Newbie looking for advice for first small saw

[Big Scott]

Hi everyone, I've been cruising the forum here for a while and finally decided to join in and get some advice from you pros!

While we're still 18 months away from getting into our first real home, which will have a wood stove to lessen our dependence on the furnace and prevent the freezing cold nights without power or heat that we experience a couple times every winter, I wanted to start getting into the swing of things now. At the moment we only burn wood in our patio fire pit, although we go through a lot of wood just doing that a few times a week in nice weather. It seemed silly to keep buying scrap wood from the mill down the road, when there's tons of trees down everywhere around here (southern Adirondacks, NY) from Irene and Sandy and every lesser storm that comes along. So I started by getting an axe, maul, and wedges and bumming odd pieces from my father-in-law who does logging and firewood for a living. I'd whack em into workable pieces and that was going well, I actually really enjoyed splitting. Unfortunately, times are getting tough for him and though he won't admit it, I know he's barely breaking even and even that little bit of wood he was gladly giving us can help him stay in the black. So, I went and decide to start gathering my own wood.

I bought a 32" crosscut saw (go ahead and laugh, everyone does) and a sturdy tow strap and started making trips to the woods a couple times a week to fill my truck, cutting logs up to 14" and 5-6 feet long and dragging them out to the road. Thing is, I'm realizing that hand-sawing logs is not as easy as I thought it'd be, and I now have a stack of about 50 logs waiting to be bucked and split. I'm healthy enough to handle the hand splitting, but the thought of putting the crosscut to all that wood makes my shoulders cringe. So here's where you come in - I need suggestions for a smallish saw for cutting up logs no more than 14", mostly pines and spruce.

I'm thinking that when we get the house and the space for a serious woodpile I'll end up using this one for limbing, and get a big one for real cutting, so I'd like something that lasts. Probably won't use it more than a couple hours on any given day, but I've read bad reviews about the Homelites and such overheating in less time. The budget is tight, and with what I'll spend on chaps and face shield (the wife won't let me do this without the safety gear) and such the saw needs to be around $200 or so. After seeing the shape I was in from a four hour session with the crosscut and sawbuck, she gave me the go ahead to buy a saw, but insists I get a new one and not take a chance on used, so that limits options. Any starting points for me?

 

[BobUrban]

Hmmm?? At that price point you are very limited in the NEW saw market. I know many are using Craftsman, Homi's, Echos and others in small homeowner grade with some reasonable success - even the dreaded "Wildthing" has kept a lot of homes warm. Do diligence when shopping will likely offer the best deal and with limited use and proper maintenance you can run some of these saws a long time. Just know their limitations and try not to push them and any one should do what you are asking.

In the mean time start squirreling away a few bucks a week so when you want/need to upgrade the sting wont hurt so much. 10 bucks a week for a year will buy you a lot of saw.

 

[bluefrier]

Husqvarna factory refurbished 445 can be had for about $229 on ebay. These are much better quality than any poulan or homelite and they come with a factory warranty.

 

[kingquad]

Check arboristsite's trading post area. There's a Husky 350 with aftermarket 346 top end and a couple stihl 026's and 028 super all for <$200.

 

[BobUrban]

x2 on what KingQuad said!! I just jumped over to Arborist to see if that 350/346 was still available and that is a ton of saw for 200 bucks. The 350 has a great reputation for being a super 50cc saw and the 346 kit makes it legendary in the mid/small saw world. Note - you will likely need a bar and chain for this saw but that wont break the bank and it will pull 18" with authority. If I didn't have a 350 in the stable I would be buying it myself.

 

[bigbarf48]

At that price, what you want is a stihl ms170/180. That was my first small saw, and they're great for their size

I tackled many logs that were probably too big for the little guy, but they always got bucked up.

Since you say you're mostly dealing with 14" pine and spruce, one of these saws will be PLENTY, and you get them brand new with a warranty

 

[Big Scott]

This is probably a dumb question, but I'm totally new to this and have always believed the only dumb question is the one you don't ask, so here goes. Are the bigger saws a good choice for bucking a lot of 8" - 12" logs, with a few as big as 14" but no bigger? I ask because it seems from the pics and videos I've seen online, here and elsewhere, that most people use the smaller saws for smaller cuts. They seem to be 14" or 16" bars mostly, is that just because of how many small cuts are involved, or is it safer (for beginners especially) to use a lighter and shorter saw? I get the impression that's the reason, but I could be wrong. I've learned the hard way, far too many times, that the rule to follow is use the right tool for the job. I won't be felling any trees, only bucking small wood for now, and maybe some bigger logs later on but they'll be down already.

Also, I went to the Stihl site and can't find any info about the 026, but the Husky 350 has an awful lot of bad reviews online (a lot of broken parts and repair costs) and as said before, the misses is very much against a used saw. I might be able to use this to get a bit more of a budget for a new one though, since I do have a birthday coming soon!

She already nixed the idea of me trying out one of her dad's saws, since they're all working-class beasts and way too powerful for what I need, on top of being as loud as a jet engine which would get us kicked out of the trailer park! We're stuck living here for just one more year till we get the money for the house together, and the manager won't tolerate much more than "normal" power tool noise, so I'm hoping a smaller saw would be comparable to a circular saw in volume. Otherwise I'd have to haul the logs somewhere else to cut them, and that's nuts. Is it normal for pro saws to be so much louder than the smaller homeowner versions the neighbors use to clean up fallen limbs and such? It seems like the engines are only a little bigger, but the noise difference is crazy.

 

[Thistle]

Most mid sized to very large pro saws are much louder than smaller homeowner versions.And the engines can vary greatly in size - from 60cc to 122cc depending on the operator's needs.Where as most homeowner saws are generally 30 to 45cc range of displacement.One difference between a homeowner & pro saw even if they're close in size is the quality of the parts used - pro are much more durable,take heavy abuse & last longer before needing repair or replacement.

 

[kingquad]

This is probably a dumb question, but I'm totally new to this and have always believed the only dumb question is the one you don't ask, so here goes. Are the bigger saws a good choice for bucking a lot of 8" - 12" logs, with a few as big as 14" but no bigger? I ask because it seems from the pics and videos I've seen online, here and elsewhere, that most people use the smaller saws for smaller cuts. They seem to be 14" or 16" bars mostly, is that just because of how many small cuts are involved, or is it safer (for beginners especially) to use a lighter and shorter saw? I get the impression that's the reason, but I could be wrong. I've learned the hard way, far too many times, that the rule to follow is use the right tool for the job. I won't be felling any trees, only bucking small wood for now, and maybe some bigger logs later on but they'll be down already.

Also, I went to the Stihl site and can't find any info about the 026, but the Husky 350 has an awful lot of bad reviews online (a lot of broken parts and repair costs) and as said before, the misses is very much against a used saw. I might be able to use this to get a bit more of a budget for a new one though, since I do have a birthday coming soon!

She already nixed the idea of me trying out one of her dad's saws, since they're all working-class beasts and way too powerful for what I need, on top of being as loud as a jet engine which would get us kicked out of the trailer park! We're stuck living here for just one more year till we get the money for the house together, and the manager won't tolerate much more than "normal" power tool noise, so I'm hoping a smaller saw would be comparable to a circular saw in volume. Otherwise I'd have to haul the logs somewhere else to cut them, and that's nuts. Is it normal for pro saws to be so much louder than the smaller homeowner versions the neighbors use to clean up fallen limbs and such? It seems like the engines are only a little bigger, but the noise difference is crazy.

The Husky 350 is a damn good saw. It is a discontinued model though, as is the 026 and 028. The 350 and 026 are pro grade construction, not 100% sure about the 028. But, I do know that the 028 is a damn good firewood saw.

If I were only going to own 1 saw, it wouldn't be <50cc. When you start getting into 10-14in logs, you're going to want those extra cc's. Nothing wrong with an MS170, but my time is valuable and I'm not going to piss around all day bucking logs with a 30cc saw.

 

[Fifelaker]

There is a guy on AS that rebuilds 346's and sells them for $300-$350 If I needed a small saw I would hit him up in a NY minute.

 

[kingquad]

There is a guy on AS that rebuilds 346's and sells them for $300-$350 If I needed a small saw I would hit him up in a NY minute.

His screen name is nmurph. I bought a 346 from him a couple years ago and was very pleased with the saw and the seller. I sold it to a friend, which I regret. He is very happy with the saw though.

 

[_CY_]

if you are limited to $200 and it's got to be new.
go with Stihl MS170 .. it's a tough little saw that's used commercially by Asplundh as a climbing saw.

MS170 uses a tiny pico chain which are not very durable for dirty wood. keep it clean and a pico chain cuts a very long time.

it's the same chain used in MS200T pro climbing saw and all the power pruners.

 

[bigbarf48]

I think you'll be plenty happy with the 170 for the wood you have. I've tackled 24" gum with mine and while it does take longer than a bigger saw, it still gets done

Im sure those built 346's are nice saws, but the guys asking for a new saw under $200 and those don't really fit that bill

 

[smokeater]

If you have the logs back in your yard and you want a quiet saw try an electric chainsaw,they will cut anything you have described in your post and can be purchased for a low price.I have gas and the electric saw and one thing for sure the electric saw starts every time.

 

[webie]

Since I have owned most of the stihl line up , best bang for your budget and new would be the MS170/180 . They are great little saws with a big heart . I have 2 ms 180's and lots of times they end up to be the go to saw just because of them being so light and nimble . With a reasonable amount of care they will last a long long time . The other thing is , is they make a great light weight limbing saw should you happen to get into a little more into wood cutting and get more serious with looking at a 2nd bigger saw , or in my case 10 or so ....LOL.
These little saws will certainly get the job done the biggest advantage of a bigger saw is the ability to cut bigger stuff faster . I have 16 inch bars on both of mine , but have changed from the standard pico chain to a to a 61PMMC3 . Your dealership can get you set up .

 

[TreePointer]

Professionals often modify their saws to increase performance. The easiest mod is to open the factory restricted muffler a bit, but it does create more noise.

Check your local Stihl & Husqvarna dealers to see if they have any refurbished saws, preferably 50cc's and 16" bar.

 

[Big Scott]

Thanks everyone, I did find a local Stihl shop only 15 minutes away, one of those places with 3 or 4 "old timers" that seem to be hanging out, and one of them got talkative when I said I was looking for advice. I like that kind of place! I mentioned how several of you had mentioned the 170 and they all agreed that until I get the house and land and woodlot and start cutting my own trees I'd be well served by the smaller saw. I got the feeling that he thought of the kind of cutting I'm doing as being the same as limbing on a "real" tree. He did have a point, what I'm cutting for the time being isn't much bigger than a lot of the limbs on a good-sized tree now that I think about it. Mostly that's because I've been getting my logs from a spot that's a ways in from the road and I have to drag it all out over pretty rough ground to get to the truck, so the thicker and heavier stuff is staying put. I was a little overwhelmed with info by the time it got mentioned but he did saw something about wanting to get a couple chains and a certain kind of oil, in addition to the chaps and safety helmet with face screen. I'm not sure if he meant new chains to replace the one it comes with, or spares to have in case I'd need to change out if I messed one up or it got dull. Either way, the recommendations here and online reviews have me feeling pretty good about the 170 as my starter saw. Having a Stihl shop nearby is good too. I know this isn't gonna be ripping through my logs like a hot knife through butter, but with the crosscut it has been taking around 5-10 minutes per cut in the big stuff, once that initial burst of energy fades, so I'm sure it'll be faster than I'm managing. Thanks for the help everyone, now come on payday!

 

[Jon1270]

For the logs that you've already brought home, I'd suggest you pick up a cheap used electric saw. They sometimes go for next to nothing, and are much quieter than any internal combustion model. Throw a new chain on it (or get some practice sharpening, which you'll need to learn anyhow), buck those logs and then sell the thing. In the future, just buck everything in the woods so you don't have to run the noisier gas saw at home.

BTW, I have a 350 and it's a fine saw. It's easy for any saw marketed to homeowners to get an undeserved bad rep in some circles because homeowners often have a poor understanding of how to use and maintain them.

 

[clemsonfor]

The 026 is not made anymore its at least 10 years old but still is a solid saw. Its newer brother is the ms260 and even newer the auto tune 261.

I would just buy a ms170 there $179 plus tax. Its stinks snapped homeowner saw and at 32cc its small but will cut. Personally its too small a saw for me to spend time sawing but for a fire pit and if your using a crosscut now !! It will be fine. And it will be pretty loud , not as much as a 70cc saw but will not be quiet by any means.

And as many that cringe at it the Poul an wild thing is less than $150 and its a 40cc saw. It will cut pretty decent for what it is. But sometimes needs a grab adjustment to start easy. They all need the grab adjusted honestly but a stihl is set up at a dealer and tested so it should be good and if u buy the syn oil at purchase u get a 2 yr warranty for the dealer to help u out with any small issues or big. And although you can heat a home using a ms170 as a main saw you will quickly see you will spend a lot of time bucking if your in wood bigger than 10"s.

And if your just getting scraps from the FIL how is he selling that ? It must be stuff that would be turned into firewood I guess , but how much are you burning in a fire pit ?

 

[TreePointer]

Do yourself a favor. Ask the dealer how much it will cost to get you into at least a 50cc (16-18") saw running .325 pitch chain, new or dealer refurb. You'll thank me for it when you don't have to buy a second saw.

 

[Ashful]

Used Stihl 036, the best firewood saw ever made, $300 in good condition. Search arborist site for a guy named DexterDay, a former member here, and an honest guy who's hooked up a few of us in the past. He rebuilds and sells these, usually super clean. Tell him we sent you.

 

[clemsonfor]

I will second anything joful says. Dexterday is a stand up guy. Anything he sells is as it. He even goes as far as telling you which screws are not factory on a saw. Will usually totally tear them down and disassemble them and tell you about the cylinder. Dex just sold an almost new 545 for $320 at another place on the net. This saw was barely used and in great shape. Had I not had 7 saws and wanted a 50cc saw I would of jumped all over it.

I understand the hesitation to buy uses esp if you can't wrench on them but you will get 2-3x the saw for your money buying used. And I would almost put money on anything you get from Dexter or almost any guy on AS will still be runing in 10 yrs if you care for it well (assuming you dont cut 7 cords of wood a year or anything). Shoot dex a pm at AS or I can give you another location and tell them we/I sent you. He will even keep an eye out for you and will get you something. They guy sells several saws a month at least.

 

[Big Scott]

And if your just getting scraps from the FIL how is he selling that ? It must be stuff that would be turned into firewood I guess , but how much are you burning in a fire pit ?

He splits his time between clearing lots and selling the firewood. He got one of those big processing machines a couple years back that bucks and splits the logs he loads with the forklift, but he has to trim off the ends first and it was those end trimmings that he was giving me to use in the fire pit. I noticed that he had started saving a bunch of them in big wire baskets, like 5 X 5 foot, and I asked his partner what they were for and the partner said those were mostly being sold to people using outdoor boilers when they were short on cash and couldn't buy regular wood. I guess with the outdoor units you can burn just about any size or shape pieces. I don't know how much he makes off that stuff, but if me taking it is costing him anything I'd feel lousy, so I told him I was gonna start gathering my own and tried not to make a big deal out of it. I know he's been hurting with the weird weather, the cost of fuel, and the fact that he's getting older, so any little bit has to help. Some kids messed with his skidder on a job site a while back and he had to put in money to repair that, and then he had to replace his boom truck, so his money is going into paying that off. To be honest, I don't think he has much of a profit margin anymore anyway, since everything is split and sold green and that has to sell for much less. He used to have row after row of wood split and seasoning up in his wood yard and would sell it that way, but he can't put in the hours he used to and barely keeps up now. It's a tough way to make a living that's for sure, and I respect anyone who does it, especially when they're in their 60s!

As far as how much we burn in the fire pit, you'd be surprised! The misses is something of a pyro and likes to throw 7 or 8 pieces in there at a time and have the thing so hot you need to sit back a few feet to not burn (her family has always had bonfires just about every weekend except the hottest part of summer) . . . and from spring until fall we entertain out on the patio most of the time since our place is really cramped and we have huge families that can't fit inside. We probably burn through a couple wheelbarrows of wood whenever we have folks over, and more during the week. Nothing beats a stressful day sitting at a computer for 11 or 12 hours like a cold drink by a nice fire, and I have a couple of those every week it seems although mine are much smaller. Can't wait till it's a fire in a stove in a new house, then I can enjoy it in the winter or rain too.

 

[Big Scott]

I will second anything joful says. Dexterday is a stand up guy. Anything he sells is as it. He even goes as far as telling you which screws are not factory on a saw. Will usually totally tear them down and disassemble them and tell you about the cylinder. Dex just sold an almost new 545 for $320 at another place on the net. This saw was barely used and in great shape. Had I not had 7 saws and wanted a 50cc saw I would of jumped all over it.

I understand the hesitation to buy uses esp if you can't wrench on them but you will get 2-3x the saw for your money buying used. And I would almost put money on anything you get from Dexter or almost any guy on AS will still be runing in 10 yrs if you care for it well (assuming you dont cut 7 cords of wood a year or anything). Shoot dex a pm at AS or I can give you another location and tell them we/I sent you. He will even keep an eye out for you and will get you something. They guy sells several saws a month at least.

I'm gonna have a shot at convincing my wife this is a better idea than buying a smaller one new, and see how that goes. If I hadn't been such a PITA with everything she's wanted to spend money on the past year it'd be no problem, but I've been pinching pennies a whole lot to get us into the new house and land and she has been really good about making sacrifices and having me tell her no when she wants this or that. Plus, when this started I'd said I was only gonna spend around $200 . . back before I realized those cheap saws in the big store were so bad . . . so it's gonna be tough to convince her to basically double that. Maybe some flowers and a chick flick will help

 

[Ashful]

Dex might be able to put you in an 029 or similar for something a little closer to $200, but the 036 is a great one-saw plan. Light enough to use for hours, powerful enough to get thru just about anything.

The primary point is that a pro saw, or even a farm and ranch saw, is going to last you many years. Maybe a lifetime. The Homelites and Poulans available at Lowes Depot are not as infinitely repairable, and the history of both companies supporting old product is not very good. I can still buy parts (both OEM and aftermarket) for my 25 year old Stihl 064. I wish I could say the same for my 8 year old trimmer bought at Depot.

There are several other builders on arboristsite that do similarly nice work, but I don't know any of them well enough to recommend anyone specific. Poke around, and you'll see who's done right by other members. I know DexterDay will treat you fair.