Help please, before i freeze to death

[xesvuli420]

Oh man I am so exhausted trying to figure this crap out. Sorry for the language, but its getting old and cold, and I'm sick to my stomach with this stupid wood stove.

I decided a few weeks ago to convert from electric heat to wood heat... It has been a nightmare every step of the way.

This is my first stove, so I know nothing, but people have been telling me things along the way.

Long dramatic story shortened, I have a wood stove that I cannot get to work with the door closed. Let me go over my set up.

1200sq ft Pleasent Hearth Pleasant Hearth 1,200 sq. ft. EPA Certified Wood-Burning Stove with small Blower-HWS-224172MH - The Home Depot
6' of 6" single wall stove pipe to the ceiling
7' of 6" doule wall stove pipe from the ceiling through the roof

Damper on stovepipe (people and owners manual say I don't need, but good to have for emergency)
Damper\air inlet on bottom of stove (that doesn't seem to do anything)

Here are some pictures...



I get a good fire going with dampers fully open, and close the door to a crack until I get a good red coal bed, Then I throw in some medium sized wood and let a good fire start. At this point I close the door, and the fire immediately starts to die. Sometimes it takes a few minutes, sometimes it may take 15... but end result is no flame! I open the door back a crack and the fire will come back. It will smolder all night until only coals are left, but I fear this may not be enough to keep us warm. Ive tried big pieces of wood, little pieces of wood, full fire box, almost empty firebox, Dampers open, Dampers closed, Dampers in between, one closed one open, vise versa, nothing seems to help except having door cracked. Per the thermometer, the max I can get 18" above the stove on the pipe is around 300 degrees. I can't even boil a pot of water sitting on top of the stove. I have been trying different things for 2 weeks now, and I am out of ideas. I am desperate for your help

I don't know if the draw is good or bad, but it is present. When I crack the door its like a vacuum cleaner is hooked to my stove. open the door a little wider and it calms down... but no smoke comes out of the stove as long as I have the stovepipe damper open.

Ive tried 6 month old wood
Ive tried year old wood
Ive tried 3 year old wood
Ive tried store bought wood

Here is the stove RIGHT NOW with 16 month seasoned wood in it...

As you can see the coal bed is red hot, and the logs are charred from where I had the door open... but shut the door, and BAM! Pitiful little wood stove!

Pictures and video are available if needed, just ask!

Thank you all so very very much!

 

[jatoxico]

Hi and welcome. You are frustrated but your situation is not unusual for a new burner. If you stick around here for a bit and go through the problem step by step you will have success.

The usual suspects are;

• The wood. Must be <20% moisture which can take two years from the time it has been split and stacked. If you used store bought wood with same results then we can put that aside for now although wood quality is almost always at least part of the problem.

• Air control. I do not know your stove but the air control must be in the full open position and then slowly lowered in stages every 15 min or so until the fire recovers and rarely, shut down completely. Fire needs air and should be brisk.

• Draft. Your stack sounds a bit short (13'). Even though it's drafting with the door open you need enough draft to pull air through when the door is closed. Check your manual and see what the minimum is. Even so individual installs can require more or less chimney. It may be you need to add another section of pipe to get adequate draft.

Who installed the stove and where is it located in the house? Are there any trees or other obstructions like another roof?

 

[Cynnergy]

It might be worth checking your chimney/cap and trying again with wood that is confirmed to be dry. You could have clogged the cap/chimney using wet wood, which then caused subsequent problems?

 

[pdxdave]

Hate to say it, but it could well just be a crappy stove. I know many people on here will espouse that idea that any non/cat epa stove runs essentially the same, with size being the only significant difference, but my experience has shown this not to be true. Some stoves just dont burn great, regardless of the wood. See if you can find other reviews on the stove (not just from the home depot site).

 

[BrotherBart]

What chimney cap is that?

 

[saskwoodburner]

Just a few questions and thoughts. How far is that single wall pipe from the wall?

You're running double wall stove pipe through the attic?

How much Class A chimney do you have on top of the double wall pipe?

Does it meet the 10-3-2? (I think that's the one) rule?

I see some tall trees next to your house in the photo, how close and how much higher than the house?

 

[kennyp2339]

It's not the stove, my bet is the fuel. Your wood although it maybe old might still be to wet. Take a larger split of your oldest pieces. Make small splits out of it 2" wide, put those on the fire let it catch then close the door, you should have good flames, even if it's a little wet. Do you notice any hissing coming from the bigger splits in the stove?
Don't give up, generally it's a fuel quality issue.

 

[fire_man]

Your problem is so severe I don't think it's just a stack-draft issue. You may be short on stack height, but I don't think this is your primary problem.

It sounds like something is wrong with the air control assembly. The control mechanism that allows air to enter the firebox is not working properly. You should confirm the plate controlling air entry is working and there is no blockage into the stove firebox.

 

[begreen]

Modern stoves need 15-16' minimum chimney. With insufficient draft they may perform poorly. As a test get 4ft of some cheap 6" vent pipe, remove the cap and shove the pipe, crimped edge down, as a temporary extension pipe. Do this on a calm day so that the extension doesn't blow down. We've seen a dramatic improvement with some stoves (like Napoleons) by increasing draft. These stoves have more restrictive or longer secondary air paths than some others. Milder outdoor temps will make the draft poorer.

See if that greatly improves the situation with your best wood or even better use some construction scrap 2x4s for test wood. If it does work then add at least 3ft more chimney and put a brace at 5ft above the chimney roof exit.

Also note, the upper rim of the storm collar needs to be silicone caulked where it meets the chimney.

 

[kennyp2339]

Hmmm, quick idea, open ur damper all the way, get everything glowing, crumble pieces of newspaper, throw them in close the door. If it's a air control issue the paper should just glow, It's important to have the damper / air control fully open, double check ur manual to make sure your pulling it the right way, sometimes all the way out closes the air. If the air is open the pieces should lite off and keep burning strong while the door is shut

 

[jatoxico]

Hate to say it, but it could well just be a crappy stove. I know many people on here will espouse that idea that any non/cat epa stove runs essentially the same, with size being the only significant difference, but my experience has shown this not to be true. Some stoves just dont burn great, regardless of the wood. See if you can find other reviews on the stove (not just from the home depot site).

Read a few reviews of the stove. Seems like a decent unit with a number of happy people. Something may not be connected correctly. I've heard of people finding that their air control knob wasn't functional because it became disconnected. I wouldn't blame the stove yet.

 

[jatoxico]

Modern stoves need 15-16' minimum chimney.

I found the manual online. Manufacturer says 15' from floor to cap so sounds like pipe is at the absolute minimum.

 

[begreen]

I found the manual online. Manufacturer says 15' from floor to cap so sounds like pipe is at the absolute minimum.

Yes just the bare minimum. If this is a draft issue geography may also come into play. We've seen adding just 24" of pipe make a notable difference in some cases.

This situation happens every year at this time in new installs, sometimes several posts a week. 90% of the time it is either the wood or insufficient draft. But sometimes there are other mitigating factors like screen plugged with newspaper ash, or poor installation with large air leaks in the stove pipe or faulty air control linkage, etc..

 

[Nick Mystic]

I can't offer any further advice on helping your stove burn better, but I did want to bring to your attention that you need to get some hearth protection for the front of your stove. If you check your manual I suspect you'll find a section on clearance requirements. Most stoves require a minimum of 16" - 18" depending on where you live. It won't be long before you have a hot coal flop out while you are reloading and then your laminate or wood floor is going to be damaged. Or, worse yet, if the hot ember escapes your attention you might have a house fire. Good luck on getting the stove burning better.

 

[begreen]

Goo catch Nick, the hearth pad is definitely undersized and does not meet the mfg. requirements.

 

[jatoxico]

What chimney cap is that?

+1. Looks kind of restrictive from the pic. I wonder if the cap was popped if things would improve.

 

[begreen]

Looks like Supervent Deluxe rain cap

 

[mass_burner]

OP, did you try with a load of compressed log/brick to rule out fuel?

 

[xesvuli420]

Hey guys!

Thanks so much for the reply's. I would have been here sooner but this websites notification system is broken apparently. I added a 3' extension to my chimney, and it had absolutely zero noticeable effect. Flame still goes out with door shut. That really sucks because I was praying that was the issue. As for some of the other comments...

Who installed the stove and where is it located in the house? Are there any trees or other obstructions like another roof?
I did. It is in my living room upstairs. There are no trees or obstructions that I would think could be blocking any draft.

How far is that single wall pipe from the wall?
too close I know, but not relevant to the issue at hand.

You're running double wall stove pipe through the attic?
Absolutely, with 2" clearence all the way up.

How much Class A chimney do you have on top of the double wall pipe?
I have stove hooked to 2 and a half joints of this...
http://www.lowes.com/ProductDisplay?productId=3307936

also using this kit...
http://www.lowes.com/pd_37624-85178-JSC6DCSP___?productId=3134415&pl=1&Ntt=supervent

with (now) 3 joints of this...
http://www.lowes.com/pd_37620-85178-JSC6SA3_0__?productId=3134409&Ntt=

and 1 extra 1' joint of above pipe.

Does it meet the 10-3-2? (I think that's the one) rule?
I would say it met it perfectly. almost exactly. See pictures above

I see some tall trees next to your house in the photo, how close and how much higher than the house?
A bit higher, but a good bit away.

Do you notice any hissing coming from the bigger splits in the stove
No hissing whatsoever.

the upper rim of the storm collar needs to be silicone caulked where it meets the chimney
Absolutely, the picture was taken as I was caulking, and before I did the rim, and noticed I missed putting in the corner sheet metal screw =o)

Manufacturer says 15' from floor to cap so sounds like pipe is at the absolute minimum
I would say exactly the minimum. 3' stove, 5' single wall, 7' double wall.. exactly 15'... but now 18, and still no better

But sometimes there are other mitigating factors like screen plugged with newspaper ash
Heres whats odd to me. The instructional video says after you get your bed of coals, spread the coals in the middle of the floor of the stove into a trough for the air inlet to breath... I decided to check and see if maybe this was blocked, so I cleaned out the stove and removed the floor bricks... and I didn't see ANY thing that would deliver air. At the back of the stove there is a 2" wide section in the middle that runs from the floor to the ceiling of the stove. Could this be the air chamber from the inlet? I couldn't find any sign of anything in the floor.

did you try with a load of compressed log/brick to rule out fuel
No not yet, I assumed that the wood bundle would be sufficient.

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

I decided to check and see if maybe this was blocked, so I cleaned out the stove and removed the floor bricks... and I didn't see ANY thing that would deliver air.

I don't know that stove, but it's possible that it's defective and you don't have a functional air inlet. I suggest calling the manufacturer. See what they have to say, and make sure you get either a really good description, or better yet, a picture of that air inlet system.

 

[jatoxico]

Try and verify that the primary air control is functioning. Clean stove out add newspaper and light then close door. Open and close air and see if it makes a difference.

 

[xesvuli420]

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[xman23]

Not that I know the stove, but there must be a primary air supply with a control lever to operate a air supply door. Find it and make sure it's working and not plugged up with some packing material. Also check the secondary air supply. Strange looking cap, but I assume it works as long as it's not plugged. Hot fires are a bit hard to get going until it gets cold out, due to weaker draft. That and wet wood, and can be tough to keep the wood burning. If what everything the brothers have suggested checks out. I think it's wet wood. Burn with the door cracked, refilling as you get room to do. Watch the stove top temp, Reload with a lots of small splits. Get 4 inches of coals. Once you get the stove hot the wet wood will be less of an issue with the door closed.

 

[begreen]

I still suspect low draft due to mild temps and minimal chimney. If so it will get better as the weather gets colder.

What will not get better are the multiple install issues with too small hearth pad, too close clearances to the rear for the pipe and the stove. That rear pad on the wall is not a valid clearance reducer. If safety is not a concern then maybe it's better that the stove is running cool.

 

[xesvuli420]

-edit
nevermind