New Wood Lot

[peakbagger]

I just signed the deed for my new 82 acre wood lot. Been looking for one for several years but in Northern NH big lots are not that common. There was a ice storm in the area in 1998 and it looks like the owner took advantage of various grants and cost shares to salvage it. Prior to the ice storm it was loaded with some big old northern hardwoods (mostly maple, with some birch, beech and cherry). He put in a well built internal road system with appropriate ditching and water bars. He also had a survey done and the lines blazed. A major plus is its enrolled in something called Current Use which rewards landowners to leave open space. The total taxes on the property are $108 per year. There is some limited possibility to cut a couple of house lots off the frontage, but once they go residential I have to pay a small penalty to take them out of Current Use.

It used to have a nice sugarbush and there are a few isolated stands left. Nothing commercial for quite awhile but may be an interesting hobby in the future.

Given my limited fire wood use, I expect I wont even make a dent in it just doing trimming. There are several acres of beech that came back in after the ice storm and the recommended approach is pick one good tree, preferably not beech and cut everything around it in 50 foot radius or at a minimum double girdle it and leave it there.

Not going to do much this winter but expect its going to get a lot of attention next year.

 

[sen166]

Holy smokes; that's some property! I often dream of owning a property half that size someday... Congratulations and I hope you get years of enjoyment on your new investment.

 

[Wood Duck]

Why would you cut all of the trees in the beech stand? Is Beech undesirable? It is great firewood and a nice wildlife tree too.

 

[kennyp2339]

First thing I would do is identify all (if any) Norway Maple and girdle that 1st since its invasive, then I would mop up the beech area and possibly plant a locust stand (they grow pretty fast and have a root mat system, as on tree is cut down a new shoot grows up)
In any event, good luck almost 90 acres would be a dream for me, its nearly impossible to find that here in NNJ, and taxes would kill me, even farmland assessed

 

[peakbagger]

Beech is unfortunately regarded as a weed tree in a northern hardwood stand due to beech blight. It has very tenacious root structure and will overwhelm other more desirable trees. It really doesn't have much of a commercial value due to the blight. There definitely are differing levels of blight resistance and occasionally I do see some nice large specimens. My observations (not backed up by any hard research) is that younger dense beech stands tend to have a much higher incidence of blight and its occurs earlier in the smaller diameter trees. If left alone the stand becomes a dense thicket of young beech with mostly dying blighted larger specimens. Its takes 40 years before the trees start to put out mast and usually they are dead before then. There are some very impressive large older obvious beech mast trees in some of less ice storm damaged parts of woods complete with bear claw scars. One of the sad parts of the blight cycle is that the blight starts with scars in the bark and frequently a source of scars is when the trees start to get old enough to start putting out nuts. Bears will climb the young nut bearing trees and scars from the claws will appear. I have observed many nice looking straight beeches with scars from bears one year that will start to show blight around the scars left by the bear claws a few years later. The large mast beeches I have sprinkled around the property do seem to be mostly blight resistant and maybe they will pass on their resistance.

One of the hard things folks don't understand with woods management is that if left alone it takes lot longer to get desirable woods, one of the basic rules is to aggressively thin out the undesirable specimens favoring far fewer trees that have the potential to grow into quality trees. This will look pretty aggressive to someone who isn't used to forestry management as these thinning cuts will take out 2/3rds of the trees. The tough thing with beech is that no matter how well you thin, that nice straight beech has a high likelihood of getting taken out by blight. If given a choice its far better to encourage maple, yellow birch and white birch and on occasion cherry(they are pretty rare up north and have their own disease issues) . Usually a hardwood stand needs several pre-commercial thinning's that don't yield enough wood to offset the cost of the thinning before its gets to the point where it start yielding some valuable wood. Ideally on a small lot our quest for firewood can be focused on doing that thinning but once the lot gets large the amount of firewood exceeds the demand. Girdling or dropping in place is a less desirable alternative but it does keep the nutrients in the woods.

The prior owner had a long term management plan done at one point and I plan to have it updated. The management plan takes into account a lot of things like wildlife, recreation (there is a long term hiking trail that cuts across a corner of the land and it abuts the largest town forest in NH) but its primary focus is to get the best quality forest stands given the soils and climate. The management plan makes recommendations on what to do to help the woods end up so they are as good as they can get.

The reality is that I will get to play around on this property for many years but expect that the I wont live to see it returned back to where it was prior to the 3 days ice storm in 1998. I may pick up a small bandsaw mill at some point but want to spend some time getting to know the woods before I do much

 

[peakbagger]

Luckily no Norway Maple issues in this area. I see them on occasion but since there is little or no suburbia they don't have a foothold. There is also a fairly odd connection between earthworms and forest stand types that would probably preclude Norway's being an issue. Earthworms are actually an invasive species in northern hardwood stands, the repeated glaciations wiped out all the native earthworms. The woods have evolved to build up very deep layers of duff (mostly decomposing wood and leaves), without earthworms, this duff layer is quite deep and it favors rooting of certain tree types, like sugar and red maples, birch and beech. Earthworms aggressively convert the duff into a much shallower layer and that preferentially encourages less desirable tree types including invasives.

 

[lost in the woods]

just for curiosity. . . how much did you pay per acre for the 82 acre piece? I know what ground like that goes for here in central PA and I was just wondering what prices are up north

 

[peakbagger]

Not cheap $1,500 an acre, well over the going rate for raw woodland in Northeast VT and western Maine (northern NH is fairly "skinny" so I can be in ME or VT in about 45 minutes).There are a multiple drivers for pricing. NH has a Current Use law which encourages land from being developed. There are similar programs in ME and VT but they are inferior and impose long term costs on the owner to retain the status. Raw woodland is probably worth $600 to $800 an acre. This is for a mix of exposures and woods type. If kept long term as an investment and managed properly the owner will generate long term income. Timber liquidators will pay more but is very dependent on what the liquidation value is on the land. If its mature woods with good access they will pay a premium and clear cut the land. Since there is a lot of conserved land in the region and recreational use they also try to angle "greenmail" where they strip the land and then threaten to subdivide the remaining land unless some entity steps up a buy the land outright or buys a conservation easement. These are usually multimillion dollar deals that an average person have no hopes of getting in on. There is a large timber liquidator that bought some old paper mill land 20 years ago that moved into the area and has stripped these properties clean, they made significant dollars by clearcutting previously responsibly managed stands plus greenmail (the fed paid them millions to buy 5 miles of frontage along the Appalachian trail). They are keeping some local large lots and have them priced well over the mid term value as it will be 30 to 50 years before the woods come back and when they find a sucker they sell them. The town I bought my land in didn't want this to happen and bought much of the papermill land in the town before it was liquidated and created the largest town forest in the state.

The reality is that the price is driven up substantially by the potential frontage lots. The town is a fairly desirable "summer colony" surrounded by the White Mountain National forest to the north and south and the lot has a south facing view of the Northern Presidential range. If I wanted sell off a frontage lot I would cover about a third of the cost. The White Mountain National Forest is close enough to Boston and southern NH that land values in the area are driven by folks looking for summer places. It was interesting that the asking price for a similar 40 acre lot with an old house that needed tearing down is on the market for $2,500 an acre. As there is a house on the lot the taxes are $2,000 a year as the house portion of the lot is not covered by current use. The town does have fairly strict land use rules which discourage large subdivisions so the only option for me to sell a few lots is sell frontage on an existing town road and keep the back lot attached to one frontage lot.

The other reason for paying a premium is that the land is close to my house, Its a quick drive down the road so its convenient for me. No sense in buying land an hour or two away as it means its far more of a hassle to go there and haul wood home.

 

[Jags]

Sounds like you have the retirement hobby in place. Keep the pro's in the loop when you are gettting your plans together. And maybe even get more than one pro's opinion. They often differ based off of opinion. And be a little critical of the opinions given. Its your property and they may have an agenda that doesn't match to yours. Just one dudes opinion that has some experience with agenda driven goals (DNR) of the "pros".

 

[heavy hammer]

Nice pickup, something like that is a dream come true for most people. I hope it works out with property like that you definitely need at least a tractor, maybe more. You will have many fun filled weekends there!

 

[Jeffm1]

I just signed the deed for my new 82 acre wood lot. Been looking for one for several years but in Northern NH big lots are not that common. There was a ice storm in the area in 1998 and it looks like the owner took advantage of various grants and cost shares to salvage it. Prior to the ice storm it was loaded with some big old northern hardwoods (mostly maple, with some birch, beech and cherry). He put in a well built internal road system with appropriate ditching and water bars. He also had a survey done and the lines blazed. A major plus is its enrolled in something called Current Use which rewards landowners to leave open space. The total taxes on the property are $108 per year. There is some limited possibility to cut a couple of house lots off the frontage, but once they go residential I have to pay a small penalty to take them out of Current Use.

It used to have a nice sugarbush and there are a few isolated stands left. Nothing commercial for quite awhile but may be an interesting hobby in the future.

Given my limited fire wood use, I expect I wont even make a dent in it just doing trimming. There are several acres of beech that came back in after the ice storm and the recommended approach is pick one good tree, preferably not beech and cut everything around it in 50 foot radius or at a minimum double girdle it and leave it there.

Not going to do much this winter but expect its going to get a lot of attention next year.

Coppice them. Then there will still be wood in the future and since it has a full grown, mature root system it will regrow much faster.

 

[peakbagger]

Nice pickup, something like that is a dream come true for most people. I hope it works out with property like that you definitely need at least a tractor, maybe more. You will have many fun filled weekends there!

In anticipation of buying a woodlot, I picked up a surplus military vehicle that should fill the bill

http://olive-drab.com/idphoto/id_photos_see_tractor.php

 

[Pellet_Pete]

Largest town forest in NH? I've been through there. That's a great stretch of woods - most moose I've ever seen in a single day (5). Congrats and great work on your research of current use and commitment to continuing that land ethic. I know from reading your posts that you've got good woods sense - I'm sure it's a thrill to have some woods of your own to work with. I'm starting to get tired of the "gee, what I would do if these were my woods" bit. Someday I'll have my own hopefully.


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[Pellet_Pete]

Coppice them. Then there will still be wood in the future and since it has a full grown, mature root system it will regrow much faster.

Unfortunately beech doesn't coppice. It suckers profusely from the root system (and sometimes sends up "stool shoots" from cut stumps). This is part of the problem with it, especially on dry/rocky/acidic sites where one dead tree can crowd out a tenth of an acre in short order.


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[peakbagger]

I have heard of some folks who use roundup on the cut stumps to knock the roots out. Beech is not a typical foresters friend.

 

[StihlKicking]

I have heard of some folks who use roundup on the cut stumps to knock the roots out. Beech is not a typical foresters friend.

Round up has zero effect if applied to stumps. It must be applied directly to foliage to have have any effect.

 

[Jeffm1]

Unfortunately beech doesn't coppice. It suckers profusely from the root system (and sometimes sends up "stool shoots" from cut stumps). This is part of the problem with it, especially on dry/rocky/acidic sites where one dead tree can crowd out a tenth of an acre in short order.


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Well, I don't have any personal experience coppicing and while there are articles on the internet that say beech does not coppice easily, there are others that say it does:
http://northernwoodlands.org/articles/article/coppicing-firewood

"...The most obvious advantage of coppicing is rapid growth, thanks to the already established rootstock. Larger stumps will produce more sprouts, so choose trees that are at least four inches in diameter. We’re fortunate in the northeast that our most desirable firewood species (maple, beech, birch, oak, cherry, and hophornbeam) coppice relatively easily, using a five-step system:"

So I don't know what to think. One way to find out I guess is to try it and see...

 

[peakbagger]

I have no need or interest to coppice more small growth, the goal of most forest management is to concentrate the available sun water and soil resources to fewer larger trees. Eventually the larger trees develop enough canopy that it blocks off the competing underlying undergrowth.

I don't plan to use herbicide but I have read that a method of knocking back regrowth of suckers from a root system is to brush apply a roundup type herbicide to the cut cambium of the sucker.

 

[peakbagger]

Largest town forest in NH? I've been through there. That's a great stretch of woods - most moose I've ever seen in a single day (5).

This property shares a border with the Randolph Town Forest. It even has one of the local hiking trails that cut across a corner of it. For those who want see how a large forest is managed, their management plan is on their website and is quite extensive. The one I got with my lot is far simpler.

 

[Oldman47]

Reading through your first post, the novel, made me wonder how that site is being managed. My own management plan has me clearing my tree plantation back to only 1 tree in each 20x20 foot area but a 100 foot circle centered on a single tree is almost making a yard tree out of each remaining tree. That leaves only about 44 trees per acre. My plan leaves me at a bit more than 100 trees per acre.

I suggest you check the numbers in your plan again because that is extremely thin for even a very mature forest.

 

[peakbagger]

There are multiple stand types spread through the lot all with distinct prescriptions. I do plan to get the plan updated and definitely will check it when I get it.

 

[Pellet_Pete]

Reading through your first post, the novel, made me wonder how that site is being managed. My own management plan has me clearing my tree plantation back to only 1 tree in each 20x20 foot area but a 100 foot circle centered on a single tree is almost making a yard tree out of each remaining tree. That leaves only about 44 trees per acre. My plan leaves me at a bit more than 100 trees per acre.

I suggest you check the numbers in your plan again because that is extremely thin for even a very mature forest.

I think he was specifically talking about areas coming back to beech suckers. To mitigate the heavy beech thickets (typically undesirable in New England) he was describing a method of "picking a winner" and clearing out the immediate competitors on that same root system. Probably not happening on all acres, but in a very young stand it wouldn't be out of the question either.


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[Bad LP]

Good for you.
Part of my day job in MA is managing 40 +/- acres of forest/ag land. At one point it was over 200 acres. Have to hire a forester and keep a current state approved wood cutting plan active (AKA Chapter 61, 61-A or 61-B) in order to avoid stupid sick taxes. I'm just going to play on the 14 acres in Maine I have and enjoy life. If I need more wood there is over 2 million acres out the back door. Somebody is bound to sell me a load or three.

 

[peakbagger]

Luckily NH current use doesn't have much of a penalty if I don't elect to have management plan. A friend in Vt had some woodlands under their version and she claimed that she had to cut the land. It was steep and hilly with lousy access and I don't think she made much off the sale.

 

[Woodfarmer1]

My bush is beech (blight), sugar maple (canker), ash (borer) and soft maple.
On one hand I'm glad I don't have to coppice to get firewood, I spent the weekend processing tops and blowdown in the 6" and under size. Man that takes forever to accumulate a cord.
On the other hand some days I think I should remove all the marketable timber while it's still good.