help with a new hearth pad

[judeaboo]

Hello. I would like some advice on putting in a new hearth pad for the least amount of money possible. We have a Resolute Acclaim Wood stove Model # 2490. The current hearth pad is not large enough and has broken tiles. I looked into purchasing new ones and they range from $400-600 and we just don't have that to spend. What would be the least expensive way to get a safe floor protector? Thank you so much for your help!
Judeaboo

 

[jqgs214]

I'm making my own. My current hearth extends 15" front my fireplace front. I need 18" for my new insert. To cut down on the work (I'm busy and lazy) I bought 12" tiles and will be putting 2 rows down. First need to cut up my rug and remove the hardwood flooring underneath. I will then build up the flooring with durarock or micore whichever I can find locally to the same level as the existing cement hearth. I then will tile over the top of the whole new area and existing cement hearth. My 24"x60" area will be filled with 12x12 tiles. I bought expensive ones (the wife liked em) and those 2 boxes cost me 160.00. You can get ALOT cheaper tile though. Then its some thinset and grout and I'm done. Dont have to cut a single tile. (told ya I'm lazy). I will post pic during the process.

 

[stoveguy13]

the one thing you need to make sure of when you build you own pad this that it has the proper "r" value how old is the vc and does it tell you what it requiers for a "r"value alot of the time it is cheaper to purchase one then going threw the hassel of trying to figure it out

 

[judeaboo]

what is a "vc"?

 

[restorer]

Not knowing where you are located, do you have a Sutherlands Lumber close? They have some very good hearth pads at less than $200. Might be worth checking out on line to see if they will ship from a close by store. I don't think you can buy the materials for what they are selling them for, let alone include your labor.

BTW, VC is short for Vermont Casting. The stove maker. Just a Hearth shorthand, Welcome to the burnerette.

 

[Gooserider]

Hello. I would like some advice on putting in a new hearth pad for the least amount of money possible. We have a Resolute Acclaim Wood stove Model # 2490. The current hearth pad is not large enough and has broken tiles. I looked into purchasing new ones and they range from $400-600 and we just don't have that to spend. What would be the least expensive way to get a safe floor protector? Thank you so much for your help!
Judeaboo

Depends on what your existing floor / hearth is made from, and the exact R-value that your stove (a VC or Vermont Castings brand) requires, then on what you want in the way of "style"

First look in the manual for your stove, and it should give you a specification for thesize and R-value of the floor protection you need. The R-value is essentially the amount of insulation value your hearth protection must provide in order to ensure that the heat coming off the underside of the stove won't set the floor on fire. The easiest way to go after that is to look at (broken link removed to http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/horvalue.htm) and figure out the best combination of materials that will stack up to give you AT LEAST that high of an R-value. If you are trying to match the height of an existing floor you will have to pretty much go with at least one layer of Micore, which is expensive, but if that isn't an issue, probably the cheapest way to go is to stack up layers of cement board or durock and cover it with ceramic tile.

Another approach is to build a frame out of steel studs and cover it with a couple layers of Durock and tile... The air space underneath will act as an insulator as well.

A few fine points -

1. It doesn't explicitly add R-value, but many people like to put a layer of thin sheet metal between two of the Durock layers to act as a heat spreader.

2. When screwing layers together, it is best to use short screws that only tie two layers together at a time rather than long screws that go through the entire stack, as this avoids having a single continuous heat path (off set the short screws from each other) - again this isn't explicitly specified, but is considered "good practice"

3. Go easy on the number of screws - the pad isn't going anywhere with several hundred pounds of stove sitting on it!

4. It can pay to go oversize / thickness on your floor protection if you ever think you might want a bigger stove - it increases the odds that the upgraded stove won't require you to upgrade the pad as well...

5. US codes require 16" of fireproof floor (hearth pad) in front of loading doors, the Canadians require 18". The theory is to catch any sparks or burning debris that might fall out of the stove. I see it as cheap insurance to go for at least the Canadian distance, maybe even two feet...

6. If you are using a stack of cement board type design, you'll probably want a frame of some sort around it. You can use wood but only if the pad is larger than the minimum size - the wood can't fall inside the minimum pad size area.

If you do a search on Hearth Design in this forum or in the gallery, you will see lots of discussion on how to design and build a safe hearth.

Gooserider

 

[judeaboo]

Wow! This is great! Thank you everyone. I have another couple questions. One day I was putting up some apple sauce and all my burners on my stove were full so I thought why not put a pot on the wood stove. Oh the smell was wonderful! But~ I spilled some and it ate the paint It looks awful. Can I sand it and paint the bare spots? Does anyone know if Vermont Castings has paint to match or know what their contact # is? My next question is how on earth can I keep the birds from getting in my stove? I had a guy come out to the house to sweep and clean the chimney but he wouldn't even clean the higher parts b/c it is to tall much less install what I need to keep the birds out. Any ideas? Once again I can't thank you guys enough for all your help!

I live in northern Michigan!
Judeaboo

 

[Gooserider]

Wow! This is great! Thank you everyone. I have another couple questions. One day I was putting up some apple sauce and all my burners on my stove were full so I thought why not put a pot on the wood stove. Oh the smell was wonderful! But~ I spilled some and it ate the paint It looks awful. Can I sand it and paint the bare spots? Does anyone know if Vermont Castings has paint to match or know what their contact # is?

My understanding is that except for the matte black stoves, the finish on most VC stoves is baked enamel, and as such can't really be repainted by the consumer. One of the problems with baked enamel, which essentially is melted glass, is that it is vulnerable to thermal shock - if you spill liquids on a hot stove, the enamel will chip off. You might be able to hide it some with appliance touchup paint, but I don't know if that will work on a stove or not (or how to match the colors) About the only option is to replace the damaged part, but that is likely to be fairly expensive and difficult as it requires partial rebuilding of the stove.

OTOH, if you have one of the black stoves, you may be in luck. Any good stove shop should have ultra high temperature black spray paint that will match quite well. Just be aware when using it, that the warning to use only in well ventilated areas is serious, and also that it will STINK severely the first few times you use the stove after painting it, so you should plan on doing a few break-in fires early in the season when you can have all the windows open.

My next question is how on earth can I keep the birds from getting in my stove? I had a guy come out to the house to sweep and clean the chimney but he wouldn't even clean the higher parts b/c it is to tall much less install what I need to keep the birds out. Any ideas? Once again I can't thank you guys enough for all your help!

I live in northern Michigan!
Judeaboo

The only way to keep the birds out is to put a chimney cap on that has a screen to stop them. (or tight enough baffles) This can cause it's own problems, as those extra baffles or screens can accumulate creosote and get plugged, requiring a trip up to clean them. You sound like me in that you have a "difficult" chimney to reach, but a GOOD sweep should be able to handle the job of reaching the top and putting a cap on, although he does the rest of the cleaning from the bottom. (Note that if cleaning from the bottom, he should still be getting the FULL length of the chimney, especially since most of the crud will be in the top few feet - only cleaning the bottom isn't much better than not cleaning at all!

Gooserider

 

[titan]

Buy a "cat" stove.....that'll take care of them damn birds.

 

[restorer]

Buy a "cat" stove.....that'll take care of them damn birds.

Damn, would take a Canadian to make me spew a mouthful of their national drink over the screen. Does this mean we can now call Cat stove owners, Meowers?????????

 

[Gooserider]

Buy a "cat" stove.....that'll take care of them damn birds.

Damn, would take a Canadian to make me spew a mouthful of their national drink over the screen. Does this mean we can now call Cat stove owners, Meowers?????????

Nahh... That would be too catty :exclaim: %-P

Gooserider

 

[restorer]

Back reading the posts, the stove if it was enamel would not have the finish removed by apple sauce. OTOH, have you considered making cider or apple jack from those apples????? If it can remove the enamel from a stove it can fly a plane, even mine.

Seriously, you have a painted stove, the damage was probably done from the carmelization of the sugars that glued themselves to the paint, and you as a good tender, cleaned it all off. High temp stove black paint is pretty generic, but if you are worried go to the dealer of your stove and ask for their paint. The $4 can becomes $8, but it will make you feel better.

 

[judeaboo]

Gooserider,

Thank you for your input!"baked enamel, which essentially is melted glass, is that it is vulnerable to thermal shock - if you spill liquids on a hot stove, the enamel will chip off." This is exactly what happened we do have a baked enamel stove. I will try appliance paint but, I don't think they make navy blue.
("Note that if cleaning from the bottom, he should still be getting the FULL length of the chimney, especially since most of the crud will be in the top few feet - only cleaning the bottom isn’t much better than not cleaning at all!" This is not good. I need to get the top cleaned. I better look into another guy or getting the tools myself. Hey had anyone tried those logs for cleaning I've never tried them they seem like a gimmick?
There was another question I had. I was surfing the forum and noticed that some people burn with pine? I have tons of pine but, NEVER burn this in my wood stove. I thought it caused to much creosote is this right? ( we have been clearing 5 acres of pine and just burn it outside ) Maybe it wouldn't hurt to just use some as kindling? Thanks everyone.
Judeaboo

 

[ecfinn]

There was another question I had. I was surfing the forum and noticed that some people burn with pine? I have tons of pine but, NEVER burn this in my wood stove. I thought it caused to much creosote is this right? ( we have been clearing 5 acres of pine and just burn it outside ) Maybe it wouldn't hurt to just use some as kindling? Thanks everyone.
Judeaboo

That's an old wive's tale, but one that has spread around quite well I must admit. You can burn any wood in your stove as long as its properly seasoned, pine included. This past winter was my first with the insert and I burned whatever I could find that that was seasoned. Put about 3.5-4 cords through it and cleaned chimney once at the end of the year. Small buildup of flaky stuff at top of chimney but nothing too bad. Essentially as long as you're burning hot enough you shouldn't have problems with creosote buildup. Its when you burn cooler or burn un-seasoned wood that you have issues...

Eric

 

[Gooserider]

Gooserider,

Thank you for your input!"baked enamel, which essentially is melted glass, is that it is vulnerable to thermal shock - if you spill liquids on a hot stove, the enamel will chip off." This is exactly what happened we do have a baked enamel stove. I will try appliance paint but, I don't think they make navy blue.

I would talk to your local stove shop, or possibly contact VC to see if they make a reccomended product. I wouldn't have to great a hope for an exact match, but something that would at least hide the damage is probably the best you can do short of parts replacement.

("Note that if cleaning from the bottom, he should still be getting the FULL length of the chimney, especially since most of the crud will be in the top few feet - only cleaning the bottom isn’t much better than not cleaning at all!" This is not good. I need to get the top cleaned. I better look into another guy or getting the tools myself. Hey had anyone tried those logs for cleaning I've never tried them they seem like a gimmick?

The "cleaning logs" are a gimmick, so are the various powders and potions of different sorts that you will see advertised. The only effective way to clean a chimney is pure mechanical scrubbing. The tools aren't that expensive, especially if you do as I did and substitute PVC electrical conduit and plumbing fittings for the specialized cleaning rods. It is possible to clean from the bottom, but when doing so it is VITAL that you get all the way to the top of the chimney - go outside and look, if you can't see the brush you need to go up some more! Probably the toughest part is choosing and getting the right brush, which involves getting an exact measurment on the chimney, and determining if you have a tile or stainless lining. (Neither is that hard) I had a lengthy thread over in "The Gear" on cleaning my chimney.

There was another question I had. I was surfing the forum and noticed that some people burn with pine? I have tons of pine but, NEVER burn this in my wood stove. I thought it caused to much creosote is this right? ( we have been clearing 5 acres of pine and just burn it outside ) Maybe it wouldn't hurt to just use some as kindling? Thanks everyone.
Judeaboo

As long as it is DRY, well seasoned, there is no reason you can't burn pine or other "softwoods" as long as you burn them reasonably hot. It is the moisture in wood that makes creosote, not the kind of wood. The downside of pine and such is that the wood is not as good of a fuel, it tends to make shorter / hotter fires, and not be good for getting overnight long duration burns. Folks with a good supply of both tend to put them in different piles, and use the pine for intermittent spring and fall "take the chill off" burns, or during the daytime when they are up and around for frequent stove loading; and use the Oak and hardwoods for the wintertime 24/7 serious heating.

Gooserider