New Drolet Savnnah - Old Farm House

[shadawick]

Morning Folks,
Obviously I'm new here and wanted to say hello and ask a few questions.

About 2 days ago I finally got around to installing a new Drolet Savannah which I bought and had in storage for about two years.

I was raised in all wood heat houses for 50 years and heaters have ranged from old Majestic top loaders to Warm Mornings to Ashley's and finally an Englander.

I can't seem to get the hang of this new stove. If I try dead seasoned wood, I tend to have to leave the door cracked to get a start, then little heat. Then I try easing a couple of less seasoned wood on top of an existing fire to extend burn time with seemingly little effect.

I can't get a decent over night burn like I had been used to with the Ashley or Englander.

What am I doing wrong or am I trying to make the Savannah do something it wasn't designed to do?

This morning outside temps were about 12 and inside temp 47. Typical single story wooden frame farm house built by my grandfather about 1925. Cast in place concrete thimble or transition with a single joint of terra-cotta flue tile then transition to conventional square constructed mortar and brick through the attic crawl space and above roofline. Blown in insulation in ceiling, don't know about old existing walls, probably not too much is any.

Any suggestions or insight?

Thanks,
Jim

 

[Jimbob]

The Savanaah is a small stove like the Adirondack. It probably won't give you an overnight burn, I think the firebox on there is ~ 2 cu.ft.

At 3.1 cu.ft, this one would probably been a better choice:
(broken link removed to http://www.drolet.ca/product.aspx?CategoId=1&Id=348)

 

[begreen]

Could be the cold flue is a bit oversized and it's slowing down draft. Or it could be the wood is not quite seasoned yet. Don't add less seasoned wood if it means the air control needs to be wide open to burn it. Instead, use some 2x4 scraps that you know are dry to start up the fire. EPA stoves want dry fuel. Once you get the flue heated up, it may draw better and perk up the fire better. What is the total height of flue from stove to the chimney top? Is there an elbow or two in the connection?

To check the wood, take some of the seasoned wood, split it in half and put the fresh face of the wood against your face. Does it feel dry or is it cool and damp? If damp, there is your answer. If not, the smaller splits will ignite faster and should help get a hot fire started. Resplit a couple armloads of wood and bring them inside. Let them dry overnight and try them out for tomorrow morning's fire. Use large splits for good overnight burns.

Also, tell us where the air control is set at various stages of the burn. Once the fire is going good are you able to close it almost all the way?

 

[shadawick]

Could be the cold flue is a bit oversized and it's slowing down draft. Or it could be the wood is not quite seasoned yet. Don't add less seasoned wood if it means the air control needs to be wide open to burn it. Instead, use some 2x4 scraps that you know are dry to start up the fire. EPA stoves want dry fuel. Once you get the flue heated up, it may draw better and perk up the fire better. What is the total height of flue from stove to the chimney top? Is there an elbow or two in the connection?

To check the wood, take some of the seasoned wood, split it in half and put the fresh face of the wood against your face. Does it feel dry or is it cool and damp? If damp, there is your answer. If not, the smaller splits will ignite faster and should help get a hot fire started. Re-split a couple armloads of wood and bring them inside. Let them dry overnight and try them out for tomorrow morning's fire. Use large splits for good overnight burns.

Also, tell us where the air control is set at various stages of the burn. Once the fire is going good are you able to close it almost all the way?

I am beginning to believe your right on both issues.

I had cut the wood (both white and red oak) a couple of years ago but did not split and they were left to lay where they were. I intend to split everything smaller, stack under the overhang of my garage, sun and wind will still reach them well and put a piece of tin over the top. This should help. In the meantime, I going to look around the 2 farms I have (over 240 acres, only about 40 in pasture) and look for some dead standing oaks and give them a try.

As to the flue, I also think it is too big. My granddad built this house back around 1925 intended for wood heat. But back then they would pour a thimble in place between the ceiling joists. He then went ahead and set a 2 foot section of 6" terra-cotta flue tile, from there up it is simply a roughly 16 to 18" common brick chimney, left square all the way to the throat about 5 ft above the roof line. I am beginning to think If I keep the wood heat that I need to set SS rigid liners and pour the void with the new material they make for that. I will probably go into the attic crawl space and "marry," or double up the ceiling joist and attach some deadwood to help extend the load from just the ceiling joinst up to the appropriate rafters. I honestly did not think the bigger flue would be a problem, but then again, other then my big Englander in the house I just sold, I have never had an air tight efficient heater. I guess the old designs worked OK in the old type chimney's and flue's.

I had intended in the Spring to pull the stove, do a little reinforcing to the floor and add oak hardwood flooring so I might as well go ahead and do the lining then as well and be done with it. At least with the lining and floor reinforcing, it will handle the weight of the big Englander. I also think that Jimbob is right and I simply bought too small a heater to begin with. What is the general con-census on Drolet heaters, good or bad?

Thanks to everybody for trying to help me out, it is greatly appreciated!
Jim

 

[begreen]

It should be a decent heater, simple, but stout. How many square feet are you heating? If it's under 1500, the stove should do ok once you tighten up and insulate the place better. The flue liner sounds like a very good plan. Masonry should not be touching wood, though it often is in old places. But the wood gets drier and more volatile with long term heat exposure, so insulating the liner is essential here.

Once you have improved draft and have nice dry wood, I think you will find the stove putting out more heat and having a wider range of control. If you can stop the house leaking heat, then with good wood you can dial back the stove to a low burn. You should then be getting at least an 8 hr burn with the stove and about 5-6 hrs meaningful heat.

 

[dougand3]

Welcome, Jim. The Drolets sure look good and are attractively priced. You get at Northern Tool? Where are you in WNC?

 

[shadawick]

Welcome, Jim. The Drolet sure look good and are attractively priced. You get at Northern Tool? Where are you in WNC?

Thanks!
Yes I bought the Savannah at Northern Tool down in Marietta, Ga. on sale. I believe I paid about $650.00 out the door. They also had a great deal on a splitter, so I made the trip worth while and headed toward the Blue Ridges with one new heater and one new splitter. Northern worked with me and I got really good deals, well worth the drive!

The thing that bothers me is I researched the heck out of Drolet and the Savannah in particular, matched it to the square ft of the house and was expecting great things. The reviews of it at Northern were very highly rated, most adverse comments dealt with slow start up and such, but figured it was basically wood or draft related. This old house is not really bad as far as air worthy, I've gone through and reset and re glazed all the windows and added plastic "storms," outside. There is adequate insulation in the ceiling (blown 10 inches deep with 6" R-19 batts laid at right angles to the joists over the entire ceiling) but then I have real doubts about the walls. When I checked with the TVA energy conservation folks at Oak Ridge, they said the majority of heat loss is through the ceiling as opposed to the walls.

I live in the extrems Western end of the state where NC, TN and GA meet, in the Copper Basin area. Great hunting and fishing everywhere! I look at it as God's country and would rather live here then anywhere else I've seen! Thanks to all the welcomes and suggestions! Stay warm!

 

[dougand3]

As BG notes, after you fix draft and get drier wood - you can see if Savannah is big enough for your needs. Your Copperhill area is so much nicer compared to 20-30 years ago when the sulfuric acid from copper processing denuded the hills into balds. The Ocoee, Nantahala and Hiwasse are fun to raft, too.

 

[shadawick]

As BG notes, after you fix draft and get drier wood - you can see if Savannah is big enough for your needs. Your Copperhill area is so much nicer compared to 20-30 years ago when the sulfuric acid from copper processing denuded the hills into balds. The Ocoee, Nantahala and Hiwasse are fun to raft, too.

You know there is a problem when the area you live in can be seen clearly from space!

In addition to the high acid in the streams, there were releases of clouds of sulfuric acid which would "settle," in an area and kill everything (unfortunately even long term on people and animals). Back in the late 1800's the blast furnaces were wood fueled and most every tree was cut to fuel them. Once the ground cover and trees were gone, then the erosion took over. I am 57 years old and remember times the fumes were so thick it was like a yellow cloud or haze and you could taste it in your mouth! There were very high rates of cancer and lung disease in the area. I remember going down the Ocoee on the old "River Road," and seeing the pools of water so dark blue which was where the copper sulfate would settle! No fish or anything in the water back then.

My favorite river and fishing is up in Graham county at Robbinsville on Big Snowbird Creek!