New person, learning as I go and some questions about creosote cleaning

[kerryb23]

Hey everyone,

I've been looking around and reading everyone I can possibly digest on hearth.com for several weeks and I figured I should introduce myself and hopefully get some answers to a few of my questions.

Here's my story:

My partner and I purchased a 950 sq. ft stucco home in summer 2007. I grew up with a wood stove in my parents home and always hoped to have one of my own eventually. The house has two fireplaces, one in the living room and another in a bedroom that we use as an office. Without doing much research, I decided I would like to have a wood stove installed where the existing living room fireplace is located. I didn't put much thought into what type of stove, etc. In fact, I obtained one from my uncle for free, a Vogelzang boxwood. The deluxe model. I know, I know. I wish I had done some reading about those stoves prior to having it installed, but the fact is that it was free, and we live on a very tight budget. I paid a chimney sweep company to clean and inspect the chimney (which they said was in good shape) and to install the stove. $600. There went most of my tax refund. I've included pictures for reference on the install. Basically they cut through the brick hearth, installed a clay thimble into the chimney, cemented it in place, connected the stove to the thimble with 90 degree stove pipe, added a fire proof mat beneath the stove where it extends beyond the existing hearth and added a clay topper and galvanized steel chimney cap.

I started burning in late October. I burn nearly 24/. I've done my best to obtain only seasoned wood, but I'll admit not all the wood has not been as dry as I would prefer. The stove draws well, but it can be a real pain to control the air intake. It's drafty and not very well sealed at all. It also overfires to beat the band. I keep a very close eye on it. I go through a LOT of wood, about a rick a month, sometimes more. Also, our central heat/air went on the fritz so using that isn't an option right now. Even if we did run it, we were paying $300 a month with the thermostat set on 65f. Our only other means of keeping warm are space heaters. I'd already decided that as soon as the money became available, I was going to purchase a better stove and possibly use the Vogelzang (after making some repairs and sealing up the air gaps) to heat my detached garage/workshop.

So, my tax refund should arrive in 6-8 weeks so I went ahead (after much reading, research and consideration) to purchase an Englander 12-NC from homedepot.com. I'm hoping to be able to install it myself since it looks like I'll be able to basically pull out the 'zang and reattach the stovepipe to the Englander. They're nearly the same height. Even if I need to buy a different bend of stovepipe, that shouldn't be a problem.

My next issue. Yesterday I got onto the roof to check the top of the chimney. Loads of creosote, lining the top of the chimney cap, dripping down the sides. I purchased a brush from Rutland and the poles are on the way from ebay. (Why Ace Hardware didn't have the poles sitting beside the brushes, I'll never know.)
Here's my main question. I can get onto the roof, remove the cap, clean it, and clean the chimney, but where is all of that creosote going to go? As best as I can tell, any creosote I've knocked loose will fall down into the space that used to be the fireplace and is now sealed off with a piece of durarock. How am I going to get the stuff out? A shop vac with bunch of hose from the roof? The only other way would be to disconnect the stove and stove pipe and snake a vac hose down into that space. That seems nearly impossible plus I'd have to shut the stove down and the house gets really cold, really quick.
I would like to do as much of this myself rather than paying someone. Any ideas? Other thoughts, comments, etc are welcome. This seems like a really great community. I've learned a lot. I just wish I'd known a little more up front.

Fireplace/hearth set up prior to wood stove installation

The current deal

 

[ikessky]

You would have to pull out the stove pipe and snake the shop vac in through there to get at the creosote you knock down. That would be the easiest/quickest way.

What kind of back up heat do you have? Forced air, hydronic, etc?

 

[kerryb23]

That cleaning method you explained is pretty much what I expected. I have a heat pump, which is out of service right now. I would like to eventually get it repaired, but until we can spare the money, we'd have to rely on a space heater to warm the immediate area we're using. I guess I could take one day to do the cleaning (when I pull the Vogelzang and install the Englander) and just deal with a cooler house for a day or so. Hopefully one good cleaning will take care of things for the rest of the season and I'll just plan accordingly next year and do cleanings when we have warmer days. I can sort of get away with that in Tennessee. Thank goodness I'm not living in the north. Those who do have my admiration.

 

[edthedawg]

I can't see your setup here - the pix are firewalled, so I'll try to remember to look tonight from home. As I read your description, I'm confused a little - sounds like you do NOT have a liner to the top exit of the chimney? Stove is therefore just direct-vented into the flue? What is the size of that masonry flue?

I also don't see this Durock blocking panel mentioned in your installation. What holds it in? It's the only thing in the way of cleaning out the gunk back there? I'd think if there was a many-cubic-foot chamber just sitting back there, well below the thimble / entry point, you might be able to just leave the accumulated buildup until warmer weather hits. Then disconnect things if needed. Durock sheets are cheap to replace.

Having some available, safe means of routinely maintaining / cleaning out the system is a code requirement...

 

[edthedawg]

That's.... an interesting installation. So there's a sheet of Durock right behind the stove there? And that stove has always been so white on the sides? or just since you started running it?

 

[Highbeam]

It looks like a durock block off plate in the typical place but without a pipe through it. Then they just blasted in a thimble below the liner but above the smoke shelf.

So on the outside of the building, outside of the chimney is there a little cast iron door about 12"x12" square? That little door should allow you access to the smoke shelf which is where all the swept creosote from the flue should pile up. Without the little door yo'd either need to remove that pipe elbow or remove the durock block off plate to shop vac the creosote. I wouldn't leave it in there myself.

The reason a stove turns white like that is because the paint has been burnt off. Have you ever had the stove glowing red?

 

[kerryb23]

Thanks everyone for all the responses and suggestions.

Czarcar (or anyone else) - can you explain this tee cap as a means of accessing the chimney? I'll be installing the Englander as soon as it arrives and if I can change to a type of stove pipe that'll let me vacuum the fallen creosote without dismantling the entire set up, that would be great.

Ed - no, there is no chimney liner. The stove is vented directly into the original masonry chimney that was built for a fireplace. However, I have no idea what size the flue is. How could I determine that? The durarock panel was cut to size to fit the fireplace opening and sealed in with some type of high temp silicone adhesive. The stove turned white on the sides after 2-4 weeks of near 24/7 use. There have been times that the temp jumps up to 750f, despite my best efforts to control. Then I just sit there and watch it like a hawk. It's very poorly sealed. Over time I've managed to learn how to load it to keep temps in the proper range.

Pyro - no, there's is outside access door for cleaning. I'm afraid that when the chimney sweep company installed the stove, they didn't consider that I would be wanting to clean/maintain it myself as much as possible. Unfortunate, and it was my mistake to not think through the set up in terms of cleaning/inspection. Fortunately, no, the stove has never turned red.

Sounds like I'll be cleaning it the hard way via stove pipe removal. Or possibly removing the durarock. Has anyone done that before? I've seen the durarock panels in stove/fireplace stores, along with the adhesive. I don't recall how much they cost. However, since I'll be getting a new stove in a couple of weeks I'll clean via the disconnection method and hopefully that'll hold me over for the rest of the season while I evaluate what to do next year.

Thanks again, everyone.