if hes not changing diapers )

 

[Jags]

I agree with the suggestions of a large firebox. If you are going to be burning doug-fir for a 24/7 fire, go big fire box. I think the wood will typically by nature keep you in a pretty safe temp zone when tuned down for those longer burns. But on the other hand, I would probably get light headed at that altitude. Not enough oxygen for me, not sure about the wood. :lol:

 

[Highbeam]

I don't know guys, a big fire box is being recommended for longer burn times with the soft wood right? But, a big firebox running at a high enough temperature to stay clean will cook him out. Big fireboxes mean big stoves with lots of btu output. People actually burning these things all seem to run their stoves at 500-600 on top which is good for secondary combustion. I actually downsized from a 3+ CF firebox to a 2.3 CF box despite burning only softwoods since a monster stove would produce monster heat.

 

[begreen]

It's really hard to compare Western WA temps and burning to Colorado. We rarely go below 25 degrees. That's 55 degrees away from CO lows. In really cold climates one needs reserves. True, it's probably not as efficient at 25 but, when it's below zero and blowing hard, then one really needs the heat. As a work around you burn smaller fires when it's 30 and not -30. As it gets cooler you can burn larger splits to slow the fire down a bit. The stove will burn with a stove top temp of 450 and still get good secondary combustion.

An analogy would be trucks. True, you will get lower gas mileage with a big truck + V8. And if all you are doing is commuting and an occasional run to Home Depot, a smaller 4 cyl., Toyota or Ranger will do you well and save a lot of gas. But, if part of your regular route includes hauling a horse trailer over the mountains, you need that reserve power. It's either that or two stoves or other form of secondary heat.

MSG repeatedly has told us that wood growing at high altitudes is much denser than it's lowland cousins and burns more like hardwood. It should be fine. Hopefully Jags and Carpneil will check in soon and let you know how they burn over a wide range of temps with the Isle Royale. The Jotul will also serve you well. Their finish is excellent. You might also want to look at a Pacific Energy T6 Alderlea which, though it's a front loader, works best with the logs loaded north/south (straight in, as opposed to sideways). That prevents log roll out and enhances the burn. The PE Summit / T6 Alderlea is noted for long burns and nice regulation. Other stoves might include a Blaze King, Quad, Englander, VC etc.

 

[Jags]

I don't know guys, a big fire box is being recommended for longer burn times with the soft wood right? But, a big firebox running at a high enough temperature to stay clean will cook him out. Big fireboxes mean big stoves with lots of btu output. People actually burning these things all seem to run their stoves at 500-600 on top which is good for secondary combustion. I actually downsized from a 3+ CF firebox to a 2.3 CF box despite burning only softwoods since a monster stove would produce monster heat.

What kind of burn times are you getting with the 2.3 CF and softwood fires? I have heard wide ranges of burn times. You are correct in saying that a big box with proper temps is going to create big heat. On the other hand, if you keep the stove at the low end of the "safe zone" it is one way to extend burn times from softer woods. I don't know how often Fishing will be able to load the stove to obtain the 24/7 burn that he is looking for.

I do know that with the Isle Royal, with anything less than a well established fire, a good load of HARD WOOD, you will not exceed a 9 hr burn time. With soft wood, you probably wont even have enough coal to light another fire off of. I have exceeded 10hrs of burn time, with an easy reload startup, but that was using osage and hickory as the fuel. Just giving real world examples of one of the stoves being considered. The Isle is a great stove, but it isn't magical. Big box = more pounds of fuel. Can this be done without roasting the occupants WHILE maintaining a safe fire? I am sure someone on the forum is fighting this battle.

 

[Highbeam]

Haven't burned the smaller box yet but I am sure the times will be less than the fully loaded 3+ CF box. Also less heat. I should add that I didn't downsize the box because it was too big but I switched to a freestanding and the smaller stove spec'd out as being more appropriate.

At some point, say a 1000 SF house, the big box full of softwood will just make too much heat. The benefit is avoiding the frequent reloadings.

 

[stoveguy2esw]

I dont know about the Isle but the 4300 doesnt recomend any offsets above 4000' . But I think you only need 12- 14' of height. Should be a fine stove for your location but we will see what MSG has to say. ( if hes not changing diapers )

hey , i miss changing diapers, my daughter is starting high school this fall. oh how i yearn for the simple problems such as a wet diaper (instead of worrying about her getting a drivers liscense)

 

[stoveguy2esw]

I don't know guys, a big fire box is being recommended for longer burn times with the soft wood right? But, a big firebox running at a high enough temperature to stay clean will cook him out. Big fireboxes mean big stoves with lots of btu output. People actually burning these things all seem to run their stoves at 500-600 on top which is good for secondary combustion. I actually downsized from a 3+ CF firebox to a 2.3 CF box despite burning only softwoods since a monster stove would produce monster heat.

actually , a big box unit can be "settled down" even with softwoods if the draft is strong enough .05 overpressure or better) this will allow enough pull for active secondaries without ripping through the wood with the primary air. this should keep the burn clean (obviously from a cold start will be a bit dirty in the first hour at most , but once its settled in , it can be settled down nicely.

 

[fishing]

The lenght of the chimney is going to be 13-14ft. I was hoping to get 8hr burn times. The lopi leyden top load claims 12- 18 hrs burn and I can pick it up for $1500. I can pick up the Isle Royal or other Quads from local dealer for $1700. Both buisness have personal friends of mine working there and are giving me a great deal. Should I just buy a Quad steel or cast. I just finished hauling the last of my wood supply (8 cords) but I have no stove.

Guys thanks for all your help and input.
fishing

 

[stoveguy2esw]

The lenght of the chimney is going to be 13-14ft. I was hoping to get 8hr burn times. The lopi leyden top load claims 12- 18 hrs burn and I can pick it up for $1500. I can pick up the Isle Royal or other Quads from local dealer for $1700. Both buisness have personal friends of mine working there and are giving me a great deal. Should I just buy a Quad steel or cast. I just finished hauling the last of my wood supply (8 cords) but I have no stove.

Guys thanks for all your help and input.
fishing

straight up prefab chimney? lopi is nice , quads are solid as well, i have no preferance between the 2 brands ( i kinda compete with them but i know quality and either will serve you well) 8 hours max i'd say with softwoods. hopefully input from MSG with regard to the flue height, as for steel/cast arguement i aint going there or my head will hurt lol. personally . i'd go with whichever suits the look you are wanting, you cant go wrong either way but i'd go with minimum 2.5 CF firebox, up to 3.5 probably in a non-cat , just personal preferance with softwood

 

[BrotherBart]

Any of them are going to make you a good heater. If you go with a steel stove the Quad 4300 should be a good one. A dealer here got one in and I went to look at it yesterday. Good build quality and the firebox capacity should provide an adequate burn time.

 

[begreen]

fishing, do you have the clearances required for the Lopi Leyden? The Quads have closer clearances if that helps.

 

[fishing]

Stove pipe will go straight up and clearances are not a big issue.

 

[DriftWood]

I would put in the biggest soapstone stove that would fit. I visited MSG at his old store in Boulder, CO he said the mass of the soapstone stove really works for the soft woods he and you will burn. But you must remember we are both soapstone guys.

 

[fishing]

Is soapstone really that efficent? I realize the concept of mass and heat retention, but does soapstone really retain the heat that long? What is the surface temp of a soapstone? We looked at a few but dont know if the cost is worth it.

 

[begreen]

There are lots of posts here on soapstone burning. They are known for their even heat. Soapstone releases the heat slower than cast or steel stoves so it provides usable heat for a few hours after the fire dies down. Stove top temperature is around 500-600.

FWIW, if it weren't for my SO's desires, we'd have a soapstone stove in this old house.