New to the forum looking at owb or iwb.

toecheese Posted By toecheese, Mar 2, 2015 at 7:37 PM

  1. toecheese

    toecheese
    Member 2.
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    Feb 28, 2015
    14
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    Loc:
    usa
    Hello everyone. I am new to wood boilers. I have been looking at a few owb's like CB 1450, Heatmaster G200. I want to heat 3500 sq house, water and clothes dryer. I live in central North Carolina where the winters are 10f to 50f. I want to run the boilers all year long. I will have to build a shed to keep the wood dry which is no problem. Right now I am running all electric heat pumps, water heater etc. My electric bills range from 450 in the winter to 285 in the summer. What I am wanting is some direction. I know nothing about iwb's. I know I will have to build a outdoor building to be able to have a iwb. I have quotes for both of the owb's CB 1450 10,300. G200 10,875. Both are with all parts to hook up with 100ft of underground thermopex.

    Thank you ahead for any help I receive.
     
  2. JP11

    JP11
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    May 15, 2011
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    Loc:
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    Read, Read, and Read some more. Many, many threads on here. You are picking an expensive, inefficient solution at the moment.

    Other than hanging your clothes to dry in the basement, not sure how a boiler is going to dry your clothes.

    JP
     
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  3. toecheese

    toecheese
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    Feb 28, 2015
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    Jp11 I heard of people have a heat exchanger at their clothes dryer.
     
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  4. JP11

    JP11
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    May 15, 2011
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    Loc:
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    huh. never heard of that.
     
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  5. toecheese

    toecheese
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    Feb 28, 2015
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    What I have been reading it works very well. I would think that is a big cost in an electric bill.
     
  6. leon

    leon
    Minister of Fire 2.
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    Feb 3, 2013
    526
    20
    Loc:
    Southern Finger Lakes Region of New York
    =====================================================================================================

    Have an energy audit done first!

    I cannot emphasize that simple point enough ;ex

    Everything has its Opportunity Cost:

    Opportunity Cost is defined as what you are willing to give up in exchange
    to obtain something else of equal or greater value.

    Outdoor Wood Boilers are becoming an albatross in some areas
    where local zoning boards are no longer being allowed due to the
    smoke.

    Do you plan on buying split wood or cutting and splitting your own wood
    It gets old awful fast.

    After 33 years of feeding an indoor wood boiler I am not going to burn wood
    anymore after this year as i have access to anthracite coal.

    If you buy wood you will pay by the thrown or stacked cord and split cord wood will
    typically cost you seven hundred percent more than when it is bought by the ton.

    A cord of seasoned hard wood splits may cost you $240 dollars plus fuel tax and
    will be the same cost as a ton of oiled rice coal or a little bit more due to freight costs

    Pellets costs will vary with the season and the affects of the previous winters
    heating season and may cost as much or more than a ton of oiled anthracite rice coal.


    ====================================================

    About your home

    You will be surprised at what is leaking heat.


    1.you have to decide what will cost you less, home improvements
    or a "Forest Eater" and building a wood shed.

    You have to feed the wood boiler several times a day.
    If you have a non pressurized system you have to treat the water with chemicals.

    Your water quality will also be an issue and a water softener is a good idea for
    the water supply for the boiler.


    Hint- improving your home with an energy upgrade will make
    huge difference and energy upgrade rebates are still available.


    2. You would be surprised how much heat is lost to poor construction
    materials and lack of insulation.

    3. A pellet boiler is also a good option simply because of its simplicity
    but the pellet boiler will use twice the amount of pellets in tonnage
    of a small coal stoker stove or boiler.

    4. A very small coal stoker boiler like a Keystoker KAA-2 is an option
    that would fit in your basement and not require a shed.

    5. You could build a shed to store some oiled coal if you want if you persue
    coal as an option as it gives you the most heat per ton.


    =================================================================

    I want you to succeed not fail and I want you to examine all the heating options
    as you can buy coal in your area.

    A pellet boiler with energy improvements will save on utility costs, ditto for a small coal stove or
    coal stoker boiler to heat your home and hot water as they make more heat per ton of fuel.


    Think!!!!! Examine the TOTAL first cost for the complete cost of energy improvements.

    Examine and reexamine the total cost of installing a forest eater and wood shed and fifteen or more cords of mixed
    hardwoods or softwoods each year.

    Your forest eater may develop leaks so take that into consideration.

    Look at a small coal stoker boiler, the cost of installation with a small shed to store bagged or bulk rice coal
    and their life span, many are still operating after fifty years of service.

    Lastly examine the energy efficiency gains from energy improvements B4 you do anything.

    With the wild weather we now have and will continue to have energy improvements and a
    small coal stoker or pellet stoker boiler will react quicker to heating needs faster with quicker
    recovery than a forest eater because of the water volume.

    Anthracite coal will provide you with more heat per ton of fuel than cord wood or wood pellets.

    Think, think some more, then think some more.

    Examine how much work you want to do to heat your home 10, 20, thirty years from now.

    you can store bagged coal and pellets for years and as long as you have a dehumidifier to
    reduce the moisture in the bags where you store them-preferably the basement you will be better off.

    I made that mistake and I wish I had started burning coal 33 years ago instead of wood.
     
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  7. toecheese

    toecheese
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    Feb 28, 2015
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    My home is very tight. Newly built in 2008. I just run an efficiency test last year. Also run a blower door test to see how tight my house was. Everything come out great. I want to look at cutting my heat and hot water bill now.
     
  8. Smoke Signals

    Smoke Signals
    Burning Hunk 2.
    NULL
    

    Dec 19, 2013
    189
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    Loc:
    Central illinois
    What kind of heating system do you have now?

    Edit: never mind, I see you have heat pumps. I assume that mean you have existing duct work?
     
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  9. toecheese

    toecheese
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    Feb 28, 2015
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    Yes. Heat pumps and existing duct work. Also house is 2 story with a open living room with high ceilings.
     
  10. Smoke Signals

    Smoke Signals
    Burning Hunk 2.
    NULL
    

    Dec 19, 2013
    189
    46
    Loc:
    Central illinois
    I know you asked about boilers but you may want to at least take a look at the Kuuma wood furnace. The bigger one will heat a house your size (as advertised) and as I just learned will heat domestic hot water (special order) and do both very efficiently. Only thing it will not do is dry your cloths. But at a fraction of the cost of installing boiler and given your climate I think this would off set the cost of running a dryer. Just a thought. Do a search for the Kuuma on this site, you will see that every one that has one is quite pleased.

    Disclaimer: I am in no way associated with Kuuma nor do I benefit from the sale of there product.
     
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  11. toecheese

    toecheese
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    Feb 28, 2015
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    Smoke thanks for your input. I will look at them.
     
  12. toecheese

    toecheese
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    Feb 28, 2015
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    I have been looking at an EKO 40. Looks like a good IWB.
     
  13. Karl_northwind

    Karl_northwind
    Minister of Fire 2.
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    Feb 13, 2012
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    Loc:
    Central Wi.
    I'll second the Kuuma, we put in a couple this year for clients and they've both been really happy with them. search for them on this site and you'll find lots of reports, and as far as I remember, all positive. we had one control fry very quickly after install, and they had a new one to the client within a couple days. not bad....
     
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  14. toecheese

    toecheese
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    Feb 28, 2015
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    I can't use a Kuuma furnace. All I have is a crawl space. I need something that can go outside or in a outbuilding. I want to build a lean to off the back side of my building. Either put a owb or iwb. I have been looking at the Heatmaster g200 and the eko 40. Has anyone had any good things to say about either?
     
  15. woodsmaster

    woodsmaster
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    Jan 25, 2010
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    Indoor gasser in a shed with storage in house or shed is the way to go in my opinion, if you want to go the boiler route. Especially if you can do most the install yourself. do lots of research on here before you make a decision. You will have about the same money in it if you can do the install work and find / modify some tanks for storage on your own. Its not something everyone has the time, desire and ability to do and if you hire it done it will add a lot to the price so you have to take that into consideration.
     
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  16. leon

    leon
    Minister of Fire 2.
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    Feb 3, 2013
    526
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    Loc:
    Southern Finger Lakes Region of New York
    If you want a long term burn a pellet boiler with a
    large hopper is an option.

    A coal stoker boiler is an another option for even longer
    term burn times of 2-3 days).
     
  17. atvalaska

    atvalaska
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    Jul 22, 2014
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    Loc:
    nenana
    ""Anthracite coal will provide you with more heat per ton of fuel than cord wood or wood pellets."" welcome to my world, I burn this in combo with my wood= awesome ....people up here are looking to heat pumps (2 cold) and u are looking at wood...the world is upside own
     
  18. toecheese

    toecheese
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    Feb 28, 2015
    14
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    Loc:
    usa
    Well for coal I would like too but in my area I don't have a supplier. Also how do you store the coal? And burning pellets is the cost of pellets more than buying cut wood? What pellet system would heat 3500 sq and water?
     
  19. toecheese

    toecheese
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    Feb 28, 2015
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    Loc:
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    Woodmaster I was going to do my install. IWB I don't know enough about them. How much less wood will it burn compared to an outdoor gassifacation burner?
     
  20. leon

    leon
    Minister of Fire 2.
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    Feb 3, 2013
    526
    20
    Loc:
    Southern Finger Lakes Region of New York
    =====================================================================================================

    As for suppliers here are two right off:

    Dennis Farms 1-419-335-4665

    Bob Falmuth 1- 574-527-1322

    You can contact Reading coal for more Reading coal dealers in Indiana

    1- 570-276-1449


    Blaschak coal

    1-570-773-2113

    1-800-553-3117


    Lehigh coal 1-570-668-9060


    There are lots of coal dealers and coal bagging plant operators in the northeast and central united states
     
  21. toecheese

    toecheese
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    Feb 28, 2015
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    Loc:
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    Leon I'm in North Carolina. But I will call them and see about dealers in NC. Is it cheaper to buy coal than wood annually?
     
  22. leon

    leon
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    Feb 3, 2013
    526
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    Loc:
    Southern Finger Lakes Region of New York
    There are lots of coal, wood pellet and oil use comparison calculators on the web

    Anthracite burning at 75 percent efficiency on average provides 26.27 million BTU
    per ton.

    Even a small coal stoker without a hot water coil is very efficient

    In New York where I am coal in bulk is $240 Dollars per ton picked up.

    Wood Pellets are 219.00-240+ up here-all depends on the distance to the pellet plant and sawmills
    and pellet scarcity during the heating season.

    From what I understand you would burn twice the amount of pellets as compared
    to cord wood.

    You burn much more firewood than you would with coal there are fuel calculators
    on the www.nepadigital.com coal forum and here as well.

    So much depends on whether you buy cut split wood or logs or whether you are able to
    buy logs by the ton.

    I have stopped buying firewood because coal even with freight charges to New York is more economical
    and its less work. It also takes up less room.

    If you rented a long straight truck and bought 6-8 tons in bags all you would have is
    the truck rental day rate and filling the tank before you turned it in.

    You would have to check with folks like Dalmation Coal Sales in Coopersburg, Pennsylvania to see
    what you would be charged if you picked it up at Coopersburg.

    They have been bagging Lehigh coal and it burns very well with white ash.

    You can pick coal up in bulk at most mines -especially Lehigh on the weekends if you have a
    small truck and trailer as well but it all depends on your situation.
    Having a friend with a big dump truck helps too.

    Check with the Brushy Mountain Bee folks too. as they make wood pellets from the sawdust they create
    making pile beehive parts.
     
  23. Dado2

    Dado2
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    Apr 17, 2019
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    Loc:
    Poland
    That's right. I have stopped buying firewood too. I'm buying now anthracite from http://www.kinvestments.eu/offer/anthracite-coal. I think that is better, but if you use firewood, i understand you too. For one person this way is better, another choose anthracite or other coal, that's normal.
     

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