Pellet Hopper Fire

[sass_eco65]

Hi all,

I am new to the site.

I have a Drolet Eco-65 with hot air plenum kit installed in my basement. This means that my stove is connected to its own duct runs (separate from my propane furnace runs) to the main floor, where we wanted our heat. We live in a 1100 sq. ft bungalow.

The stove is only 2 months old. We had it installed by a W.E.T.T certified tech. We then had another W.E.T.T. certification by our city as this is required with a permit. It has a 4" OAK as well as 4" pipe. All was done as per manufacturer specs. We clean it once a week as the manual states to do. Stove was cleaned 2 days prior to our "incident"

About two weeks ago we had a power outage. 15 minutes had gone by and our entire home had filled with smoke. It was so smoky you could barely see where you were walking. Next thing you know, the hopper caught fire. We got a fire extinguisher and kept it contained until the fire dept. arrived.

I spoke to the manufacturer and they want me to bring the stove back to RONA (where I purchased it), and they will refund me and I can buy another one. My issue now is what if this happens again? I have been told that it is due to the way the stove is built. I am looking into getting a battery back-up. I am just wondering how this can be sold in stores if it is a fire hazard the minute there is a power outage. There is no warning in the manual and they do not mention anything about a battery back-up. Very stressful to find out the hard way...

Please let me know if you can give me any advice. TIA

 

[reallyte]

I would never buy another anything that puts my family in danger like that...

 

[checkthisout]

Freaky! What if you hadn't been home or it was night time?? I would get my money back and get a different stove unless the "new" stove they are offering has features to keep that from happening.

 

[sass_eco65]

I would never buy another anything that puts my family in danger like that...

Yes... unfortunately we spent 2500$ on the stove and an additional $2000 in parts and labor. It is as if the more research I do, the more common hopper fires seem to be under the "right" circumstances. These machines have been tried and tested. Just looking for someone who might have experienced this or can give advice.

 

[Highbeam]

Drolet.

 

[sass_eco65]

Call me crazy.. this was the only stove that I could directly vent to the main floor that was certified to do so. I have heard Drolet is not the greatest.. but that the Eco-65 has decent reviews? I wonder if anyone else has had this happen before who owns one...

 

[sass_eco65]

So after looking into more about other stoves... It looks like I will be purchasing a Napoleon or Kozi as they are top feed. Harman was an option but we are taking a huge loss on the install and our budget is tight right now.

I will never buy another Drolet product again. Lesson learnt!

 

[chken]

I spoke to the manufacturer and they want me to bring the stove back to RONA (where I purchased it), and they will refund me and I can buy another one. My issue now is what if this happens again? I have been told that it is due to the way the stove is built. I am looking into getting a battery back-up. I am just wondering how this can be sold in stores if it is a fire hazard the minute there is a power outage. There is no warning in the manual and they do not mention anything about a battery back-up. Very stressful to find out the hard way...

Please let me know if you can give me any advice. TIA

I am in no way litigious, never sued a soul, but does that first sentence sound odd? If the installations were certified, and the mfr admits the problem is in the way the stove is built, and they want you to buy another one? Surely they mean a model built differently. I would get some legal advice.

 

[kappel15]

Somebody should be paying for the smoke damage to your house.

 

[rona]

Hi all,

I am new to the site.

I have a Drolet Eco-65 with hot air plenum kit installed in my basement. This means that my stove is connected to its own duct runs (separate from my propane furnace runs) to the main floor, where we wanted our heat. We live in a 1100 sq. ft bungalow.

The stove is only 2 months old. We had it installed by a W.E.T.T certified tech. We then had another W.E.T.T. certification by our city as this is required with a permit. It has a 4" OAK as well as 4" pipe. All was done as per manufacturer specs. We clean it once a week as the manual states to do. Stove was cleaned 2 days prior to our "incident"

About two weeks ago we had a power outage. 15 minutes had gone by and our entire home had filled with smoke. It was so smoky you could barely see where you were walking. Next thing you know, the hopper caught fire. We got a fire extinguisher and kept it contained until the fire dept. arrived.

I spoke to the manufacturer and they want me to bring the stove back to RONA (where I purchased it), and they will refund me and I can buy another one. My issue now is what if this happens again? I have been told that it is due to the way the stove is built. I am looking into getting a battery back-up. I am just wondering how this can be sold in stores if it is a fire hazard the minute there is a power outage. There is no warning in the manual and they do not mention anything about a battery back-up. Very stressful to find out the hard way...

Please let me know if you can give me any advice. TIA

 

[rona]

A lot of stoves have a built in safety feature that will prevent the hopper from catching on fire but the smoke from the pot will still seep up through the hopper.
The Harmans have a slide that opens and closes as the auger turns plus it has a rubber gasket around the hopper lid that hopefully will prevent smoke from getting into the room. The Bixbys have a feeder wheel that drops the pellets down a spout into the pot there is a gasket that is supposed to prevent the smoke from getting into the hopper. Having said that the smoke from the smoldering pellets will seep through the ash bucket door. The easiest cure is pour water over the burn pot and kill the fire. Then remove the ash bucket and empty it of any burning embers by tossing into a metal can or in a snowbank.
The idea of a vertical pipe 3 or 4 foot going up inside the house then through the wall is a good idea as it should produce a natural vacuum and suck the smoke out of the stove. I have seen the vertical pipe outside but I think you can get a build up of ash where the pipe goes through the wall and vertical because of the temp change.

 

[sass_eco65]

Thanks for the info.

Yes they should be paying. Unfortunately their warranty states they do not cover power outages. I don't know if I'm ready for a huge court battle.

I want the damn thing out... And a different stove in. There are no safety features on this stove to prevent burnback. They are claiming its from extreme negative pressure in our basement. I think they are loopy.

 

[trmbone2002]

Did the hopper fire start from flames entering the drop chute? I am not understanding how the pellets in the hopper can catch fire unless the heat from the fire box gets so high. I'm thinking that the stove would have to get red hot for the pellets to ignite. ?????

 

[sass_eco65]

Did the hopper fire start from flames entering the drop chute? I am not understanding how the pellets in the hopper can catch fire unless the heat from the fire box gets so high. I'm thinking that the stove would have to get red hot for the pellets to ignite. ?????

Basically the auger was feeding pellets when the power went out. It created a bridge of pellets from the burn pot to the hopper. So what was in the auger caught... And followed up into the hopper.

 

[trmbone2002]

Basically the auger was feeding pellets when the power went out. It created a bridge of pellets from the burn pot to the hopper. So what was in the auger caught... And followed up into the hopper.

OK------, does the auger feed horizontally from the bottom of the hopper? Or, does it feed through an inclined chute and drop the pellets into the fire pot?

 

[Don2222]

The stove's venting installation must have 3 feet of vertical rise, if not then an OAK must be installed or you can get a smoked filled room when the power goes out. This can happen to most any stove if the install was the bare minimun! So what does the venting configuration look like?

 

[sass_eco65]

OK------, does the auger feed horizontally from the bottom of the hopper? Or, does it feed through an inclined chute and drop the pellets into the fire pot?

Horizontal.

 

[sass_eco65]

The stove's venting installation must have 3 feet of vertical rise, if not then an OAK must be installed or you can get a smoked filled room when the power goes out. This can happen to most any stove if the install was the bare minimun! So what was it?

We have about 5' vertical inside, and 2' outside. We also have a 4" OAK. No reason why there should be a problem besides a design flaw IMO.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

What shape was the hopper lid gasket in and are there any latches to keep the lid tight against the gasket..

There would have to be an air path into the stove (OAK) and up through the hopper (that negative pressure thing again) along with perhaps a pellet bridge between the augers.

Just so everyone understands all pellet stoves can have hopper fires.

The stove usually contains the fire unless someone opens the hopper lid.

There is usually a lot of smoke however your up 5' bend then out followed by a bend and up 2 feet is effectively less of a vertical than you might need.

 

[rona]

It sounds like some stoves are easier then others for getting a hopper fire. I also question having outside air as a preventative for a smoke filled room when power goes off. That happened to us last winter and we had Outside Air into the stove. I poured water into the pot and doused the embers otherwise it would have been real smoky in the house.
I was reading in one of these pellet stove websites that one company recommended not letting the hopper get below 1/4 full to avoid smoke in the house but don't remember the brand name or model.

 

[RKS130]

I am in no way litigious, never sued a soul, but does that first sentence sound odd? If the installations were certified, and the mfr admits the problem is in the way the stove is built, and they want you to buy another one? Surely they mean a model built differently. I would get some legal advice.

I would at least think about Small Claims Court to recoup the installation cost after they refund the purchase price.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

The outside air is to negate any negative pressure effects upon the combustion process and to prevent flow reversal due to disruption of the exhaust system from dumping smoke into the room.

The OAK termination becomes the lowest point in the vent system you need to be above that for the exhaust vent termination by a certain height in order to have any real chance of withdrawing (natural draft) smoke from the stove via the vent during a power outage.

Even if you have a natural draft in the venting as the systems gets ash laden the draft will get compromised.

It cannot by itself prevent smoke from exiting via a hopper system that doesn't have a functioning gasket and the stove being in a negative pressure area. A functioning gasket is however not the same as just having a gasket.

Let your homeowner's insurance company have a go at it.

A lot of older stoves had a warning about keeping the lid to the hopper down when burning and not letting the fuel level go below a certain point.

Newer stoves seem to be going to the gasket and latch system and recommending an OAK some like ESW require an OAK.

The only sure test of a vent system under power loss conditions is to simulate a power loss at a time immediately prior to a deep clean when the stove is full of ash.

 

[velvetfoot]

My boiler has a gallon water tank that dumps water on a hopper fire. Hopefully.
The water line going into the auger is the blue line and the tank is above.

 

[F4jock]

The small claims court idea above is a good one. You can research it a bit and if applicable you can be your own attorney. Settlements are quick. In any case if you want a stove that'll let you sleep at night bite the bullet and get a Harman.

 

[hyfire]

I have a eco-65 and had a power outage, I had no visible smoke in the room, but did have some smoke smell and still maintained a negative draft of .05" w.c. However I do have a natural draft since I have 10 of vertical rise( 4 inside and 6 outside). and my OAK is 18" from the ground. I do regret to hear about the hopper fire and it sounds very scary, but having the room fill with smoke sounds like a draft problem that led to your loss of neg pressure at the auger chute at the power outage. The manual states you need a min of 3' vertical rise after a horizontal termination. You said you cleaned the stove but did you clean the horizontal flue section of your venting? This is where its critical as the ash builds up very quickly.