My Geospring

[john193]

I've had my geospring installed and running for about 6 days now, so I thought i'd add some of my initial observations.

I purchased the unit from lowes at $999, used a 10% coupon to tack on the 10 year labor warranty extension which brought my final price back to 999+tax. I qualify for $400 from my local utility and used discover card to get another 5% cashback.

We have the unit set to heat pump only mode (125F) and it is installed in my unfinished and unconditioned basement which stays 55 to 60 year round (the basement is completely underground). The unit typically runs 1 to 2 hours after a shower to recoup the heat loss and the heat pump operates around 600 watts. When running, the air coming out of the condenser is about 15F lower than the ambient air. I have it in my utility room (where my oil boiler also resides, albeit turned off) which measures approximately 12 by 14 feet. The door to the room is open, and my thermometer in there typically measures a 1F drop in temperature after the heater performs a recovery run. The temperature normalizes within 15-20 min after its been off.

I'm currently using a 5 gallon bucket (pictured) to collect the condensate (which we just use on the potted plants). The amount of condensate pulled will vary on the ambient conditions and use, but given what I have collected I suspect it will take me about 3 weeks to fill a 5 gallon bucket. Its just me and my wife at home.

As for the noise, we don't notice it upstairs at all. The only time I can hear it running upstairs is if the basement door was left open. It is no louder than modern day dehumidifiers (my reference point is a fridigaire dehumidifier). It does sound like a small a/c when running.

I live in southeast PA and after purchasing the unit I filled out the online form for the rebate through my local utility (PECO). For those who have PECO, you do not need to have your generation portion from PECO in order to qualify for the rebate, just have to be a PECO customer in good standing. About 2 weeks after submitting the application, I got a call from PECO that they wanted to perform an in house inspection (about 5% of applications are selected, what I was told). The inspection was rather painless and brief. Someone came and looked at the unit, took a wide picture and then a picture of the serial number and barcode on the unit. I should be getting my rebate in about 4 weeks.

 

[woodgeek]

Nice report. IIRC, I got $300 from PECO ~2 years ago, on my 80 gal AOSmith HPWH. No inspection by PECO, no problems to report.

 

[johnny1720]

Just curious what size breaker does this use?

Condensate pumps are like $59 at plumbing supply houses.

 

[john193]

Same size breaker as a traditional electric water heater, 30 amp and 10 gauge copper wire. Only one heating source can be running at any given time, so no different than the traditional units.

I'm sure I'll eventually go with a condensate pump but for the time being the bucket will suffice.

 

[johnny1720]

Nice work

 

[Seasoned Oak]

About that condensate water, I noticed that it does not get green when left out in the sun. Seems nothing grows in it. I discard it. I water the plants with rainwater and water from cleaning the fish tank.

 

[john193]

I suspect the condensate water is similar in mineral composition to distilled water, which isn't ideal for any living organism really. It's certainly not potable water. There are plenty of salts in the potting mix and soil to compensate for the lack of dissolved minerals in the condensate water that it makes no real difference. I can tell you in the decade or so of this practice, we have yet to kill a plant.

Fish tank water can be a treat for plants. Every year we clean out the inlaws pond and the grass and plants have a field day. Organic liquid fertilizer!

 

[begreen]

If distilled water killed plants we'd be in a heap of trouble. Rainwater is almost pure distilled water, though it picks up some dust and pollutants on the way down.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

If distilled water killed plants we'd be in a heap of trouble. Rainwater is almost pure distilled water, though it picks up some dust and pollutants on the way down.

Its the water that comes off a window air conditioner. I didnt try to water any plants with it, but after leaving a bucket of it in the sun for a few weeks i wondered why it didnt get green.Even the mosquitos avoided it. Puzzling
Rain water picks up nitrogen from the air which i guess is why plants seem to love it.

 

[begreen]

In the winter I have the water shut off in the greenhouse Instead I use the water coming from the dehumidifier to water the plants. Hasn't killed them yet, though the aphids might.

 

[fbelec]

that's strange about your air conditioning water not turning green. when people start using their air conditioning up here somewhere about a month into that the calls start coming in to troubleshoot no cold air. or why is there water coming from my attic. the 3/4 inch line for the condensate is blocked up with green slime. so it can grow things

 

[Seasoned Oak]

I guess mosquitos avoid squeaky clean water in general. Usually find them in the nastiest water. Cant explain why it dont turn green.

 

[Highbeam]

Take a sip, it probably tastes bad. Condensate water is formed by pulling house air over a wet, cold, screen. It's a bit like an oil bath air filter for the house. Pulls all sorts of organic junk like skin flakes along with hair, dust, pollen, etc. I would expect bugs and bacteria to thrive there. You know that smell that really dirty people make? That "essence" is in thd condensate. The only thing that makes condensate similar to distilled water is that the molecules of water were once vapor so should be lower in some minerals. It is not clean.

 

[semipro]

I suspect the "green" is algae. Phosphorus is typically the limiting nutrient for algae so water free of phosphorus won't support its growth. Since phosphorus is not typically airborne it shouldn't show up in distilled water.

That's why overuse of fertilizers and detergents containing phosphorus frequently results in water quality issues. The addition of phosphorus temporarily results in algae growth then the algae dies and its decay uses up all the oxygen in the water, killing fish etc.

Edit: algae require light for growth though so I'm not sure how they'd grow in an HVAC system.

 

[Highbeam]

I suspect the "green" is algae. Phosphorus is typically the limiting nutrient for algae so water free of phosphorus won't support its growth. Since phosphorus is not typically airborne it shouldn't show up in distilled water.

That's why overuse of fertilizers and detergents containing phosphorus frequently results in water quality issues. The addition of phosphorus temporarily results in algae growth then the algae dies and its decay uses up all the oxygen in the water, killing fish etc.

We always got a chuckle in school when the prof would say the lakes were P limited.

 

[lostDuck]

So for the few weeks that you have had the system are you glad you got it? I am looking to pull the trigger on one today and would love your input.

Thanks!

 

[john193]

So for the few weeks that you have had the system are you glad you got it? I am looking to pull the trigger on one today and would love your input.

Thanks!

So far so good. The impact on energy consumption has been minimal and I might even get away with running my dehumidifier less for a little more savings. Very happy with it. I would highly recommend you go with the extended warranty. A great value at $99.

 

[jeffesonm]

Glad to hear yours is working out... I've had mine for 4-5 months and am very happy with it. My $500 rebate check just showed up the other day too.

 

[fbelec]

has anyone had these units for more than 5 years? has anyone had compressor problems? has anyone had a tank rot out and what happened to the unit as far as removal? did it cost to get rid of because of freon?

thanks
frank

 

[john193]

has anyone had these units for more than 5 years? has anyone had compressor problems? has anyone had a tank rot out and what happened to the unit as far as removal? did it cost to get rid of because of freon?

thanks
frank

Someone I know has the first gen model and while I can't say exactly how old it is, just by the deduction of time I know they have had it for at least 3 years. The first gen had issues with the compressor and I know this person has had it replaced under warranty once.

My guess is if the tank failed and required removal it would be no different than a regular tank removal. As for removing the freon, there may be costs associated with that, but I'm not certain on that.

 

[woodgeek]

Rollout of the geospring seems to have been ~4 years ago. Most HPWH come with a 10+ year warranty on the tank, and will have paid fro themselves 2-3x over by then.

 

[johnny1720]

Lowes has these tanks for $699 in springville, ny

 

[john193]

The geospring comes with a 10 year warranty on parts and 1 year on labor. I paid another $99 to extend the labor warranty to 10 years as well.

 

[semipro]

As for removing the freon, there may be costs associated with that, but I'm not certain on that.

I'm in the process of moving one of our ground source heat pump units in the basement. It happens to be a split system where the water-freon heat exchanger and compressor are in the basement and the coil and air handler are in the attic. I called around to HVAC servicing folks to see what it would cost to have someone come by and remove the R22 from the lines and system. Most seemed uninterested saying the freon was worth nothing to them and they had to treat it as a waste. The one price I got was $180.

 

[Brian26]

I have had my 2nd gen Geospring in for 1 year. I got mine for $200 at Lowes. $900-$400 Utility rebate-$300 federal. They are practically giving these things away in CT now. Lowes has them at $599 with a CT Zip Code with $400 utility rebate. Possibly a federal rebate as well? Nobody came and checked anything at my house or my mothers. I got my $400 utility check in like 2 weeks.

I have had no issues with mine. I have the 10 year extended warranty from Lowes as well. Mine has already pretty much paid for itself. I just hooked mine up to an Efergy energy monitor a few weeks ago. Was amazed that it was averaging 1-2 KWH/Day. Pulls about 560 watts in heat pump mode. I'm heating my hot water at CT electric rates of.20/KWH for about $2 a week.

Keep in mind its just my wife and I. 2 showers at night and maybe a load or two of dishes a week in the dishwasher. The tank will recover in about 1.5-2 hours after back to back showers.

I put one in at my mothers house who was heating her water with oil at probably a gallon a day/ $100-$120 a month. At $200 dollars after the rebates its paid off and shes ahead in a few months.