No Gas

[scidoc1]

I recently moved into a home with a Regency ng fireplace. It worked briefly
then went out. When restart failed I called P G&E. No gas.

We cannot locate the feeder pipe. Could the previous owner have had an emergency
shut off valve. No gas is at the valve orifice with the valve fully open.

Any help appreciated.

 

[infinitymike]

Code requires a shut off valve.
Trace the piping back to the main line and you'll find it.

 

[infinitymike]

Is there a basement?
Look under the fireplace for the piping.

 

[DAKSY]

Find your gas meter. There is a shut off coming into it.
That is the first place I'd look. Make sure it's ON.
Gas line shutoffs tend to be open when the handle is pointed
in the direction of the gas piping. Off when at 90 degrees to that.
Trace the incoming gas line from the meter to the fireplace.

 

[scidoc1]

Thanks for your replies. This is what occurred. Regency fireplace worked. We are new owners of home.
After a day or two the pilot lifgt went out. I assumed it was a simple relight, followed instructions-no go.
Called PG & E , to my surprise it could not be lit. We opened the access panel removed the gas line to the valve ,
opened the valve and could stick a pencil through, no gas. PG & E guy, very pleasant looked for line under
home and could not find tap to an active gas line, suggested calling a private contractor. I am not a tight wad
but try to repair anything I can.
The questions I have are
1. How could the fireplace be working, nothing touched, go out and there be no gas?
Could the previous owner have placed a safety cut off to prevent contnuous burning after her falling asleep with it on all night.
There is no thermostat hooked to it so presumably it would remain on. Either a cutoff switch closed or the line is blocked?
seems pretty rare to block the line.
2. Insulation is under the fireplace, I could tear it off and inspect, but a safety valve would not be placed in an inaccessible place.
3. If I have to call a local plumber, gas contractor, what is a reasonable charge to inspect and locate the line etc., ballpark
figure.
I will have a go at the insulation to find the line. But any ideas as to what happened.

This is my first fireplace, but I have worked on central heaters from inducer motor up. But this is not the fireplace, it is the gas
supply. All other gas appliances work.

Thanks for your advice.

 

[DAKSY]

Definitely weird. How long did it work? If the gas was shut off at the meter, it's conceivable that the remaining gas in the line could run it for a brief time, but depending on the size of the line after the meter, I wouldn't think that would be a very long time. I have seen pilot tubes (1/16" ID) get stopped from debris (rust, dirt) in gas lines, but NEVER the gas line itself. Most gas line is AT LEAST 1/2 inch in diameter, & that would take a considerable obstruction...

 

[scidoc1]

Fireplace working. All gas appliances working. Pilot goes out. Relight fails.
I try endlessly before calling PG & E. They say no gas at fireplace. Went
under fireplace and because of insulation, could not find line to it.

I agree occlusion of 1/2 inch line is weird. Previous owner's son replied tonight saying he is unaware of
safety cutoff switch for gas. She ran fireplace 15 minutes at night to get the chill out then shut it off.

I plan to pull the insulation to see underneath, but they say (previous owner) never a problem before.
I don't believe in long odds but will take a look.

I thought someone might know of a safety switch in the gas line to the fireplace. All gas in home is
functional otherwise. Very frustrating. If I had not just bought the home, I would be more
relaxed about it, but since I just moved in it is unlikely that this is a new problem but possible.

Any ideas welcome. Also to heat room considering a duct booster fan, anyone with experience
might recommend one and the best way to wire it to go in with existing fan. Trane 2 stage is
existing furnace.

Thanks

 

[CaptSpiff]

Fireplace working. All gas appliances working. Pilot goes out. Relight fails.
I try endlessly before calling PG & E. They say no gas at fireplace. Went
under fireplace and because of insulation, could not find line to it.

Hi SciDoc1,
Unless this FP was illegally installed there must be a local appliance shutoff. This manual gas shutoff valve is usually within 24 inches of the gas appliance regulator. The appliance regulator usually has the main gas burner tube and a pilot gas burner tube coming from it. The appliance regulator will also have a selector valve to manually send gas to the pilot burner, which has to be held for about a minute after you hand light the pilot burner. This is so the pilot burner can heat the Thermopile (about a minute) to get it hot enough to send a signal to permanently hold in the pilot valve. Thereafter the pilot will stay on. Then you can switch the appliance selector to normal and initiate a main burner light-off, by turning the FP on.
If this troubleshooting sounds a bit involved, then a great "investment" is to call a Fireplace tech and have them perform the inspection and light-off. This is a routine call for new homeowners, and should be pretty reasonable cost.
If there are no fireplace stores in the area, I'd call a local chimney sweep company and ask them to recommend a tech to do an "initial inspection and light-off".

I'm surprised PG&E did any troubleshooting. Usually they "make things safe" and advise you to call a plumber.

Good Luck.

 

[scidoc1]

Hi SciDoc1,
Unless this FP was illegally installed there must be a local appliance shutoff. This manual gas shutoff valve is usually within 24 inches of the gas appliance regulator. The appliance regulator usually has the main gas burner tube and a pilot gas burner tube coming from it. The appliance regulator will also have a selector valve to manually send gas to the pilot burner, which has to be held for about a minute after you hand light the pilot burner. This is so the pilot burner can heat the Thermopile (about a minute) to get it hot enough to send a signal to permanently hold in the pilot valve. Thereafter the pilot will stay on. Then you can switch the appliance selector to normal and initiate a main burner light-off, by turning the FP on.
If this troubleshooting sounds a bit involved, then a great "investment" is to call a Fireplace tech and have them perform the inspection and light-off. This is a routine call for new homeowners, and should be pretty reasonable cost.
If there are no fireplace stores in the area, I'd call a local chimney sweep company and ask them to recommend a tech to do an "initial inspection and light-off".

I'm surprised PG&E did any troubleshooting. Usually they "make things safe" and advise you to call a plumber.

Good Luck.

 

[scidoc1]

THE ANSWER:

The first PG & E guy was pleasant and looked under the house and pulled the valve demonstrating
to my amazement that there was in fact, no gas. The implications of finding the line to this fireplace
was immense enough (trust me on the this, there were no taps we could visualize), that I called
for a second PG&E visit figuring the second tech might be more aggressive and I had to convice
my self their was in fact no gas. I had used the fireplace the day before; it worked fine.

The 2nd tech showed up yesterday, around noon and was as frustrated as I was. There had to be
gas coming from somewhere if it was working. But why would any installer pick a circuitous
route? We went outside and walk completely around the house. The tech, really bright and
inquisitive spotted a disconnected outdoor water heater from a long gone hot tub. But just as he
was about to leave he spotted a tap partially hidden in exterior growth. We turned the tap and
voila! GAS.

Now who turned the tap off in the first place? I asked the previous owner about a gas heater I had noticed
and he pointed out to me that it might have some value on Ebay. It was disconnected.

My only explanation is that during his description he turned the valve assuming it was an unused appendage.

The persistance of the second tech saved me a bundle for private contractors to tear through insulation
searching for the line.

Thank you all for your ideas and support. Perseverance always wins out in the end.

 

[CaptSpiff]

THE ANSWER:
<snip>
But just as he was about to leave he spotted a tap partially hidden in exterior growth. We turned the tap and
voila! GAS.
The persistance of the second tech saved me a bundle for private contractors to tear through insulation
searching for the line.
Thank you all for your ideas and support. Perseverance always wins out in the end.

Props to the PG&E guy!