How to keep high stove temps without coals building up too much?

[jdinspector]

OK, here's my dilemma... During the past 3 weeks of a early cold snap here in Chicago, I've been burning my stove pretty much 24/7, but at relatviely low temps. I've kept stove temps in the 450 range. If I want to keep the stove in the 400-500 range, I re-load only about 1/2 to 3/4 full about every 4-5 hours. But when I do that, the coals are built up over 3-4" deep and I can't really fill the firebox too full. However, if I let the stove burn down to ashes, the stovetop temps are down under 150- 200 degrees. Does anybody have a suggestion on how I can burn all of the way down to ashes AND keep stove temps up at 400 degrees or more. I feel like when I'm emptying the stove of ashes, I'm also pulling out a lot of coals (i.e. wasted fuel)

 

[Brian VT]

I try not to reload too soon. The stove may get down to 300 (yrmv). The coals are what I've heard called "clinkers". About the size of a grape.
These are enough to ignite the new load. I give them lots of air, maybe even cracking the door open, to get it hot quick (STAY THERE!). I shoot for about 700F in the flue.
By the time I get things settled to leave it for the long burn, those coals are almost spent and the next cycle begins.

 

[LLigetfa]

There are three significant factors to excess coaling. One is moisture content, the other is air supply, and species. Burn dryer wood and give it more air. YMMV with wood species so selecting and sequencing is a factor as well.

 

[Rockey]

The obvious has been stated, to wait longer between reloading. You will also hear to rake the coals forward and increase the air supply. This is all good and well but when you get to January and hit a really cold spell your going to find that as you try to keep the stove temps as high as possible the coals just continue to build. I have also tried a suggestion of putting branches and small splits on top of the caols and ltting them burn down this way, to no avail.If your trying to burn 100% wood heat then you have a couple options at that point, learn to have the house cooler while the coals burn down, upgrade to a bigger stove, buy a second stove (thats what I did), or shovel some of the coals out (what I used to do).

 

[jdinspector]

Thanks folks. I think Rockey hit on it. It's still shoulder season, so I'm not burning as hot as I will during the heart of winter. I'll have to let the temps come down and burn the coals down to ash. I'm burning dry wood for sure, so I know that's not a problem. Wood is ash, maple and oak.

 

[northwinds]

From what I've read here the last couple of years, my understanding is that the creosote causing bad stuff
in wood is pretty much gone by the time that the fire reaches coaling stage. I just let the fire burn down
until there's enough coals to pull forward into a couple of inch row at the front for re-loading. I don't worry
about the stove top temperatures at the end of the cycle.

Having said that, my stove doesn't particularly like cruising at 400-450. I don't get good secondary burn
until I'm in the 500-600 range. If I stay in that cruising range, I get good clean burns down to the end.
If I cruise below 500, I have smoke coming out the stack. For shoulder season, I burn hot but much smaller
fires. That allows a shorter cruising time above 500 so that the house doesn't overheat. I'll make one or
two short, hot fires per day from scratch instead of trying to keep the stove going all day.

My two cents...

 

[Backwoods Savage]

JD, this is a common problem and will only get worse! Well, it need not get worse once you get a handle on how to control things. There are definitely key factors involved which have been mentioned, like type of wood and amount of moisture in the wood, etc.

You might like to know that we also had that problem when we started with the Fireview.....and at the time I really got no good advice on how best to stop problem; therefore, we experimented.

This time of the year we rarely put in more than 4 small splits and more usual it is 3 splits. We don't load this baby up until it gets cold outside! Then when it gets cold, you have to keep an eye on the coals or you will only be able to put in the 3 or 4 splits because there is no more room! Also, you can't empty ashes.

The simplest way we have found, and I'll use cold winter time burning for example, is to watch the stovetop. When the temperature is down to 500 or even 550, start opening the draft some. If 500 then I'll usually go right to 2 on the draft control. When the wood is almost all burned but you can still see where the log was, that is, it hasn't yet busted into nothing but coals, turn that draft on full.
At that point do not worry about heat going up the chimney. You just want those coals to burn down as fast as you can get them to burn down.

After maybe a half hour on full draft it might pay to rake the coals towards the front of the stove. At the same time, rake through all the coals to loosen them up which allows more air circulation for burning those hot little buggers. We will sometimes do this twice if we have lots of coals.

Then again, when reloading, rake the coals to the front of the stove....always. Place your biggest piece of wood in the bottom rear of the stove. If possible, put a faster burning piece in the front bottom, then finish loading however you want. This gets the new load burning quickly but also allows for a longer burn.

Good luck and I hope I haven't made this confusing as it really is simple.

 

[ControlFreak]

I've experienced the same thing when it gets super cold and I'm pushing the stove to produce as much heat as is absolutely possible. Considering that there's not a tremendous amount of heat in the coals, it's not a huge loss to toss them. Also, I took one of those cheap sheet metal shovels and drilled holes in it so I can easily separate the really small coals/ash from the larger ones. This is very helpful to get the pile down to something manageable.

The second stove is perhaps the best approach, so when you need even more heat, you fire up the second unit.

 

[Stephen in SoKY]

I just burn mine out, but if you're serious about keeping them: (broken link removed to http://www.lehmans.com/store/Stoves___Hearth_Accessories___Koal_Keeper___5625533?Args=)

 

[bokehman]

The coals are what I've heard called "clinkers".

Clinker and coals are completely different. Clinker is what forms when the melting point of the ash is below the temperature of the fire. Once cooled it can look like glass or pieces of stone.

 

[Dune]

The coals are what I've heard called "clinkers".

Clinker and coals are completely different. Clinker is what forms when the melting point of the ash is below the temperature of the fire. Once cooled it can look like glass or pieces of stone.

Clinkers are formed from burning coal, not wood. Clinker is generaly considered to be something other than coal.

 

[bokehman]

Clinkers are formed from burning coal, not wood. Clinker is generaly considered to be something other than coal.

Clinker can form burning wood. It all depends on the wood and how hot the fire is. Any time the fire is hot enough to melt the ash clinker will form.

 

[Dune]

As a blacksmith, I have dealt with plenty of coal clinker. As a wood burner, I can't say I have ever seen.

I will take your word for it and keep on the lookout for it in the future.

 

[jdinspector]

JD, this is a common problem and will only get worse! Well, it need not get worse once you get a handle on how to control things. There are definitely key factors involved which have been mentioned, like type of wood and amount of moisture in the wood, etc.

You might like to know that we also had that problem when we started with the Fireview.....and at the time I really got no good advice on how best to stop problem; therefore, we experimented.

This time of the year we rarely put in more than 4 small splits and more usual it is 3 splits. We don't load this baby up until it gets cold outside! Then when it gets cold, you have to keep an eye on the coals or you will only be able to put in the 3 or 4 splits because there is no more room! Also, you can't empty ashes.

The simplest way we have found, and I'll use cold winter time burning for example, is to watch the stovetop. When the temperature is down to 500 or even 550, start opening the draft some. If 500 then I'll usually go right to 2 on the draft control. When the wood is almost all burned but you can still see where the log was, that is, it hasn't yet busted into nothing but coals, turn that draft on full.
At that point do not worry about heat going up the chimney. You just want those coals to burn down as fast as you can get them to burn down.

After maybe a half hour on full draft it might pay to rake the coals towards the front of the stove. At the same time, rake through all the coals to loosen them up which allows more air circulation for burning those hot little buggers. We will sometimes do this twice if we have lots of coals.

Then again, when reloading, rake the coals to the front of the stove....always. Place your biggest piece of wood in the bottom rear of the stove. If possible, put a faster burning piece in the front bottom, then finish loading however you want. This gets the new load burning quickly but also allows for a longer burn.

Good luck and I hope I haven't made this confusing as it really is simple.

Backwoods, much appreciated advice. I think I'm being impatient and am adding wood before I've burned the old load fully. My 3,4 or even 5 hour burn times should probably be extended by another hour or two, even on a 1/2 load. Afterall, I get an easy overnight burn with this stove, so 1/2 load burning 5-7 hours should work. No? I'm just anxious to run this stove and it's early in the season, so I'm tending to it too often, I suppose.

I have to say, the old stove (VC Resolute) did have an advantage over this stove with ash removal (ash fell down into a pan that had a grate preventing coals from "leaving" the stove). Other than that ash system and the top loading, this stove is much superior to the old VC. After much dismay, my daughter has finally accepted that she can cuddle up near this stove with her legs extended under it- just like the old one. (She's a sentimental 14 year old!)

 

[Backwoods Savage]

I can relate to the impatience! With a new stove one wants to test it out. Methinks you have the right idea now but be sure to let us know if you are unable to solve the problem. And yes, you can tend it too often.

We were unsure about the ash issue but have adapted to it well now. It becomes a non-issue very quickly. Just don't empty the ashes too soon. This time of year once per week should be plenty. Also, do not take all the ashes out; leave an inch or two on the bottom.

You will also find that under the stove is also a great place to put a pair of gloves to warm before you go out or to dry. When I am plowing snow with the atv, I often change gloves when my fingers get cold. It is great to put a warm pair on. For the ultimate, put them under the stove with one of the little soapstone glove warmers inside!

Good luck.

 

[kenny chaos]

Won't work that way JD.
My stove typically runs from 200 to 600 and back down to 200.
My house does not hold heat well so I understand wanting/needing to keep it full bore.
It's kinda like a car running out of gas and we want it to keep running while we refill it.

 

[pen]

Won't work that way JD.
My stove typically runs from 200 to 600 and back down to 200.
My house does not hold heat well so I understand wanting/needing to keep it full bore.
It's kinda like a car running out of gas and we want it to keep running while we refill it.

Good analogy.

The real problem is this: If you NEED to be putting so much wood into your stove that you are getting excessive coaling, then you didn't buy a big enough stove.

If you just want to be putting wood on for the fun of it and it won't burn down quick enough, well, that's just being an honest to goodness pyro w/ an unlimited supply of wood!

pen

 

[LLigetfa]

Almost everyone says their wood is dry even when it isn't ideal. People are often obsessed with choking back the air thinking they are eeking more efficiency out of it. They also operate the stove by fixating on the temperature of the stove top and/or flue. I think it was Fossil that said stoves don't work that way. They are cyclical.

As I said before, excess coaling is too high MC, not enough air, and/or pilot error. Burn dryer wood, give it more air in the later stage, and adjust your loading and/or species mix. jdinspector admits to driving by the thermometer. Toss the thermometer and drive it by what the wood needs at the stage it is at.

 

[fredarm]

Ok, here's a slightly off-topic question. How do you rake coals to the front of a side-loader?

 

[kenny chaos]

Almost everyone says their wood is dry even when it isn't ideal. People are often obsessed with choking back the air thinking they are eeking more efficiency out of it. They also operate the stove by fixating on the temperature of the stove top and/or flue. I think it was Fossil that said stoves don't work that way. They are cyclical.

As I said before, excess coaling is too high MC, not enough air, and/or pilot error. Burn dryer wood, give it more air in the later stage, and adjust your loading and/or species mix. jdinspector admits to driving by the thermometer. Toss the thermometer and drive it by what the wood needs at the stage it is at.

He wants to hold 400-500 degrees. Are you suggesting that by throwing out his thermometer, using dry wood, and adding air as the burn goes along,
he can hold 400-500 degrees?
You're right in suggesting he'll have less coals but that won't give him the goal he wants.

 

[pen]

Ok, here's a slightly off-topic question. How do you rake coals to the front of a side-loader?

Somewhere in your stove it burns from "front to back" or from "this spot TO that spot" Rake the coals to "this spot" or to wherever the fire burns up first. If the stove has an airwash glass front it might still be the literal front of the stove.

pen

 

[Slow1]

Ok, here's a slightly off-topic question. How do you rake coals to the front of a side-loader?

Somewhere in your stove it burns from "front to back" or from "this spot TO that spot" Rake the coals to "this spot" or to wherever the fire burns up first. If the stove has an airwash glass front it might still be the literal front of the stove.

pen

Yup. It is easy to find the "front" of the stove.. I knew what he meant. So, when I 'rake the coals to the front' in my stove, I am actually raking them to the side - rather I don't even have a rake (never did) I am using a simple L shaped poker and I just push, pull, and roll the coals to the right middle (as seen from my left side door) and am done with it. It is taking some getting used to the depth of the box looking from the side - I have to pay attention to the window to figure out where the middle is as I tend to not center the pile well particularly when it is dark in the room.

As to coals - I have been burning them down so far. Have gone 48 hours max continuous, just not quite yet cold enough outside as much as I want to burn more... I dread the regrets come March when the wood pile is exhausted and it is colder than now. At any rate, having the coals stick around for a long time right now is a good thing as it make it easier to light up, even if not enough to actually start the stove, at least it is keeping the box a few degrees warmer and thus maintaining my draft so the chimney (outside SS) doesn't cool enough to reverse.

 

[Rockey]

Almost everyone says their wood is dry even when it isn't ideal. People are often obsessed with choking back the air thinking they are eeking more efficiency out of it. They also operate the stove by fixating on the temperature of the stove top and/or flue. I think it was Fossil that said stoves don't work that way. They are cyclical.

As I said before, excess coaling is too high MC, not enough air, and/or pilot error. Burn dryer wood, give it more air in the later stage, and adjust your loading and/or species mix. jdinspector admits to driving by the thermometer. Toss the thermometer and drive it by what the wood needs at the stage it is at.

I really think the issue here is that jdinspector cannot mantain a high enough house temperature for his comfort level and its only OCTOBER. Therefor he is looking for ways to maintian a high temperature on his Fireview to compensate, which gives him this coaling issue. Been there done that just not in october. The limited solutions to the coaling problem has been discussed ad nauseum and the success is marginal but sometimes enough for an individual that is on the borderline. This is not a borderline issue. close some doors to zone heat only, or supplement with your furnace.

 

[yanksforever]

Don't most side loading stoves also open in the front???? :question:
So open the front and rake to the front. Simple!

 

[Lumber-Jack]

OK, here's my dilemma... During the past 3 weeks of a early cold snap here in Chicago, I've been burning my stove pretty much 24/7, but at relatviely low temps. I've kept stove temps in the 450 range. If I want to keep the stove in the 400-500 range, I re-load only about 1/2 to 3/4 full about every 4-5 hours. But when I do that, the coals are built up over 3-4" deep and I can't really fill the firebox too full. However, if I let the stove burn down to ashes, the stovetop temps are down under 150- 200 degrees. Does anybody have a suggestion on how I can burn all of the way down to ashes AND keep stove temps up at 400 degrees or more. I feel like when I'm emptying the stove of ashes, I'm also pulling out a lot of coals (i.e. wasted fuel)

Sound like the answer to you dilemma might be to burn some (dry) Fir or Pine. Burns up hotter and very little coaling and even fewer ashes.