Quad Castile combustion fan.....

[BradH70]

Is the combustion fan supposed to run at a different speed for each of the heat settings (High, Med, Low)? I have a Castile (bought used) that I am trying to figure out and believe that the combustion fan is not changing speeds when I go from Low to Medium to High. When it is running in Low, the fan sounds like it is running full tilt.

The convection blower changes speeds when I switch heat settings, so I assume that the combustion fan should do the same.

Here is a thread that I started when I first got the stove hooked up and running:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/quad-castile-install-progress.90479/page-2#post-1190328

I appreciate any help.

 

[Czech]

Just the feed rate changes.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Are you certain Czech?

I remember a little issue that Quad had with their stoves and start up where they were starting with the combustion blower at the setting dictated by the feed rate and that was corrected with the clear covered controller. It now starts in high and then goes to match the feed rate setting.

The Castile doesn't have a damper so something has to change besides just the feed rate.

 

[kilbury]

Starts on high for the start up cycle then when it comes temp will go to whatever setting you have it at.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Starts on high for the start up cycle then when it comes temp will go to whatever setting you have it at.

That is also what I remember for the stoves with clear covered controllers.

The older controllers had an issue starting the stove when it was cold because they started with the combustion fan at the rate selected to match the firing rate setting,

 

[BradH70]

How do I know when the start up cycle is done? There is a green and red LED on the control box, do these indicate, in some combination, that the start up cycle is complete and it is now in normal run operation?

Is the end start up cycle based on time or temp?

 

[BradH70]

My controller is a black box, not clear so it must be an "older" one.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

How do I know when the start up cycle is done? There is a green and red LED on the control box, do these indicate, in some combination, that the start up cycle is complete and it is now in normal run operation?

Is the end start up cycle based on time or temp?

It is based upon temperature. Some where on here the leds are explained. Do you have the manuals for your stove?

 

[BradH70]

Smokey, yes I have the manuals. Here is what it says about the LED's:
******
There is a light located inside of the control box. The
internal light will turn green when the appliance has
reached a temperature of 175οF (79°C) in the firepot.
and will turn red when it reaches 600oF (315°C).
******
There is really nothing said about the start up cycle and speed of the combustion blower. Only that the convection blower will turn on after the appliance has reached the set temp on the "high" setting. Kinda' not true since this is controlled by the snap disc. The heat setting (H, M, L) does changes the speed of this blower though.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

When that light turns red your stove is out of start up, the 175 (usually mentioned on here as 200 indicates that ignition has occurred and it is safe to resume feeding pellets when it turns red at 600 the stove is off to the races.
The convection fan is controlled by a snap disc.
This setup can lead to strange occurrences if you attempt to short cycle the stove.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

The manuals other than service manuals rarely talk about combustion blower settings.

In general if there is no need for a damper to have to be changed when you change feed rates (heat range settings) the combustion blower speed has to be adjusted by the controller otherwise the fuel either burns up and the fire goes out or the fuel piles up in the burn pot.

 

[BradH70]

Ok, so tonight I will watch for the red light to come on and see if the combustion fan slows down or stays the same speed. It just seems that there is a lot of combustion air going through the pellets even on the low setting. The pellets are getting burnt up pretty quickly, causing a small flame even with the gate wide open. The other thing is that there is an inconsistent number of pellets being fed. I have checked that the auger is not turning backwards by keeping my hand on the motor. You can feel which way it is being torqued when the auger spins and it is always the same way. I also emptied out the hopper over the weekend for a good cleaning. While the auger was exposed, I plugged the stove in and enabled a start up cycle. The auger always turned the correct direction.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Quads are noted for having good combustion air flow.even on low.

 

[tjnamtiw]

Inconsistent feed is also a common trait of these stoves. I don't call it a 'fault' because they still work. I think the end of 'start up' might actually be when the igniter turns off, but can't find anything in the manual. I seem to remember something about 10 minutes OR when the green light comes on. I would start worrying when you DON'T have a good swirling air blast in the pot. The combustion fan is quiet enough that I can't hear it change unless I get my hearing aid right up to it.

 

[Bioburner]

My Santa fe was able to eat some terribly inconsistent pellets. Main reason for me to try one when It came up on Craigslist. Up for sale because I felt it blew out to much heat out the stack.

 

[Don2222]

Inconsistent feed is also a common trait of these stoves. I don't call it a 'fault' because they still work. I think the end of 'start up' might actually be when the igniter turns off, but can't find anything in the manual. I seem to remember something about 10 minutes OR when the green light comes on. I would start worrying when you DON'T have a good swirling air blast in the pot. The combustion fan is quiet enough that I can't hear it change unless I get my hearing aid right up to it.

Hello
Since you have the old control box, then the speed of the combustion blower will be the same speed as the heat level you selected. So no change in speed going from the startup cycle to the run cycle.

If I were you I would spend the 2 bills and get a new control box. Then you would have a faster startup and not have to worry about the dreaded CSS Cold Start Syndrome!

If you do want a new control box, the PC me. (PC = Private Conversation)

 

[BradH70]

Hello
Since you have the old control box, then the speed of the combustion blower will be the same speed as the heat level you selected. So no change in speed going from the startup cycle to the run cycle.

If I were you I would spend the 2 bills and get a new control box. Then you would have a faster startup and not have to worry about the dreaded CSS Cold Start Syndrome!

If you do want a new control box, the PC me. (PC = Private Conversation)

Thanks Don, I will think about your suggestion of the control box. The stove is actually working pretty good at this point but I wanted to run it on LOW but need to run it on MED to get the heat needed to bring the room temp up in a decent amount of time. On Low, the heat coming out of the heat exchange tubes is pretty low in my opinion and I am running Turmans through it right now. Before installing a new snap disk, the convection blower would short cycle. A new snap disk fixed this but the heat output is still minimal on the LOW setting. I started to pay more attention to other parts of the stove at that point and realized that the combustion blower does not seem to change speed regardless of the heat setting or after the startup cycle is complete.

Here is the setup:
Feed gate wide open.
Turman Pellets
New 110* snap disk on convection blower (made a big difference)
Cleaned the entire stove inside and out including the auger reservoir.

Exhaust pipe:
2' of 3" horizontal run to T-cleanout
5' of 3" vertical run through roof and capped.

I bought the stove used for $1,500 and thought that was a good deal considering the new ones are close to 3k. If I put a control box in it I will be at the same price as a new Santa Fe and that would make me sad, cause the point here was to save money on the stove. I made sure the stove ran before purchasing, but it is hard to tell just how good they will run in a 15 minute test outside in a driveway.

The stove is sitting in the game room (24' x 24') above the garage and really only heats that room. Using the oil furnace to heat that zone is very expensive.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

You can somewhat verify the fan changes speed by measuring the voltage across the motors power line. Also if it didn't change speed you'd have issues keeping a fire going.

I assume (probably shouldn't) that you made sure all of the fines were removed from the auger and hopper prior to filling it at your house, fines have a habit of really interfering with getting a good pellet load coming up the auger.

 

[Don2222]

Thanks Don, I will think about your suggestion of the control box. The stove is actually working pretty good at this point but I wanted to run it on LOW but need to run it on MED to get the heat needed to bring the room temp up in a decent amount of time. On Low, the heat coming out of the heat exchange tubes is pretty low in my opinion and I am running Turmans through it right now. Before installing a new snap disk, the convection blower would short cycle. A new snap disk fixed this but the heat output is still minimal on the LOW setting. I started to pay more attention to other parts of the stove at that point and realized that the combustion blower does not seem to change speed regardless of the heat setting or after the startup cycle is complete.

Here is the setup:
Feed gate wide open.
Turman Pellets
New 110* snap disk on convection blower (made a big difference)
Cleaned the entire stove inside and out including the auger reservoir.

Exhaust pipe:
2' of 3" horizontal run to T-cleanout
5' of 3" vertical run through roof and capped.

I bought the stove used for $1,500 and thought that was a good deal considering the new ones are close to 3k. If I put a control box in it I will be at the same price as a new Santa Fe and that would make me sad, cause the point here was to save money on the stove. I made sure the stove ran before purchasing, but it is hard to tell just how good they will run in a 15 minute test outside in a driveway.

The stove is sitting in the game room (24' x 24') above the garage and really only heats that room. Using the oil furnace to heat that zone is very expensive.

Looks good, You are welcome. What kind of T-Stat are you running?

I always recommend the Lux LTX1500u from Lowes.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_24971-37422-LTX1500U-006_0__?productId=3382134&Ntt=lux thermostat&pl=1&currentURL=?Ntt=lux+thermostat&facetInfo=
It has the swing setting for pellet stoves and will not short cycle them! I set the swing to 8 which is plus or minus 2 Deg F. Another feature I like about the T-stat is that even though it is a programmable digital T-Stat you can set the dip switch on the board for full manual operation! It works really good with the Quads. I have one on my Sante Fe in the shed/workshop with a toggle switch in the house to turn it on.

 

[tjnamtiw]

My Santa fe was able to eat some terribly inconsistent pellets. Main reason for me to try one when It came up on Craigslist. Up for sale because I felt it blew out to much heat out the stack.

If you have time, search the archives for modifications to the heat exchange tubes that were done by myself and a few others here. With these changes, stack temp right at the exhaust blower was only 145. Heat output increased dramatically. Search for 'turbulators', 'springs', 'modifications'.

 

[BradH70]

You can somewhat verify the fan changes speed by measuring the voltage across the motors power line. Also if it didn't change speed you'd have issues keeping a fire going.

I assume (probably shouldn't) that you made sure all of the fines were removed from the auger and hopper prior to filling it at your house, fines have a habit of really interfering with getting a good pellet load coming up the auger.

Yes I did for sure. I let the pellet level run down to the point were the stove would no longer feed pellets, then took a vacuum cleaner to the reservoir at the tip of the auger were the pellets start there adventure to the burn pot. There really wasn't to many fines but I gave a good vacuum anyways. I tapped on the auger too loosen up an pellets left over until nothing more was falling down. This was when I also verified that the auger was always turning the correct direction.

I also took the fire plates out and cleaned all the ash behind them and around and inside the combustion fan area.

 

[BradH70]

Looks good, You are welcome. What kind of T-Stat are you running?

I always recommend the Lux LTX1500u from Lowes.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_24971-37422-LTX1500U-006_0__?productId=3382134&Ntt=lux thermostat&pl=1&currentURL=?Ntt=lux+thermostat&facetInfo=
It has the swing setting for pellet stoves and will not short cycle them! I set the swing to 8 which is plus or minus 2 Deg F. Another feature I like about the T-stat is that even though it is a programmable digital T-Stat you can set the dip switch on the board for full manual operation! It works really good with the Quads. I have one on my Sante Fe in the shed/workshop with a toggle switch in the house to turn it on.

I'm using a Filtrete by 3M. It works well, but has a swing of only 2 degrees max. I might take a look at the Lux though. The Filtrete works great for the M55.

 

[tjnamtiw]

I'm using a Filtrete by 3M. It works well, but has a swing of only 2 degrees max. I might take a look at the Lux though. The Filtrete works great for the M55.

A two degree swing is plenty IMHO. In colder weather, your stove may restart when you hit the 2 degree low point, but the room temperature will continue to fall another degree or two before the stove is putting out enough heat to stop the temperature drop.

 

[Don2222]

I'm using a Filtrete by 3M. It works well, but has a swing of only 2 degrees max. I might take a look at the Lux though. The Filtrete works great for the M55.

Yes, 2 degress F should be fine, the Lux only goes to 2.25 Deg F swing.

 

[BradH70]

Then I guess I will stick with my current T-Stat.

I also ordered some springs for the convection tube "upgrade".