Need help in deciding which Pellet Insert to get in the new house we just bought

[Timber12vt]

Wow! This is such a great site, I could spend hours and hours just reading all of the posts (although I don't think my employer would like to pay me while doing it), and I am really looking forward to weaning our newly purchased house off of the oil teat (oil fired boiler, hot water baseboard). The house is about 1700sq ft of main living area, with about 1000 sq ft of basement (insulation is ok, plan to insulate more in the spring and summer of next year) and the fireplace (which has a propane insert as of now, but we want to switch to pellet) is in the living room on the main living area, I was hoping someone might be able to point us in the right direction for a pellet insert. The fireplace dimensions are 34.5”W x 30.25”H x 17”D, and I would like something that has a pretty decent burn time, lots of glass (we love the look of a fire), is pretty efficient, and is not super expensive (would even consider a used/pre-owned one in excellent condition). Went to a local dealer and they suggested an Enviro Empress or Milan. Just looking for some more opinions from the experts here on the forum. Thanks in advance and I hope to contribute some day to this amazing community.

PS. Looking forward to getting a wood pellet boiler next spring/summer as well (hopefully MA will re-fund its wood pellet grant program for 2014!!)

 

[Defiant]

Check out the new Harman Insert,
http://www.harmanstoves.com/Products/Accentra-52i-Pellet-Insert.aspx

 

[Enigma869]

If by pretty decent burn time, you mean without needing to re-fill the hopper, I'm not sure that you're going to find any insert to be great in that area. I can only comment on the Accentra, as that is the insert that I used to own. I moved to a free standing stove when we bought our new house, because the hopper of the Accentra and the ash pan were simply way too small for my taste. Superb stove and I love the way it looked. That said, function was far more important to me.

 

[Timber12vt]

Hey Enigma,

I like the Harman Accentra and think we would like to go with an insert vs a fs stove. I know they are pricey but other than wanting a fs stove was there anything else you didnt like about the Accentra insert?

 

[CBL]

PS. Looking forward to getting a wood pellet boiler next spring/summer as well (hopefully MA will re-fund its wood pellet grant program for 2014!!)

I wouldn't even bother going through the trouble of installing an insert then. Suck it up for this winter with propane and get a pellet boiler installed next year.

 

[Timber12vt]

Thanks CBL, but MA had an upgrade program that would cover almost 100% of upgrading from an oil boiler to a pellet one this year, and they haven't said for sure that the program will be refunded for this year (2014) so if that doesn't happen itll be a few years before we could afford to change over the system

 

[sante fe]

I just upgraded to the Accentra 52i back in sept. Wow I could not be happier, Great heat, Great look, Great design, I would recommend this insert. It's also efficient on the pellets and there's so many ways to run the stove.My last insert was to small to handle my house and burned more pellets, The accentra once it reaches the temp you set your room it goes into a maintenance burn and uses very few pellets and maintains room temp well. I looked at the Mount Vernon , and the M55 but decided on the 52i and glad I did. Good luck with what ever you decide.

 

[John Fortier]

We went with a Thelin Providence this year (no expert). So far love it. Keeping the house nice and toasty 72 plus. I do clean every other day but don't know any better. We didn't have room for a FS. House is approx. 1200 sf. Cape. Photos of our stove.

 

[Timber12vt]

Hey John,

I am putting the pellet stove in a cape as well, how well (or not so well) does the heat reach your upstairs bedrooms? Just curious...

 

[Lake Girl]

John Fortier - love the compass rose above the mantle

 

[JohnnyG]

I have a QuadraFire MT Vernon AE Pellet Insert that I really like. My house is 3,000 sf but we close off all but 3 rooms (Family Room, Kitchen and Master Bedroom). I can keep the family room (where the insert is) and the kitchen 72 degrees. The bedroom is a bit colder at 65 degrees. I can fit a bag of pellets in the hopper. When it is 30 degrees outside, I will go through 2 bags a day. It is currently 9 degrees outside and I am going through 2.5 bags a day. In the spring and fall, a bag will last a couple of days. The insert is the only heat that I use (I have a heat pump/propane backup). I vacuum out the stove twice a week when it is cold out and once a week when it warms up (to 45+). I hope this helps. John

 

[chken]

We went with a Thelin Providence this year (no expert). So far love it. Keeping the house nice and toasty 72 plus. I do clean every other day but don't know any better. We didn't have room for a FS. House is approx. 1200 sf. Cape. Photos of our stove. View attachment 122653 View attachment 122654 View attachment 122655

Nice slate work!

 

[tjnamtiw]

Having two inserts, I'll tell you the downsides. Yes, #1 the hoppers are small and you have to STUFF a bag of pellets in it, which will make it easily through the night. #2, they are a beech to work on compared to a free standing unit unless you get one with rails like the M55 that a lot of folks have. #3, it eliminates the possibility of having a nice romantic fire once in a while or if power is out and you could burn the fireplace for warmth. If you have room, I'd recommend a free standing unit. I didn't have that option. #4, cleaning the exhaust system also means you have to pull the unit out and get in there to unhook the pipe. #5, you need to run a lot of expensive flex pipe up your chimney and terminate it with a cap versus with a free standing unit, going out a wall and up a few feet with a much less expensive setup. #6, If your fireplace doesn't have an ash cleanout, installing an OAK (outside air kit) is another expensive or possibly impossible task.
Other than that, go for it! hahaha.

 

[Madcodger]

Agree with tjnamtiw on downsides, but given all that I would likely still install another insert IF the best location for a stove was where a current fireplace existed. I have a freestanding Mt Vernon AE with a through-wall vent and it's just dramatically easier to service. However, I installed a Whitfield insert in my office because a fireplace there made a FS impractical. I suspect this is the reason many people go with an insert.

That said, you can run two pipes in the chimney, one for vent and one for OAK. Not cheap, but over time a good idea.

As for an insert, rails are an excellent idea. Also, strongly consider an insert that can run directly on a battery backup if necessary, without needing an additional inverter, even if you have a generator. If you could turn off the generator overnight it stretches your fuel by up to 2x, and it doesn't take many blackouts to have that save $. My MVAE can do so, and because it was designed for this it also consumes very little power on AC as well (only 27 watts without ignitor, vs 100 for my Whit). Over a season, that adds up. The MVAE is available as an insert.

 

[Timber12vt]

Do I always need an OAK (Outside Air Kit right?) with a pellet stove? Advantages?

 

[Madcodger]

Do I always need an OAK (Outside Air Kit right?) with a pellet stove? Advantages?

Please do a search on this on this board, but only with a couple of hours of free time and after packing a lunch. Hours and hours of discussion...

Bottom line: Most homes supply plenty of air to allow the stove itself to function well because even most modern construction is essentially "leaky". And the only way to know is with a blower door test performed by a BPI or RESNET certified energy auditor (an excellent idea anyway, will cost ~ $500, and you'll ultimately save enough to get that back - but a whole different topic). BUT RUNNING WITHOUT AN OAK IS STILL NOT A GREAT IDEA.

Reason: Your stove combustion blower sucks in a LOT of air. Without an OAK, it MUST suck in air from your home because that's the only option. You have ALREADY PAID to heat that air (with pellets, dino juice, electricity, whatever - but it cost you money to do it). That air also holds a bit more moisture than the air outside, and most homes are too dry in heating season, already. Now, physics will not allow your home to exist as a vacuum, so air to replace that nice, paid-for, warm air you just used for combustion and then pumped outside via the vent as exhaust will be sucked in from outside through every tiny crack in your home. And you will pay to heat THAT air, and the cycle continues.

In other words, No OAK means you are accelerating / greatly increasing the problem you are trying to solve by using a pellet stove in the first place. CAN you do it? Sure. It will just cost you much more money to do so, and diminish your comfort somewhat. Rather like driving with the parking brake on...

 

[Harvey Schneider]

The Mt Vernon AE is a great insert as Madcodger has said. Great heat output, high efficiency (86.3%), great looks, battery backup ready, and zero clearance install.
Being zero clearance ready was one of the major features that made me decide on the Mt Vernon over the Harman XXV.
As far as serviceability, I'm 66, and have a back problem and I manage to do all of the cleaning including a major end of season cleaning by myself. Sure, it would be easier if the insert was pulled from the chase, but it isn't necessary.

 

[John Fortier]

Timber,
As heat is known to rise , upstairs is as warm as down with no fans needed ( doors up there left open). It is 6 degrees outside and house is 71 We run mostly on low and bump to med. a few time just to feel a blast of heat. High for a laugh. The unit has battery backup ( still need to pick one up). No oak was installed and thinking of putting one in for next season. All in all we are very happy with the unit it is doing what we had hoped it would. We do run the furnace on occasion just to exercise it and to throw some heat in the basement as there is no insulation down there ( next project among many). We started with just over 3/4 tank of oil and have just under 3/4 tank. Very happy with that.

Lake Girl , Chken,

Thank you I found the compass I wanted on line, sized it to what I liked, made a template and hand picked and cut the slate to order. Mantle I made from pine and built it to slide over the old like a sock. I should say I have been a Tile Setter for over 30 years. I do hire out and travel and would love to transform all the fireplaces out there...or most.....LOL!

P.S. Compass points are also done N, S , E , W...cant see them in the photo.

 

[chken]

Lake Girl , Chken,
Thank you I found the compass I wanted on line, sized it to what I liked, made a template and hand picked and cut the slate to order. Mantle I made from pine and built it to slide over the old like a sock. I should say I have been a Tile Setter for over 30 years. I do hire out and travel and would love to transform all the fireplaces out there...or most.....LOL!

P.S. Compass points are also done N, S , E , W...cant see them in the photo.

Thanks for the info, clearly a professional job!

 

[Lake Girl]

Experience shows

 

[Timber12vt]

Thanks for all of the advice, I just pulled the trigger on a Harman Accentra 52i (insert) and should be picking it up next week sometime! One of my local dealers was running a pretty good sale on them and there was no sales tax!! So, I picked one up for a very decent price! Very excited, now I just have to do some research as to which pellets to get and a few install tips. Can't wait to post some pics....

 

[Harvey Schneider]

Thanks for all of the advice, I just pulled the trigger on a Harman Accentra 52i (insert) and should be picking it up next week sometime! One of my local dealers was running a pretty good sale on them and there was no sales tax!! So, I picked one up for a very decent price! Very excited, now I just have to do some research as to which pellets to get and a few install tips. Can't wait to post some pics....

Enjoy your new insert. I'm sure you will like it.

 

[John Fortier]

Enjoy and good luck..they are great! Need any tile advice please ask...can only make it prettier

 

[Timber12vt]

Actually John, I am thinking about going over all of the brick (face and base) with slate, is it hard to do? I've laid tile in my kitchen and bathroom, but have never done any work with slate or going stone over stone? I don't want anything super fancy just something a little more updated (plus, I don't really like brick)

 

[Timber12vt]

Here is a pic of what I have now, pretty bland. (The insert that is in there now is a Quadra Fire propane insert, which is going bye bye)