Quadra fire expedition II

[vbu]

Good afternoon everyone,

Last week we had our Quadra fire Expedition II insert installed after I cut out the old heatform.
They installed a 6" flex liner, and stuffed insulation around it (see picture). I'm not sure what type of insulation this is, but I assume that they know what they're doing and that it's fine? Just wanted to double check here. They did not install a blockoff plate.
The insert burns really well, as you can see, and throws off a decent amount of heat. I was hoping to heat my house with just the insert, but that won't happen. Last night we had our first freeze, and while the living room is probably around 73, it can't keep the rest of the house warm. Oh well, it is what it is. The fans on it work OK, they're loud for the amount of air they move.

Lastly, after burning a full day and stuffing it at night, I have SO MANY coals. They'll all be ashed over when I get up, but when I stir around its just inches and inches thick of coals. I can stir them around and it'll be really hot, but even after several hours of stirring I'm still left with what's in the picture. I ended up shoveling them out into a steel bucket. Any way I can prevent this from happening? Yes I could wait longer to refill it, but then my furnace is constantly running, which I'm trying to avoid. All help is appreciated!

 

[JKanor]

I cant speak on the insulation as I have a free standing stove and wall thimble. But if you're burning good hardwood like oak and hickory, the coaling is just part of it. In my BK I usually pull the coals to the front/ center since it burns front to back, then lay one split east/west in the back to level it up and stack the rest of the splits north/ south till its full. Ive found this best to use the available coals while still getting a full reload.

 

[thunderhead]

Open the air more during the coaling stage to burn em down faster?

 

[WoodBurnerInWI]

I too will always wake up each morning to a stove full of coals, this is after loading for the night with hardwoods. Since I don't have time to babysit it all morning, I simply rake the coals forward and load as much as I can on and around the coals. Usually this will end up being a good 5-7 pieces of wood of various sizes, more than enough for the day time burn till I get home. When I get home from work, I just turn the air up on my stove and rake the coals around and let the hot coal bed burn for a few hrs till the evening reload. This will get my stove top temps back up over 300-400 degrees assuming they dipped below that at some point during the day burn (or night burn).

 

[agonyzhou]

I own the same stove branded to vermont casting. The coaling in your picture is normal; Just rake them flat and reload on top of the coal bed. If the amount of coal is too few for a quick reload and you really want to reload, you can shovel them to one side next to the firebrick (the stove is pretty wide), and load new wood on the cold side, then do a top down start on your fresh load.

 

[vbu]

Yeah unfortunately there's no air control, so you can't have it wide open to burn them up quicker.
@azon

I own the same stove branded to vermont casting. The coaling in your picture is normal; Just rake them flat and reload on top of the coal bed. If the amount of coal is too few for a quick reload and you really want to reload, you can shovel them to one side next to the firebrick (the stove is pretty wide), and load new wood on the cold side, then do a top down start on your fresh load.

Yeah, there's just so much of it. That's after one day of burning. I'm afraid if I just keep on piling on top of it, I'll end up with a fireplace full of coals. I'll give it a try though, because scooping them out really makes a big mess.
How do you like the heat it puts out? Even with it burning like pictured, I was expecting more heat from it. The tubes are reddish discolored, do yours do that too? Thanks!

 

[agonyzhou]

I own the montplier

Yeah unfortunately there's no air control, so you can't have it wide open to burn them up quicker.
@azon

Yeah, there's just so much of it. That's after one day of burning. I'm afraid if I just keep on piling on top of it, I'll end up with a fireplace full of coals. I'll give it a try though, because scooping them out really makes a big mess.
How do you like the heat it puts out? Even with it burning like pictured, I was expecting more heat from it. The tubes are reddish discolored, do yours do that too? Thanks!

You can press the ACC to give it more air, however it does not seems to make too much difference in the coaling stage. Just give it enough time, like over night, it will burn down. I also use this:
Amazon product ASIN B00QSORTEC
To sift coal from ash and dump them back on top, to speed up the process.

Of cause I always want more heat from the wood I cut and stack myself; however, new burners like us tend set expectation too high. I am in my second season now; so far I am happy. I don't burn 24/7, more like 2 to 3 burns per day, and each burn I only load it half full. I don't have enough wood anyhow. The stove makes my living room toasty and spills heat to other parts of my house, taking loads off the shoulder from my furnace.

Your flame looks great and your tube looks fine. However the gasket on the glass seems to be bulging out a little near the door latch?

 

[vbu]

I own the montplier


You can press the ACC to give it more air, however it does not seems to make too much difference in the coaling stage. Just give it enough time, like over night, it will burn down. I also use this:
Amazon product ASIN B00QSORTEC
To sift coal from ash and dump them back on top, to speed up the process.

Of cause I always want more heat from the wood I cut and stack myself; however, new burners like us tend set expectation too high. I am in my second season now; so far I am happy. I don't burn 24/7, more like 2 to 3 burns per day, and each burn I only load it half full. I don't have enough wood anyhow. The stove makes my living room toasty and spills heat to other parts of my house, taking loads off the shoulder from my furnace.

Your flame looks great and your tube looks fine. However the gasket on the glass seems to be bulging out a little near the door latch?

Yeah I tried the acc, without much luck like you said.
I've been burning wood inserts all my life at my parents house, and theirs throws off a bunch more heat. I am happy with it though.
I like that idea! Too bad I can't find any in stock anywhere.
I'll check out the gasket, I haven't even noticed it yet.
Are you using any kind of flue temp probe?

 

[agonyzhou]

Are you using any kind of flue temp probe?

No. There is no place to put it; plus there is no air control so why bother.

 

[vbu]

I forgot to post some before and after pics and how I cut out the heat form insert

 

[IowaRSFBurner]

Your pictures don't show, did the installer add a block off plate at all? It would seem like you are potentially losing heat up the chimney instead of it being projected out into the room.

 

[vbu]

Your pictures don't show, did the installer add a block off plate at all? It would seem like you are potentially losing heat up the chimney instead of it being projected out into the room.

No he didnt... they stuffed a lot of insulation up there though. It wasn't until after I ordered the insert that I learned about a block off plate. I'm hoping that with all the insulation up there the heat loss isn't too significant

 

[Valkouts]

I installed the same insert about ten days ago. The first few days I kept loading without stirring the coals and I ended up with a thick bed of coals. I got a coal rake and started pulling all the coals as much forward as I could before reloading and the turn into ashes pretty quick. As far as heat output this is my first ever experience of an insert. I live in a two story colonial and it heats up the main level to 72-73 and the upstairs to 70. I am happy with it.

 

[Spidy11]

I too got a expedition 2 this year. I don't have a ton of experience with inserts but compared to some friends I agree it does coal a lot. I was doing the ashes/coals every day. Some things that have helped me reduce that is using the ACC everything I reload and using smaller splits. I got my cleaning out down to every 2 days.
Sometimes I wish I had more air control options to burn the coals down. But the convenience of the middle of the night if I wake to reload, just fill her up, hit acc, and right back to bed.
As far as heating I think it does pretty good. I have two story colonial and it heats my house. It kept it at 69 when it was 15 degrees out the other day. I do keep my furance fan running all the time to circulate the warmth.

 

[agonyzhou]

Can I ask you guys how much wood you burn per day in this stove?
I burn about 60 LB per day, in 3 burns, like 20 lb each, at breakfast, lunch and dinner time, or about 5 hours apart. When I go to sleep the stove is well into in coaling stage and the morning burn is a cold start. I vary the load size depending on the weather but I always stick to the same reload schedule. My house is too big for the stove so my furnace kicks in to pick up the slack, especially at night.

 

[Spidy11]

Can I ask you guys how much wood you burn per day in this stove?
I burn about 60 LB per day, in 3 burns, like 20 lb each, at breakfast, lunch and dinner time, or about 5 hours apart. When I go to sleep the stove is well into in coaling stage and the morning burn is a cold start. I vary the load size depending on the weather but I always stick to the same reload schedule. My house is too big for the stove so my furnace kicks in to pick up the slack, especially at night.

I am not sure in LBs. But I burn about a cord per month. I refuel every 2 to 3 hr during the day. My blower is on automatic and if I wait much longer it will shut off. I stuff it before bed. In the morning (6 to 8 hr) from stuffing there are enough red coals to restart. I clean out the ashes and coals in the am as well, every other day. Hope that helps.

 

[vbu]

I can't go 5 hours without reloading. 2, maybe 3 hours.
I don't know in pounds, but a stack of 10 ft long 4 high lasts about 1.5-2 weeks, and that's mostly burning at night.
I don't even come close to heating my house with it. If it drops below 40, I can forget about it. It's our first winter in this house, I guess the insulation isn't what it used to be ( house built in '67).

When I look above the baffle board, I can see the liner connector, or whatever it's called, it goes across the flue and has a bolt (maybe more than 1) in there, and it's always glowing red. Have any of yall noticed this? I don't know if I need to be concerned or not, but then again, there's no way of turning the stove down

 

[agonyzhou]

I don't come close to heat the house either; my guess is it is taking maybe 30% the heating load off the furnace. My 5 hour burn is kinda stretching; There is usually barely enough coal to reload. I probably should reload at 4 hours, but I don't have enough wood to burn that way and my daily routine work out better this way.

How do you look above the baffle board? through the glass? I can't see anything. The hottest place that I could have access to is the flue collar, if I took the surround off. Glowing red means > 1000F. I think it is a little too hot. If you point your IR gun at the center of the glass, what temp do you get when it plateaued? I find if it between 600 to 800, it is enjoyable.

 

[vbu]

Yes, I kinda sit on my knees and look through the glass (door closed) and above the baffle board, in the very back. It's not easy to see.
It's hotter than what I want to run, I hate heating my chimney, but if I run it any less I don't have near enough heat. Either way, I can't control the air anyway, I hardly use the acc on reloads

 

[agonyzhou]

Yes, I kinda sit on my knees and look through the glass (door closed) and above the baffle board, in the very back. It's not easy to see.
It's hotter than what I want to run, I hate heating my chimney, but if I run it any less I don't have near enough heat. Either way, I can't control the air anyway, I hardly use the acc on reloads

The only way to control is how and when to reload. You can load less wood but it will be cooler. Burning it hotter than what it is designed for is not safe in the long term.

 

[vbu]

The only way to control is how and when to reload. You can load less wood but it will be cooler. Burning it hotter than what it is designed for is not safe in the long term.

Yeah you're right. You'd think that it should be able to take it though, since they're controlling the air. Now if I had the acc open all the time, I could see how you'd purposefully get it too hot. I have a 21` chimney from top of the insert, so maybe there's a lot of draft. I don't know. I wish I could get more heat out of it, but I think I have it pretty much running wide open with the fans on mac.

I don't have an ir temp gun, so no clue on temperatures

 

[Spidy11]

I can't go 5 hours without reloading. 2, maybe 3 hours.
I don't know in pounds, but a stack of 10 ft long 4 high lasts about 1.5-2 weeks, and that's mostly burning at night.
I don't even come close to heating my house with it. If it drops below 40, I can forget about it. It's our first winter in this house, I guess the insulation isn't what it used to be ( house built in '67).

When I look above the baffle board, I can see the liner connector, or whatever it's called, it goes across the flue and has a bolt (maybe more than 1) in there, and it's always glowing red. Have any of yall noticed this? I don't know if I need to be concerned or not, but then again, there's no way of turning the stove down

That's about a cord or so a month. That is normal amount of wood to burn.
Question: have you tried runnin your furnace fan or blow a fan on the insert to help circulate the warm air?

Also i too do not have a block off plate. Planning on installing one this summer for me. Maybe you should do the same.

Is your wood good and seasoned?

I haven't noticed bolts hot but will look above there next time I refuel.

 

[jebatty]

I sense the frustration that results when a stove does not seem to provide the heat a person expects and wants for their home. But there are so many variables, both to the house itself and then to the local environment, that trying to compare one installation of a particular stove in a home in one location to the same stove in another home in a different location as to heating ability is not particularly helpful.

Our Expedition II is my first insert experience, although I had 30 years of experience with the stove it replaced, a free standing stove at one end of our main living space. The Ex[edition II is installed in an inside fireplace wall in the middle of the main living space. I miss the ability to control the draft, other than through the ACC which provides a pretty good boost in draft. As for operating temperature, the only thing I have is a magnetic stove thermometer on the top center of the door. I have been operating the stove at a temp between 300-400F, mostly at about 350 F, based on this thermometer with the blower fan on the second lowest setting.

Last night the stove burned out a moderate wood load, probably around midnight, and the 600 sqft main living space temp was 60F when I awoke, with outside temp at -10F. Within 30 minutes living space temp was 62F. I expect within a couple of hours living space temp will be about 70F and that temp will be maintained through the day. High today is forecast to be 18F. I will be satisfied if the Expedition can maintain 70F in the main living area which also is open concept to an adjoining dining/kitchen area, another 450 sqft.

The Expedition II is not a big stove. EPA output rating is 25,000 btu. My stove wood is mostly aspen, then a moderate portion of birch, and a very small portion other hardwoods. All wood is seasoned to 15-20% MC, Splits vary in size from quite small to nearly as large as the stove will accept. Coal buildup has not been an issue. During a burn period I scatter the coals on the stove bottom,, a little thicker near the front, before loading more wood. So far I have not packed a full load of wood in the stove, and I let the stove burn out its load of wood over the night, while emptying some ash in the morning before starting the burn for the day.

Either my wife or I am home most of the day, so we re-load the stove as needed during the day. We have not had a goal of long burns, but the goal is for the stove to keep the main living area at a comfortable temp during the coldest a northern Minnesota winter can provide, which typically includes periods of a few days and maybe a week or two with outside temp at -10 to -30F, with longer sustained periods of -5 to +20F.

 

[agonyzhou]

I have a 21` chimney from top of the insert, so maybe there's a lot of draft.

21' is not too tall; mine is closer to 30. Can you double check to make sure your baffles are sitting flat on the tubes, no gap in between or next to the firebrick, the baffle brace in the front is in place and secure, the insulation blanket on the baffles is flat and not bunching up? From your description it seems the stove over all is not super hot but the flue collar is.

 

[agonyzhou]

Yes, I kinda sit on my knees and look through the glass (door closed) and above the baffle board, in the very back. It's not easy to see.

Today I burn it hotter than I usually do; used too many smaller splits. The glass at one point was over 900F. I tried to look where you described, but at that time there was too much flame wrapping around the front of the baffle that I couldn't get a good look. When the fire died down a bit I tried to look again, and I don't think anything was glowing.