Help with Englander NC13 temps

Wacky2000

New Member
Dec 10, 2016
9
New lebanon
I am about 2 weeks into owning this stove. It’s the first epa stove with burn tubes in the top that I have owned. My previous stove was a epa rocket stove. I could really use some help figuring this thing out. So I can start a fire in the nc13 with no problems. I let it heat up to 400 and close the air a 1/3. Then when it hits 450 another 1/3. And at 500 I close it to about a 1/8 inch from fully closed. And the stove jumps up to 600. Then on a hot reload it’s nothing for it to hit 660 with the same process on shutting it down. Englander told me anything over 600 is an overfire. My setup is a 16 foot straight up and out the roof. Single wall pipe to the tripe wall thru the attic. My wood has seasoned for a little over a year. One burning mostly ash and walnut. And sometime a piece of oak that’s a year and a half old. It seem no matter what I do I can’t keep the stove away from the 600 degree mark. I would like to stay around 500. So does this stove just run that hot or am I doing something wrong? My stove pipe was inspected last year and the sweep said everything was great and a prefect install
 

jwfirebird

Feeling the Heat
Sep 18, 2017
310
western ny
if its hot, I reload mine and leave it on low.

cant always trust the gauge either, when I tested mine with an ir gun it was like a hundred off at first then has gotten to about 50 deg off
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
86,546
South Puget Sound, WA
I am about 2 weeks into owning this stove. It’s the first epa stove with burn tubes in the top that I have owned. My previous stove was a epa rocket stove. I could really use some help figuring this thing out. So I can start a fire in the nc13 with no problems. I let it heat up to 400 and close the air a 1/3. Then when it hits 450 another 1/3. And at 500 I close it to about a 1/8 inch from fully closed. And the stove jumps up to 600. Then on a hot reload it’s nothing for it to hit 660 with the same process on shutting it down. Englander told me anything over 600 is an overfire. My setup is a 16 foot straight up and out the roof. Single wall pipe to the tripe wall thru the attic. My wood has seasoned for a little over a year. One burning mostly ash and walnut. And sometime a piece of oak that’s a year and a half old. It seem no matter what I do I can’t keep the stove away from the 600 degree mark. I would like to stay around 500. So does this stove just run that hot or am I doing something wrong? My stove pipe was inspected last year and the sweep said everything was great and a prefect install
Go by visuals as much as by the stove top thermometer. Start closing the air down sooner and more aggressively. Try 1/2 for the first step, then 3/4's for the next. Load thick splits for a slower burn. Let the coals burn down a bit more on a hot reload. Close the air down to the point where the flames get lazy, then wait for them to regain strength and close it down some more.
 
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blacktail

Minister of Fire
Sep 18, 2011
1,419
Western WA
600 is normal for most stoves. Is there something special about this stove that requires lower temps? Or is Englander just being extra cautious in their recommendation?
 
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Wacky2000

New Member
Dec 10, 2016
9
New lebanon
600 is normal for most stoves. Is there something special about this stove that requires lower temps? Or is Englander just being extra cautious in their recommendation?
Englander says 600 is technically and overfire. And some other manufacturers I looked at also consider 600 an overfire. My problem is my first epa stove I bought was a dutchwest by vc. Boy did the sale man get me on that one. It has never made it thru a whole burning season without being rebuild. Burnt that thing just like the told me. It never saw over 600. I was just trying to stay within Englanders specs. I kinda need this one to last a good while or the wife Will be pretty upset with me
 
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Easy Livin’ 3000

Minister of Fire
Dec 23, 2015
2,895
SEPA
I wouldn't want to own a stove that is on overfire at 600°. And I wouldn't think an Englander is over firing at 600.

Perhaps there was an ill informed phone rep, or management is moving in the direction of making people think they abused the stove to reduce warranty claims/liability. If you found other manufacturers of similar stoves saying the same thing, sounds like a new, less consumer friendly business model is at hand. I think they started down this path when they stopped putting the number in the manual.

Hopefully it was an honest mistake by a new and poorly trained phone rep.

My research in the past led me to 800 as an overfire in tube stoves like yours. A previous version of my stove manual said 840. The current version says "avoid overfiring the stove".
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
86,546
South Puget Sound, WA
Englander says 600 is technically and overfire. And some other manufacturers I looked at also consider 600 an overfire. My problem is my first epa stove I bought was a dutchwest by vc. Boy did the sale man get me on that one. It has never made it thru a whole burning season without being rebuild. Burnt that thing just like the told me. It never saw over 600. I was just trying to stay within Englanders specs. I kinda need this one to last a good while or the wife Will be pretty upset with me
600F is not overfiring the stove. That support person was expressing an opinion which I disagree with. It may be that person's recommended safe high temp, but it is not over firing. A 600F recommend limit is definitely true for some soapstone stoves. I don't find anything in the 13-NC (or other Englander manuals)that says 600F is an over fire temp. The only warning I see is if parts are glowing red.
 
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Dix

Minister of Fire
May 27, 2008
6,386
Long Island, NY
The 13 is an awesome heat machine, doubt I've mentioned how much I love mine here on the forums ;)

My process .... air open, start fire (small fire, coal bed will follow) door ajar. Stove top temp to 250 -300 or so w/ secondaries going, add a spit (AWAYS wear gloves when you open this door with a fire going, that latch can be brutal when it's hot !!! ) and shut air down 1/2 way. Shut door !!!

Cruise to 400, shut air down 1/3 - 1/4 adjust firewood as needed to clear dog house, etc. Takes about 20 - 30 minutes w 2 YO oak, maple, cherry, pine.

Depending on coal bed & temps outside, either add another split ( I load the 13 E/W usually, very rarely N/S, as N/S burns quicker & hotter, and shorter burn times :mad: ) or shut air down so the thin end of the coil on the handle is just protruding from the bottom of the ashlip.

4 - 6 hour burn time. max, can restart from coals if you are lucky & time it right.
.
Cruises @ 500 or so when everything comes together. I don't think 600 ( where's your thermo? stove top? Chimney?) I don't think 600 is out of line ( unless it's constant) but you mileage may vary ;lol
 

Geoff C

Burning Hunk
Oct 29, 2011
116
PA
I used to have that stove and it would blast off into outer space hitting like 800. Even with the air all the way down it ran hot. Throw an unseasoned split in each load, should slow it down a little bit


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
86,546
South Puget Sound, WA
The 13 is an awesome heat machine, doubt I've mentioned how much I love mine here on the forums ;)

My process .... air open, start fire (small fire, coal bed will follow) door ajar. Stove top temp to 250 -300 or so w/ secondaries going, add a spit (AWAYS wear gloves when you open this door with a fire going, that latch can be brutal when it's hot !!! ) and shut air down 1/2 way. Shut door !!!

Cruise to 400, shut air down 1/3 - 1/4 adjust firewood as needed to clear dog house, etc. Takes about 20 - 30 minutes w 2 YO oak, maple, cherry, pine.

Depending on coal bed & temps outside, either add another split ( I load the 13 E/W usually, very rarely N/S, as N/S burns quicker & hotter, and shorter burn times :mad: ) or shut air down so the thin end of the coil on the handle is just protruding from the bottom of the ashlip.

4 - 6 hour burn time. max, can restart from coals if you are lucky & time it right.
.
Cruises @ 500 or so when everything comes together. I don't think 600 ( where's your thermo? stove top? Chimney?) I don't think 600 is out of line ( unless it's constant) but you mileage may vary ;lol
Where do you have the thermometer Dix?
 

Dix

Minister of Fire
May 27, 2008
6,386
Long Island, NY
Where do you have the thermometer Dix?
Stove Top .... top dead center in front of the chimney. About 2 inches in front.
 

Wacky2000

New Member
Dec 10, 2016
9
New lebanon
Thank you everyone. I just replaced a a dutchwest 2478 with this Englander NC13. The dutchwest I had to rebuild every year because the four Ian would fall a part. I didn’t know about this website when I bought it. I just really don’t want to have issue with this stove. I want it to last as long as possible.
So what is a good top out temp for this stove? How long can I expect it to last? I’m hoping Brother Bart chimes in on this. Is it better to run it n//s or e/w?
 

Wacky2000

New Member
Dec 10, 2016
9
New lebanon
600F is not overfiring the stove. That support person was expressing an opinion which I disagree with. It may be that person's recommended safe high temp, but it is not over firing. A 600F recommend limit is definitely true for some soapstone stoves. I don't find anything in the 13-NC (or other Englander manuals)that says 600F is an over fire temp. The only warning I see is if parts are glowing red.
I actually talked to mike at Englander the other. He said with the secondary tubes burn on a good size load is what is making it burn that hot. He said a trip up to 650 is not gonna hurt as long as it’s not for an extended period of time
 

Dix

Minister of Fire
May 27, 2008
6,386
Long Island, NY
Thank you everyone. I just replaced a a dutchwest 2478 with this Englander NC13. The dutchwest I had to rebuild every year because the four Ian would fall a part. I didn’t know about this website when I bought it. I just really don’t want to have issue with this stove. I want it to last as long as possible.
So what is a good top out temp for this stove? How long can I expect it to last? I’m hoping Brother Bart chimes in on this. Is it better to run it n//s or e/w?
If ya need @BrotherBart for this convo I'm turning in my union card :mad:

:)
 
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Dix

Minister of Fire
May 27, 2008
6,386
Long Island, NY
I actually talked to mike at Englander the other. He said with the secondary tubes burn on a good size load is what is making it burn that hot. He said a trip up to 650 is not gonna hurt as long as it’s not for an extended period of time
Mike is awesome. Won't steer you wrong :)

As I said above, my 13 settles down @ 500 or so, loaded E/W (I find N/S to burn hotter & quicker, not a fan ). Thermo on stove top, TDC infront of chimney, 2" out.
 
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Wacky2000

New Member
Dec 10, 2016
9
New lebanon
The 13 is an awesome heat machine, doubt I've mentioned how much I love mine here on the forums ;)

My process .... air open, start fire (small fire, coal bed will follow) door ajar. Stove top temp to 250 -300 or so w/ secondaries going, add a spit (AWAYS wear gloves when you open this door with a fire going, that latch can be brutal when it's hot !!! ) and shut air down 1/2 way. Shut door !!!

Cruise to 400, shut air down 1/3 - 1/4 adjust firewood as needed to clear dog house, etc. Takes about 20 - 30 minutes w 2 YO oak, maple, cherry, pine.

Depending on coal bed & temps outside, either add another split ( I load the 13 E/W usually, very rarely N/S, as N/S burns quicker & hotter, and shorter burn times :mad: ) or shut air down so the thin end of the coil on the handle is just protruding from the bottom of the ashlip.

4 - 6 hour burn time. max, can restart from coals if you are lucky & time it right.
.
Cruises @ 500 or so when everything comes together. I don't think 600 ( where's your thermo? stove top? Chimney?) I don't think 600 is out of line ( unless it's constant) but you mileage may vary ;lol
Stove thermometer is where’s yours is. My problem is usually on a hot reload
 

Dix

Minister of Fire
May 27, 2008
6,386
Long Island, NY
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Dix

Minister of Fire
May 27, 2008
6,386
Long Island, NY
Stove thermometer is where’s yours is. My problem is usually on a hot reload
Cool.

Back off on the hot reload.... let the coal bed go down a bit if possible. Air 1/2 way can help with this. I realize sometimes it's gotta be done :)

Keep the dog house area clear, as well.
 

Wacky2000

New Member
Dec 10, 2016
9
New lebanon
Cool.

Back off on the hot reload.... let the coal bed go down a bit if possible. Air 1/2 way can help with this. I realize sometimes it's gotta be done :)

Keep the dog house area clear, as well.
What do you mean by keep the dog house clean? I know this is probably a stupid question. This my first epa stove with burn tubes. The dutchwest was a rocket stove. So there is a learning curve for me. It really does make me feel dumb figuring this thing out
 

Wacky2000

New Member
Dec 10, 2016
9
New lebanon
Mike is awesome. Won't steer you wrong :)

As I said above, my 13 settles down @ 500 or so, loaded N/S (I find E/W t burn hotter & quicker, not a fan ). Thermo on stove top, TDC infront of chimney, 2" out.
All my firewood is cut to 18 inches from the old stove. I didn’t really want to cut it all down to 10 inches but if it burns better that way then I will have to burn it that for a while. Right now I get 5-51/2 of burn time and usable heat for about 6-6 1/2. I still have enough coal for a reload after 7-8 hours
 

Dix

Minister of Fire
May 27, 2008
6,386
Long Island, NY
What do you mean by keep the dog house clean? I know this is probably a stupid question. This my first epa stove with burn tubes. The dutchwest was a rocket stove. So there is a learning curve for me. It really does make me feel dumb figuring this thing out
The dog house is the area right in the front of the interior of the stove that the air control connects to.

The air comes through the front, and into the dog house inside the stove (sorry goggled pics, no luck ).... it's in the middle of the very front of the bottom front of the stove interior. Keep it clean as possible.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
86,546
South Puget Sound, WA
he air comes through the front, and into the dog house inside the stove
Some of the air come in via the doghouse, but most of it comes in via the airwash I think. Here's a shot of the doghouse circled.

NC1.jpg
 

Dix

Minister of Fire
May 27, 2008
6,386
Long Island, NY

Wacky2000

New Member
Dec 10, 2016
9
New lebanon
The dog house is the area right in the front of the interior of the stove that the air control connects to.

The air comes through the front, and into the dog house inside the stove (sorry goggled pics, no luck ).... it's in the middle of the very front of the bottom front of the stove interior. Keep it clean as possible.
Okay cool. I didn’t know it was called a dog house and I always keep that part clean because the air comes thru it. I really do appreciate all the help. Once it settles in mine does burn right at 550. It’s just that first 10 to 20 minutes when the burst of smoke start burning then it settles in for the long haul. I have been burning the cigar method found here and it’s been working great to and it’s not spiking over 600.
 
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