PE Alderlea T5 (continued, first full season, page3.)

[Woody Stover]

It's not my stove, it's my SIL's, but I procured it, installed it, got the wood for it, and I'm the only one who's burned in it so far, so I will do the report.

My neighbor went with me to get the stove, about a 2-hr. drive. We got there, and I saw the stove had been left out in a short, light rain that I saw on the radar. A little rain got through the plastic wrap on the stove...not a big deal, but c'mon. Then my buddy saw a chip in the enamel on the bottom front of the ash lip and a cracked, pushed-in board on the front of the crate. Pretty obvious that someone was moving it with a forklift and bumped into something. The stove shop guy said "There might be touch-up paint in the stove, but I'll order you some just in case." At that point, I should have realized they weren't being up front with me, and pulled up the plastic all around and closely inspected it. If it was warehouse damage, the stove shop should have caught it when they received it from the shipper...I'm pretty sure they inspect everything they get. Yet it went unmentioned. I will bring that kind of stuff to the attention of someone I'm dealing with, but there are a lot of shady characters out there, as we all know. But wait, there's more. Here's the stuff I found when I got the stove out of the crate; Bent handle, possibly from the same front impact incident that chipped the ash lip, and what looks like a couple angle grinder marks on the bottom right side.That may have been caused when the office hottie came through the plant, and the guy turned to watch her walk away, forgetting that he was holding a live grinder. What would you do, where I stand now, given that I didn't do due diligence before taking the stove? I didn't want to return it, but I could have gotten a price reduction, maybe, if I'd been thinking instead of drooling. I think I was dealing with the head installer, but I have another guy's name that left me a message when they got the stove in...not sure if he's sales, owner, or what.
The enamel chip on the front bottom of the ash lip is barely visible in the handle pic, but way more noticeable than the side nicks, which are barely through the enamel...pic didn't turn out for some reason...I'll add it later. It's about 1.5" long.


Now, let's move in a more positive direction and focus on the wood-burning fun!
First fire was just four medium-small splits, so I could see how the stove would react before committing to a fuller firebox.

Other owners are right on in their assessments; This stove is an easy breather. I'm able to start loads on a cold 15' chimney when it's in the upper 50s out (second day fire,) and still get zero smoke roll-out when I open the door. The smoke plate at the top of the door opening really does the job.
I just took 'er up to about 400 stove top temp the first day to begin the paint-cure process. Plenty of control over the air at 42 degrees outside. 0 degrees will be a different story of course, and I may install a second flue damper if we need more control on cold days.
On to the next day and the second fire, with Red Elm and Red Mulberry dead-standers that I harvested within the last couple weeks behind her house.

It was almost 60 out so with the weaker draft, I was able to cut the air and pretty much kill active flame on the load, even though a lot of wood was gassing.
You'll notice here that I got good secondary action on the left side of the baffle, but very little on the right side. I don't think there's a ceramic blanket on top of the baffle, so there should be nothing out of place up there that would impede secondary air flow through that side of the baffle. Not sure what is going on there; Maybe the baffle gasket has a gap on the right side, so it's pulling oxygen-depleted air from the firebox up into the right side of the baffle, therefore no secondary action on the right side of the baffle?
In these pics, you can see a slight gap between the rear bottom edge of the baffle and the rear rail, and I could see flame shooting out of there at one point. Looked like flame behind that gap between the baffle and rail at the back of the baffle, as well. I'll take the baffle out tomorrow and have a look. I may seal that gap with a flat gasket, or some interam gasket that would seal the gap. And I'll look at the baffle gasket.
There's also some insulation that you can see at the front sides of the baffle, that extends down the sides and (I think) the back of the baffle. I tried to make sure that was seated well, but couldn't really get at it too well through the flue exit, before I attached the connector pipe. Maybe I can check it from inside the firebox?

I controlled the stove top temp up and down between 500 and 600 on this burn and cured the paint in pretty well. I have the meter on top of the steel box, just forward of the flue exit, but can still see it with a small flashlight through the openings in the swing-away cast iron top. Nice.
So far, so good, now let's see if I can get some of these anomalies ironed out.
Right now, I gotta go into the woods and find more dry fuel to feed this baby...behind on dry wood for three SIL stoves. Some would say I should cut the grass but I don't have time for that kind of foolishness.

 

[Hogwildz]

In regards to the cosmetic issues, that is something you'll have to decide it you can live with or not. Touch up paint in those areas will probably do fine. The handle looks like it was hit or bumped and the wood handle is cocked on the steel shaft. I can see the wood is cracked. I would push for a new handle assy. Not that hard to replace.

Now on to the performance questions:

"You'll notice here that I got good secondary action on the left side of the baffle, but very little on the right side. I don't think there's a ceramic blanket on top of the baffle, so there should be nothing out of place up there that would impede secondary air flow through that side of the baffle."
If is is same as the Summit, which I think all PEs are same baffle design, just different sizes...there is a baffle board on top of the baffle, it won't impede draft unless it is somehow pushed up, hard to imagine that. Easy to pop the pipe off the outlet and look inside the outlet.
The secondaries burn what nasties are off gassing off the splits. If they are not showing on one side or the other, that merely means those splits are not offgassing yet, they will come further on during the burn when those splits are flaming & offgasing.

The side baffle gaskets look as they should, and yes they run all the way from front to back along the baffle sides.

The gap you see in the back of the baffle is actually a "bend rolled under edge flap", and actually has secondary jets inside there. so you will see a fan of secondary flames coming from there while the splits are offgasing, this again is normal. No need to pull the baffle.

The only operational fix I see needed, is replacing the handle assy.

Nice stove.

 

[begreen]

It's a bummer that the stove arrived with those minor damages. The dealer needs to come through with replacement parts or financial compensation. The ashlip part number for brown majolica is ALT5.P4713MBA. The door handle is ALDR.50380GL.

I agree with Hogwildz. The interior looks ok. Load the stove up and assume it is ok inside. Learn from the burn.

 

[mar13]

I hope to give a similar report around Memorial Day on a T5- plenty of cold maritime foggy days around here to justify summer burns. I'm still apprehensive about enamel. I'd like the first chips to be due to my (or kids') foolishness rather than by strangers.

 

[begreen]

We were lucky to get our T6 from Tom in Bellingham. It was 90 miles away, but I knew we were in good hands and if there was an issue he would take care of it. As it turned out there were none, but having a responsible and responsive dealer makes a big difference for my peace of mind.

 

[Woody Stover]

In regards to the cosmetic issues, that is something you'll have to decide it you can live with or not. Touch up paint in those areas will probably do fine. The handle looks like it was hit or bumped and the wood handle is cocked on the steel shaft. I can see the wood is cracked. I would push for a new handle assy.

The handle seems to work fine. Hard to believe that thick round stock would bend, unless he really rammed the stove hard. I'm guessing maybe the handle is threaded on, and all I need it a new handle. I haven't looked at it closely yet, though. I'll do that and report back.
The guy told me "I think there's paint in the bag with the other stuff, but just in case I will have more mailed to you. Nothing yet, and it's been a couple weeks...

Easy to pop the pipe off the outlet and look inside the outlet.
The secondaries burn what nasties are off gassing off the splits. If they are not showing on one side or the other, that merely means those splits are not offgassing yet, they will come further on during the burn when those splits are flaming & offgasing.

I think the load was burning more on the right side, and the secondaries were on the left, and the pic would seem to confirm that. That's what had me "baffled." I can't swear to it though. I'll do as begreen suggested...burn and learn.
Unfortunately it's not too easy for me to pull the pipe and look into the outlet. The stove is almost the identical height to the Dutchwest she had in there, so I re-used the pipe, but I had to take off the back legs and drop the stove to get the flue collar under the bottom of the pipe. Not too big a deal, though. Before I put the pipe on, I was trying to reach down through the flue collar to the baffle side-insulation to make sure it was in place, and also used a mirror and flashlight to look. Nothing seemed to be sticking up, but thought I'd ask in case there was something I was missing.[/QUOTE]

The gap you see in the back of the baffle is actually a "bend rolled under edge flap", and actually has secondary jets inside there. so you will see a fan of secondary flames coming from there while the splits are offgasing, this again is normal. No need to pull the baffle.

Ah, OK. I really didn't want to pull the baffle, because I think I could conceivably need another baffle gasket, if they are as fragile as I've been hearing. Or I would have to violate patent law and fab up a pirate version of the "Hogwildz Donut."

 

[Woody Stover]

Learn from the burn.

I hope to give a similar report around Memorial Day on a T5- plenty of cold maritime foggy days around here to justify summer burns.

This is one of the few times that I'd welcome some cold weather. There's a couple of cool nights coming, 45 and 40, but after that, who knows? Of course, if this thing breathes OK when it's 60 out, I may not be done as soon as I thought. She will pretty quickly tire of me hanging around and playing with her stove, though. I'll be looking forward to burning vicariously by reading your reports.

I'm still apprehensive about enamel. I'd like the first chips to be due to my (or kids') foolishness rather than by strangers.

Yeah, if it was my job to move around stoves, I'd be thinking "This is a $3000 unit...maybe I should be careful."

 

[webby3650]

Where did the stove come from? Have you told them about the damage?

 

[Woody Stover]

My buddy saw the chip on the ash lip, so the guy knew about that for sure. I have a feeling he knew about the door handle, too, if they inspected the stove when the shipper brought it. I think I was dealing with the installer/loader guys, not the boss, but I will contact him.

 

[webby3650]

Sometimes a bunch of stoves are delivered at the same time, it’s possible to miss damage on occasion. I’d be surprised if they didn’t look it over before you picked it up though. I’ve probably got some touch up around here somewhere if you have trouble getting some.

 

[SpaceBus]

We were lucky to get our T6 from Tom in Bellingham. It was 90 miles away, but I knew we were in good hands and if there was an issue he would take care of it. As it turned out there were none, but having a responsible and responsive dealer makes a big difference for my peace of mind.

Dealers mean everything for a product that isn't made locally. Never has this meant anything to me until being a homeowner.

 

[SpaceBus]

That's a handsome stove. Enamel is a fickle mistress.

I assume it is humanly possible to handle an enameled cast iron object without chipping it, but in my relatively short lifetime it has not been possible. For me enameled items are beautiful and much easier to clean, but terrifying as well. I am currently staring at a chip in a beautiful hand made enameled cast iron diffuser. I don't think I even put it on the stove before I chipped it.

 

[begreen]

It is very possible to handle, install and run an enamel stove without chipping, just the same as it is possible with a kitchen cook stove. But it does take care in handling and respect. Our 1984 or so Jotul 602 is still relatively chip free and the chips on it are small, from hitting an edge with a stove tool.

 

[Woody Stover]

We were lucky to get our T6 from Tom in Bellingham. It was 90 miles away, but I knew we were in good hands and if there was an issue he would take care of it.

I communicated with Tom, and was impressed that he took the time to answer some questions I had. I would have ordered from him if he'd had this model in stock, since he has an April half-price shipping sale.

I assume it is humanly possible to handle an enameled cast iron object without chipping it

Yeah, I've been upbraiding the 'hacks' but when I put the door back on, I heard a grinding sound that was most unpleasant, and there's a chip in the area near the bottom hinge. In my defense, I has someone holding a flashlight, and couldn't see as well as I would have liked...and that door is one heavy mutha, and hard to control! I'm banking on the touch-up paint to "illusion it," as my nephew says about carpentry work.

 

[Woody Stover]

What do you guys use to lube the door hinges, trivet hinges and door latch roller? It appears that they greased them at the plant, but when the time comes, could I use B'laster Dry Lube PTFE or graphite spray, and not have to remove the door and trivets to apply grease?
The door latch mechanism seems to make a solid seal, with the gasket pressing against the flat front wall of the box, like the Buck 91 does. I didn't do the dollar-bill test, I will next time I'm over there. The website mentions a "knife-edge" door gasket seal...I guess that is on the steel-box-only models.

 

[Woody Stover]

I've seen the door latch mechanism mentioned as a trouble spot on these stove. Is that from lack of lube maintenance causing wear, or what?

 

[Woody Stover]

I’ve probably got some touch up around here somewhere if you have trouble getting some.

Thanks, web-ster, I'll keep that in mind. The most noticeable chip, on the ash lip, is visible in the first pic in my first post.

 

[begreen]

What do you guys use to lube the door hinges, trivet hinges and door latch roller? It appears that they greased them at the plant, but when the time comes, could I use B'laster Dry Lube PTFE or graphite spray, and not have to remove the door and trivets to apply grease?

NADA. I haven't done anything in 10 years of service.

I've seen the door latch mechanism mentioned as a trouble spot on these stove. Is that from lack of lube maintenance causing wear, or what?

Trouble spot? Can you post a link? I have commented that I thought the latching mechanism used on Enviro's and Jotuls is nicer, but the PE latch is sufficient. Our latch is still working fine. It's simple, but that is part of the design philosophy of the stove. Not sure if this latch design has changed on the new Alderleas.

 

[Woody Stover]

Trouble spot? Can you post a link? I have commented that I thought the latching mechanism used on Enviro's and Jotuls is nicer, but the PE latch is sufficient. Our latch is still working fine. It's simple, but that is part of the design philosophy of the stove.

OK, maybe that's what I'm recalling. What do you like better about the Enviro and Jotul; I really like the cam-down action of the PE, although bending the plate-steel latch catch on the stove body to adjust door tension leaves something to be desired. Should be fine, though...
I like "simple," and that was a big reason I went with this stove for her. Now if I can just find an easy, efficient way to use the ash dump...that's the other part of "simple" operation. There's no way she's gonna want to shovel ash out, trying to contain dust and all that jazz. She's gotten her fill of that from when she has to run her sister's Fireview. However, with the way the stove drafts, even in warm weather, I'm sure that I could shovel cleanly and with minimal dust. Not that I would ever want to do that...

 

[Woody Stover]

If I want to make a "Hogwildz Donut," what size rope gasket do you use? I would think the same size that you guys use would work on the T5 but I'm not sure, construction of the baffle and air feed may differ between it and the T6/Summit...

 

[Hogwildz]

I think it was 3/8" if I remember correctly. The factory ones suck, so if you stick with them, order a lot of 3 or 5 from Tom. You may have the new style baffle gasket which has wings on each side of the donut to each end of the baffle towards the stove sides. Not sure what good they are, as the gasket pretty much disintegrates in a season, unless you never touch or move the baffle at all. I have been experimenting with some thin high temp ceramic blanket I got online, but it only last a couple years at best. I'll find something last lasts 5+ years, then be happy. When I get it narrowed down, I'll let everyone know. Maybe a little ebay niche there, who knows.

I think the back of the baffles are all the same with the exception of width. The air channel & baffle hole over it should all be the same. I'm pretty sure one gasket fits all, except for the ones with the wings, just shorter wings on each side.

 

[Hogwildz]

Here's the Hog gasket vs the new OEM style. I have been making new style with the ceramic blanket, just need to find a sturdier blanket material. The home made lasts 5+ years that I had it in use.

 

[webby3650]

I hope you didn’t get that stove from that guy over in ellettsville, if you did you’re probably SOL on any refund/discount or help of any kind.

 

[Woody Stover]

I hope you didn’t get that stove from that guy over in ellettsville, if you did you’re probably SOL on any refund/discount or help of any kind.

I saw that place when I was looking for dealers, but this guy is in Louisville. It was closer to the warehouse.

 

[Woody Stover]

new style baffle gasket which has wings on each side of the donut to each end of the baffle towards the stove sides. Not sure what good they are, as the gasket pretty much disintegrates in a season, unless you never touch or move the baffle at all. I have been experimenting with some thin high temp ceramic blanket I got online, but it only last a couple years at best. I'll find something last lasts 5+ years, then be happy. When I get it narrowed down, I'll let everyone know. Maybe a little ebay niche there, who knows.
I think the back of the baffles are all the same with the exception of width. The air channel & baffle hole over it should all be the same. I'm pretty sure one gasket fits all, except for the ones with the wings, just shorter wings on each side.

Well, I couldn't resist, I had to drop the secondary baffle to have a look. You can't really see the top of the insulation in this pic but the insulation strips you mentioned, sealing the baffle to the sides of the box and forcing the smoke forward around the front of the baffle, the left side was not seated to the bottom of the baffle. You can see the insulation on the right side, all the way to the bottom of the baffle/brick rail. On the left side at the back, the insulation was pulled up out of the gap at the back. That was allowing a "path of least resistance" for the smoke, through the insulation gap at the bottom of the rail, directly to the flue exit. That apparently was causing more air to pull through the left side of the baffle, resulting in what I saw previously; Strong secondary burn on the left and nothing from the right side of the baffle. With that problem fixed, I'm seeing a strong secondary burn all the way across the front of the baffle.

Yesterday afternoon, I crammed in a full load. I soon regretted putting a couple smaller splits in, as the stove top before long went to 600+.
The lowest burn with the air cut all the way is still too vigorous, seems to me. I think I should be able to run a lot "lazier" flame in the box and still burn clean. Less wood burned per hr. is always better. Trying to figure how to post a video I took with phone but you can kinda tell from the pic how hot this thing is burning.
I'm going over there to load up again,; Another 40* night, might be curtains for the burning season after that. I'm thinking I have a couple options for easy air restriction tonight; Drop a bolt into the boost air feed, or cut a small piece of flashing to cover the part of the remaining open hole at the primary air minimum setting. Later I might add another flue damper.
How low STT are you guys able to burn, and keep 'er clean?
Last night's crammage.
The pipe meter is about 13" above the flue collar, and the top of the silver range is 475...blowing too much heat out the flue, the way the stove runs now on minimum air.

I loaded three more splits on top of a huge coal bed at 10 PM last night, and had to convince myself that it wasn't going any higher than the 650 it was at, before I left. She woke up later, checked, and said it was below 650, so all good.