Portway stove not getting hot

[Katmat]

Hi, I had a portway mutifuel stove installed last week (external flue due to not having a chimney) and I'm really struggling to get it to heat the room. I only really feel the heat if I sit literally on top of it.

I started with a small kindling fire to heat the flue as instructed by the installer then slowly add logs whilst reducing the bottom vent to 3/4. The actual stove gets fairly hot but it doesn't heat the room. I've had a log burner in the past with a chimney and the whole house was toasty warm so I'm a little disappointed that I've paid quite a lot of money and I'm still having to use blankets.

I just don't know what I'm doing wrong, I'm guessing that I'm using the air vents wrong so any help will be appreciated.

Thank you

 

[kborndale]

Is your wood dry? What do you mean by it doesn't have a chimney? Chimneys are required.

 

[stoveliker]

probably no masonry chimney but a new class A.

In addition to your wood as mentioned above, how tall is your chimney? (Too tall -> too much draft --> most heat going up the flue.)

 

[EatenByLimestone]

How hot is the stove getting? Where are you measuring the temperature?

 

[Katmat]

Is your wood dry? What do you mean by it doesn't have a chimney? Chimneys are required.

Apologies, I'm not too familiar with the terms. I meant it hasn't got a chimney in the traditional sense, I had to have a twin wall built.

I did wonder about the wood so bought it from 5 different suppliers that claim to be 20% moisture but had the same results each time. I also tried coal last night and still no toasty heat.

probably no masonry chimney but a new class A.

In addition to your wood as mentioned above, how tall is your chimney? (Too tall -> too much draft --> most heat going up the flue.)

So the pipe goes up to house height from the single storey.

How hot is the stove getting? Where are you measuring the temperature?

The portway stove came with a thermometer but the installer said the magnet couldn't stick to the pipe inside so he put it on the counter and told me to bin it. The stove gets semi hot to touch but the pipe just feels warm. This is after burning it all day.

 

[begreen]

Which Portway model is this? How large of an area is it trying to heat? Place the thermometer on the stovetop and see what it reads.
Pictures are always welcome.

 

[stoveliker]

Wood claimed to be 20% rarely is.
If you're buying wood, I suggest to spend $30 on a moisture meter (box store or Amazon has them).
To measure properly one has to have a split preferably at room temperature (but doing this when it's getting delivered doesn't allow for that, so be it), split it in half with an axe, stick the pins as deep as possible in the freshly exposed (because repslit) surface, parallel to the grain, and read.

If you have a one story home, it's unlikely that the chimney is too tall.

 

[Katmat]

Hey, thanks for your reply.

It's a P1, can't see any other names on the stove or booklet.

The room is roughly 11 x7, it's open plan in a bit of a funny shape so difficult to give exact measurements.

I've popped the thermometer on the stove, it's been on for about an hour and is showing in the 0-100 category.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

Since you’re burning a multi fuel stove, I’m guessing that room size is in meters? So that’s a big room and a small stove that doesn’t sound like it’s getting hot. I’m once again guessing that the 100 is degrees Celsius. You could safely be running stove top temps of 350+.

How much wood are you loading into it?

 

[stoveliker]

If this pic is "normal" burning practice (and not "end of a burn" situation), I think you need to load much more wood.

 

[Katmat]

Since you’re burning a multi fuel stove, I’m guessing that room size is in meters? So that’s a big room and a small stove that doesn’t sound like it’s getting hot. I’m once again guessing that the 100 is degrees Celsius. You could safely be running stove top temps of 350+.

How much wood are you loading into it?

I was going for ft not metres 🤣

But yes degree Celsius.

Ive been putting one or two in at a time, do I need to up it?

If this pic is "normal" burning practice (and not "end of a burn" situation), I think you need to load much more wood.

Right! That's very helpful thank you.

 

[kborndale]

Put more wood in, and yes your wood is probably too wet. Buying wood that is dry enough to burn is rare even though the dealers all say their wood is seasoned. That wood should be good to go next winter, it just needs a summer to dry out.

 

[stoveliker]

There is a difference though that I believe in the UK sellers are legally forbidden to sell wood above 20%. And it's much more strictly enforced than a similar rule here would be.

7x11 ft is an incredibly small room (even for European standards...), and any stove should make a decent difference.
So try to fill it up more. (And still get a moisture meter.)

 

[Katmat]

Great replies - thank you so much.

Apologies, it is metres 😅

So ive put 4 logs in with vents still open and it's roaring away but still not getting past 150 degrees celsius. If I try and close the bottom vent, it starts to go out.

 

[stoveliker]

That would be consistent with wood that's too wet; that generally requires much more air to keep going.

 

[Katmat]

Ahhhhhh okay, I understand now.

There's so.much to learn, so glad you guys have the good advice for me. Thank you 😊

 

[Katmat]

It's still not getting past 150, is that because of the air vents being open or the wet wood?

 

[stoveliker]

I'm not sure.
It's 4.9 kW, that (for US folks) equates to 16700 BTU/hr.
That should easily heat a 7x11 meter room.
My stove can go as low as 12000 BTU/hr and will easily keep my 825 sq ft = also 77 sq meter basement at 20 C running at that low output when it's 5-7 C outside, and that is with a slab without insulation to the ground (walls are insulated).

So that suggests to me the wood is not ideal.
Zooming in on your picture to check the dryness, i.e. to see if is there "checking" (cracks) on the ends, I don't see any - but I do see a lot of wood that's what we call "punky", where fibers are breaking. That quarter round to the right back in the picture has some good heartwood (not cracked tho, suggesting wet), and 3" of punky wood around that. Some of the splits under the stove look poor too.

So the wood seems to not be ideal viewed from this far.

Are you filling as far as in the left column on the third page of the manual (that I downloaded)?

The stove is supposed to run with the primary air (bottom) set almost closed after you get most wood flaming (i.e., load on a coal bed up to the fill line, let it get ablaze, and then in increments decrease the air to low), and the secondary air (top) 2/3 open - then you should see secondary flames (out of the holes of the tubes in the top), as on this pic:

If burning like that does not work, and the fire dies down (even with the air open) when the door is closed, then the wood could be poor indeed. Too much draft would not make the fire die down when the door closes.

Another option is that the draft is not too high, but not enough (too low), so that not enough air (oxygen) is sucked into the stove to burn the wood.. But that would also result in smoke roll out when you open the door. You did not mention that. (If so, that could also mean your home is too airtight, or you have a blockage in the chimney or cap preventing draft in the chimney from establishing.)

So: Do you ever have smoke coming into the room when you open the door?

If not, and the fire dies down when you close the door, then my bet is stil the wood being poor.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

What temperature is it outside? A short chimney will have trouble in warm weather. Wet wood doesn’t help this.

 

[Eman85]

I did wonder about the wood so bought it from 5 different suppliers that claim to be 20% moisture but had the same results each time. I also tried coal last night and still no toasty heat.

You burned coal and it didn't get hot?

 

[Katmat]

That would be consistent with wood that's too wet; that generally requires much more air to keep going.

I'm not sure.
It's 4.9 kW, that (for US folks) equates to 16700 BTU/hr.
That should easily heat a 7x11 meter room.
My stove can go as low as 12000 BTU/hr and will easily keep my 825 sq ft = also 77 sq meter basement at 20 C running at that low output when it's 5-7 C outside, and that is with a slab without insulation to the ground (walls are insulated).

So that suggests to me the wood is not ideal.
Zooming in on your picture to check the dryness, i.e. to see if is there "checking" (cracks) on the ends, I don't see any - but I do see a lot of wood that's what we call "punky", where fibers are breaking. That quarter round to the right back in the picture has some good heartwood (not cracked tho, suggesting wet), and 3" of punky wood around that. Some of the splits under the stove look poor too.

So the wood seems to not be ideal viewed from this far.

Are you filling as far as in the left column on the third page of the manual (that I downloaded)?

View attachment 326266

The stove is supposed to run with the primary air (bottom) set almost closed after you get most wood flaming (i.e., load on a coal bed up to the fill line, let it get ablaze, and then in increments decrease the air to low), and the secondary air (top) 2/3 open - then you should see secondary flames (out of the holes of the tubes in the top), as on this pic:
View attachment 326265


If burning like that does not work, and the fire dies down (even with the air open) when the door is closed, then the wood could be poor indeed. Too much draft would not make the fire die down when the door closes.

Another option is that the draft is not too high, but not enough (too low), so that not enough air (oxygen) is sucked into the stove to burn the wood.. But that would also result in smoke roll out when you open the door. You did not mention that. (If so, that could also mean your home is too airtight, or you have a blockage in the chimney or cap preventing draft in the chimney from establishing.)

So: Do you ever have smoke coming into the room when you open the door?

If not, and the fire dies down when you close the door, then my bet is stil the wood being poor.

Oh thank you for this super reply, I'll search for another supplier today and lookout for those punky logs.

So as its a twin wall, I light a small kindling fire first to push the cold air out as advised by the guy who fitted it. The only time I've had smoke in the room is when I've jumped the gun and put a log on too early. So, no I don't get smoke in the room unless I make a mistake.

When the logs are on, I attempt to shut down the bottom vent and it almost immediately starts dying so I open it up again and it seems okay but I still have the issue of not getting hot.

What temperature is it outside? A short chimney will have trouble in warm weather. Wet wood doesn’t help this.

So the temp outside is around 5 -10 degrees at the moment.

You burned coal and it didn't get hot?

Yes I tried coal to rule out the log issue but it still didn't get hot. I put quite a bit on too. Plus the Carbon monoxide alarm woke me up at 4am, I assume as it was dying out it released poisonous gas!


I don't seem to be having much luck with this and I'm so grateful for all your replies. The vision I had of me being toasty warm has gone out of the window and it's so disheartening after saving up so much money to have it fitted and I was literally counting down the days until it was installed. However all your suggestions and help have given me a bit of hope so I can't thank you all enough 😊

 

[stoveliker]

Draft reversal can happen when a fire is dying down. Be sure to always have good batteries in the alarm, and test it often.

If the primary air is open, a lot of heat goes up away thru the flue, I think. And needing that open points at wet wood.

But having smoke come out when you reload early (before it's burned up) also points at weak draft.
Maybe the flue isn't tall enough and not enough air is coming in.
(I know that's the opposite of what I said first, but the new info is the smoke, the alarm, and the dying when the primary air gets shut.)

The manual specifies a draft. Did the installer measure that the system provides draft to spec?
Did he light a fire and show he could operate it as intended (primary air down)? If yes, did he use his own wood?

 

[Grinnell]

These look like interesting stoves. Do they sell them in the states? is that a correct price?

Portway Arundel Deluxe Wood Burning / Multifuel Ecodesign Stove

Output: 5.0kW Fuel Type: Multifuel Construction: Steel body and door Brand: Portway

www.directstoves.com

 

[EatenByLimestone]

They’re priced in English pounds, not dollars.

 

[Eman85]

Yes I tried coal to rule out the log issue but it still didn't get hot. I put quite a bit on too. Plus the Carbon monoxide alarm woke me up at 4am, I assume as it was dying out it released poisonous gas!

I can't imagine burning coal not getting the stove hot. Then I can't understand why your Carbon Monoxide alarm would go off at all. I'd be checking the flue system for a restriction or something else wrong.