Outside air kit

Kwhelan

New Member
Mar 21, 2020
20
Newfoundland
i have a wood and oil forced air furnace. getting the smeel of wood smoke in the house so strong sometimes it sticks to slothes. Would an outside air kit help me and How do you know if you need an outside air kit? is it possiable to tie it into the air return ducting going to the furance? thanks for any advice
 

bholler

Chimney sweep
Staff member
Jan 14, 2014
21,568
central pa
i have a wood and oil forced air furnace. getting the smeel of wood smoke in the house so strong sometimes it sticks to slothes. Would an outside air kit help me and How do you know if you need an outside air kit? is it possiable to tie it into the air return ducting going to the furance? thanks for any advice
A fresh air intake may help depending upon what is causing the issue. And no it can't tie into the return duct that would pull a vacum when the fan came on causing massive problems.
 

Mech e

Feeling the Heat
Feb 26, 2019
272
NorCal
www.dtengineer.com
A fresh air intake may help depending upon what is causing the issue. And no it can't tie into the return duct that would pull a vacum when the fan came on causing massive problems.
Additionally, your furnace heating system is a closed loop, meaning no connection to the outside, thus no outside air for the stove which is what you are trying to get.
 

Kwhelan

New Member
Mar 21, 2020
20
Newfoundland
here is my problem any advice is helpful.


currently have a wood/oil combo forced air furnace in my basement. while the burning wood i am getting a smell of smoke in the house. chimney draft is good, not getting no back draft through the door while lighting or refilling. i have return air in main living area and one in the basement which is half complete. the area where the furnace is, is unfinished. The wood and oil share the same flue and chimney with non barometric damper. i am thinking it mabye something to do with negative pressure. any ideas or advice would be helpful. House is newly built with mabye 15 fires burnt in the furncae and it is not the smell of new coming from the furncae, it sticks to your clothes after so long. thanks
 

blades

Minister of Fire
Nov 23, 2008
3,500
WI, Leroy
perhaps a negative pressure in House ( new places are sealed up pretty tight) and therefore pulling in exhaust scent from outside through nooks and crannies. Could be from when you open firebox to reload as well even with a good draft. What is the flue constructed of?
 

Kwhelan

New Member
Mar 21, 2020
20
Newfoundland
perhaps a negative pressure in House ( new places are sealed up pretty tight) and therefore pulling in exhaust scent from outside through nooks and crannies. Could be from when you open firebox to reload as well even with a good draft. What is the flue constructed of?
The flue is double wall stove pipe going into double wall insulated prefab chimney all sized correct to the furance. i am thinking it has something to do with negative pressure
 

bholler

Chimney sweep
Staff member
Jan 14, 2014
21,568
central pa
The flue is double wall stove pipe going into double wall insulated prefab chimney all sized correct to the furance. i am thinking it has something to do with negative pressure
That is certainly possible.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
82,969
South Puget Sound, WA
Additionally, your furnace heating system is a closed loop, meaning no connection to the outside, thus no outside air for the stove which is what you are trying to get.
Fresh, makeup air intakes are frequently tied into hvac systems. It's not the most efficient, but not uncommon either. I think this is what is being asked about.

 
Last edited:

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
82,969
South Puget Sound, WA
If there is a nearby window that you can open as a test, try opening it 1". If that makes a difference, then an outside air supply will help. There are a few ways to do this. An outside vent can be ducted using flexible or rigid pipe to end close to the furnace intake. Another more expensive, but more efficient solution is to install an HRV system.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sloeffle

Kwhelan

New Member
Mar 21, 2020
20
Newfoundland
If there is a nearby window that you can open as a test, try opening it 1". If that makes a difference, then an outside air supply will help. There are a few ways to do this. An outside vent can be ducted using flexible or rigid pipe to end close to the furnace intake. Another more expensive, but more efficient solution is to install an HRV system.
i curenntly have a HRV system installed.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
82,969
South Puget Sound, WA
The fire could be buring for a few hours or more before the smell of smoke gets in the house
What furnace make/model is this? What is its age?
 

bholler

Chimney sweep
Staff member
Jan 14, 2014
21,568
central pa
i curenntly have a HRV system installed.
In that case I would have the HVAC guys who set the system up come out to check pressures around the house.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sloeffle

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
82,969
South Puget Sound, WA
Hrv is off
Why is it off? There are many factors that contribute to a stale house and negative pressure. Can the HRV be turned on independently of the HVAC system?

Is the upstairs finished and sealed off? When the smoke smell occurs, are any upstairs windows open or exhaust fans running (bath, kitchen, clothes dryer)? Ceiling vent to the attic open and unsealed?
 
Last edited:

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
82,969
South Puget Sound, WA
Why was this installed without a barometric damper? The manual calls for one. Likewise, the section on Combustion Air should be followed.

Screen Shot 2020-06-18 at 9.36.23 AM.png Screen Shot 2020-06-18 at 9.35.56 AM.png
 

Kwhelan

New Member
Mar 21, 2020
20
Newfoundland
Why is it off? There are many factors that contribute to a stale house and negative pressure. Can the HRV be turned on independently of the HVAC system?

Is the upstairs finished and sealed off? When the smoke smell occurs, are any upstairs windows open or exhaust fans running (bath, kitchen, clothes dryer)? Ceiling vent to the attic open and unsealed?
The reason it is off is only because I am trying different things. The hrv is its own indepentant unit. The entire interior of the house is complete. I get the smeel of smoke in the house when everything in the house off or on
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
82,969
South Puget Sound, WA
The reason it is off is only because I am trying different things. The hrv is its own indepentant unit. The entire interior of the house is complete. I get the smeel of smoke in the house when everything in the house off or on
To clarify then, you get the smoke smell when the HRV is left on and running? Are all openings (windows, doors, attic vent) in the above floor(s) closed when this occurs?
I will be getting one installed to see if it helps. I was told a barometric damper is really only for the oil side, which I am having no problem with.
Probably unrelated, I just started reading the manual and noted that. It may not be necessary for this circumstance and for testing purposes would add another layer of complication. I'd hold off until the smoke smell issue is resolved. If it is installed it should be done with proper testing equipment for draft and the draft should be tested with normal upstairs activity like opening a door, running a clothes dryer and/or kitchen exhaust fan.
 

Kwhelan

New Member
Mar 21, 2020
20
Newfoundland
To clarify then, you get the smoke smell when the HRV is left on and running? Are all openings (windows, doors, attic vent) in the above floor(s) closed when this occurs?

Probably unrelated, I just started reading the manual and noted that. It may not be necessary for this circumstance and for testing purposes would add another layer of complication. I'd hold off until the smoke smell issue is resolved. If it is installed it should be done with proper testing equipment for draft and the draft should be tested with normal upstairs activity like opening a door, running a clothes dryer and/or kitchen exhaust fan.
Yes i get the smell of soke whether the HRV is on or off. All windows,doors,attic completely sealed when i get the smell also.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
82,969
South Puget Sound, WA
Yes i get the smell of soke whether the HRV is on or off. All windows,doors,attic completely sealed when i get the smell also.
The next step is to open a nearby window about an inch to see if that remedies the situation.

Does the smoke smell start right away, or after a few hours? What is the outdoor temperature when burning?