Is this a bad idea?

[linuxrunner]

We have a VERY large fireplace in our house, it has a round opening about 5ft in diamater. I can stand inside with minimal ducking to get in.

Even though it was serviced and we were shown the receipts and paperwork from the company that did the work saying it was good to use before we bought the house. It fills the house with smoke when used. The opening is just too big.

So we picked up a used wood stove which fits completely inside the fireplace, this seems to be perfect, but i don't really trust the chimney all that much (it's over 100 years old) so i figured i can be extra safe by running the stovepipe all the way up the chimney to the top.

When we picked up the wood stove it came with about 6ft of single wall stove pipe. so i went to the hardware store and picked up about 30ft of the same stuff.

I now realize that the pipe that was being used was probably 6in galvanized duct pipe, not stove pipe. and now i have 30ft of the same.

How bad of an idea is it to use this inside the chimney? i understand that there is going to be some off gassing when i get this stuff really hot and it's not as thick as normal stove pipe, but it is in a chimney. Mostly just figured that i could keep my chimney nice and clean by running this pipe all the way to the top so no smoke and bonus i don't have to worry as much about the condition of the flue tiles.

 

[begreen]

Your thought of a pipe through the chimney is correct, but stove pipe is not allowed in this application. It will rot out quickly. Galvanized duct pipe is not stove pipe. What you need is a stainless steel liner with an adapter for the stove.

 

[HotCoals]

Your thought of a pipe through the chimney is correct, but stove pipe is not allowed in this application. It will rot out quickly. Galvanized duct pipe is not stove pipe. What you need is a stainless steel liner with an adapter for the stove.

For sure. After he does that I would think a block off plate would be in order.
He may want a insulated flex liner if it's on a outside wall. Even on a inside wall it seems like it's worth the extra money from what I read.

 

[begreen]

Agreed. The liner probably should be insulated. I'm wondering what is the used stove model?

 

[HotCoals]

I'm wondering that also.
Hopefully a secondary burner of some type.

 

[Jags]

Yep - I second or third (or whatever) the above comments. Insulated liner (not the pipe you have) with a block off plate. You will be amazed.
So OP - what stove is it??

 

[linuxrunner]

The chimney is in the center of the house, not exterior.

The stove is an old parlor stove, says Glenwood 223 on it. Our house is a stone house,(not stone veneer) with large stone fireplace that makes up an entire wall and this old stove really fits and looks great with the house. We got it from my wife's parents beach house and it's in kind of rough shape, but everything works (they have been using it for the 40yr's they have owned it).

We are not trying to heat the house here, we just wanted to have a few fires a year.

 

[Jags]

You still fit squarely in the camp of stainless liner and block off plate.

 

[linuxrunner]

So we would like to have someone come in and restore the fireplace back to original working condition, it looks like the firebox was made to be MUCH smaller than it originally was. I am wondering on liners, the chimney is triangular but pretty big, i could easily fit a 12in or 16in liner and we are saving up to have the fireplace rebuilt (maybe next year fingers crossed).

I am afraid if i get a liner big enough to accommodate the large fireplace it will be too big for the wood stove.

Would i need to get a 6in liner for this? and then i assume next year if i want to remove the wood stove and have fires in the fireplace i would have to replace the liner with something bigger? Or can i just get the correct size for the fireplace and run the wood stove into it?

 

[Jags]

Size the liner to the stove not the fireplace. If you are considering going back to an open fireplace, I am not sure I would go through the process of setting it up for a stove. You would have to remove the liner to go back to a fireplace.

 

[branchburner]

If you only want a few fires a year, it probably doesn't make sense to spend hundreds on a proper liner only to pull it out after a year or two when returning to an open fireplace. A liner is a LOT more expensive than simple pipe.

You say you don't really trust the chimney all that much and worry about the condition of the flue tiles. Since you are going to want the tiles evaluated eventually, you might as well have it done sooner rather than later (and at the same time get estimates for whatever other fireplace/chimney work needs to be done). If the clay liner is in good shape, for the purpose of only a few occasional fires in that old stove over the course of a year, you could proceed with what is called a "direct-connect" and simply extend a length of stove pipe part way up the flue. Be aware this is not an optimal setup and will likely result in some creosote buildup in the liner that should be monitored (and cleaned).

Not sure exactly what it might involve, but it may be very costly to to have someone come in and restore the fireplace. So, while an open fireplace is lovely to have, you might consider getting a newer EPA stove with proper liner. There are many models that might look good in that setting, and that have a fire-screen option so you can burn them as a fireplace with the front door open, if you desire. My wife was very reluctant to give up our constantly-used fireplace for a stove, but now she would never go back. The cast iron stove is beautiful on the hearth, has a huge glass for viewing the fire, and provides more comfort than the fireplace (even though your goal may not be to heat the house, the radiant heat of a stove is hard to beat).

 

[Simonkenton]

Going back to "Plan A"...

You suspect that the fireplace opening is too large, thus the house fills with smoke. You are probably right.
There are a lot of flawed fireplaces out there. However, if the problem is that your fireplace opening is too large, you simply need to make the opening smaller.
There is a 10:1 ratio used when figuring the fireplace opening. The fireplace opening should be about 10 times larger than your flue.
So, you climb on the roof and measure the flue. If the inside diameter is, let us say, 10 x 12 inches, you have 120 square inches.
Then you measure the fireplace opening, it should be around 1,200 square inches. If it is 1,300 square inches, or, 1,100 square inches, you are still OK.
But, if the opening measures 2,400 square inches, it is 20 times larger than the flue, and that fireplace will fill your house with smoke.
If your chimney has a round flue pipe, you gotta go to pi r squared to figure the sq. inches.

You can make a smaller opening with masonry. My neighbor's brand-new fireplace, a very expensive fireplace, was smoking and I diagnosed it, opening way too large. He got the mason to come out and add 2 courses of brick to the top of the opening, then, it worked fine.

My daughter in law got a stainless steel lining for the chimney of her 40 year old brick fireplace. Naturally this made the flue opening smaller, and her fireplace was smoking up the house. I told her the problem and she found a metal piece at the wood stove store that fits in the top of the fireplace opening. This metal piece is 6 inches high and 35 inches wide, it looks good!

It is surprising to me that fireplace masons and chimney repair guys are not familiar with the 1:10 rule.

If you want to do an experiment, get a piece of aluminum foil about 8 inches high, and run it right across the top, front of the fireplace opening. Tape it in place with masking tape.
Fire up the fireplace, and in ten minutes you will learn whether your fireplace opening is too large.

 

[bholler]

Any good chimney guy should know that proportion. And if it is a rumford box it can go down to 7 to 1 But there is also allot more than just proportion that goes into fireplace design that is just the first place to look. Regardless you cant burn a small parlor stove with it venting into a flue any where near large enough for a 5' diameter fireplace. That would require a 19" diameter liner

 

[linuxrunner]

sounds like we would be best spending the $300-$400 on somebody to come out and take a look at the chimney. Maybe if we get the thumbs up on the chimney and flue tiles we can vent the stove up the chimney for the few times we would use it.

I am not home right now to get a picture but the fireplace looks very much like this...

Maybe a little bit bigger but exact same shape and similar stone. Our problem is that the smoke shelf is way to low, you can see it about 1.5 foot before the top of the circle.


I believe that the previous owners had some type of metal glass front and changed the firebox and smoke shelf to fit this front they had

We have seen historic pics from the 30's of this fireplace in use so i know it's possible, but you could't really tell what the firebox looked like from the pics.

 

[begreen]

Very cute. Looks like a fireplace fit for hobbits. If you can post the early historical pics with it burning that would be good.

 

[bholler]

What do you mean you can see the smoke shelf? that is typically above the damper i think we need to see pics of this

 

[Simonkenton]

Yes, something is amiss if you can see the smoke shelf. Somebody who didn't know what they were doing reconfigured that fireplace. As I said, sounds like a good candidate for installing a metal piece to block the top, front of the fireplace opening, and if you do, I bet the thing will draw properly.

 

[bholler]

Well we need to see pics find out what size flue what the smoke chamber looks like ect before and more speculation. If the design is as bad as it sounds it might not ever work well. And if you do have it fixed I have a feeling you are going to spend allot of money