Hi there...I have been a long time lurker and decided to join this great forum. Wood stoves are in my blood, parents burn wood as a primary source of heat and my brother has a wood boiler system. I am looking at purchasing a flush wood insert for my home. I have done lots of reading on here as well as contacting dealers near me. I live in southern Ontario, Canada where the winters are fairly cold. I live in a 40 year old bungalow that has had lots of updates done(Windows,doors,Insulation,furnace). The house is approx. 2400 sqft. of relatively open concept living. The existing masonry fireplace is in the centre of the house in the basement. We like the looks of the modern inserts so I think we have made a shortlist of units that would fit our needs. The Pacific Energy Neo 2.5, Supreme Fusion 24 and BlazeKing Sirocco 25. These dealers are all within 40 minutes of our house. We would like to heat as much of the house as possible, run the insert 24 7 and would like 8 hour burn times for sure. We are leaning toward the Neo 2.5 based on reviews and cost vs. BK. Any input would be greatly appreciated! Thanks
Ready to purchase a wood insert.
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Since you're burning in the basement, what's the goal? To heat the entire house or just the basement? If it's the whole house, how open is the basement to the rest of the house?
As for the Neo 2.5, I don't have that insert, but generally speaking on 2.5 cuft stoves and inserts, you'll get 6-8 hour burn time. Depending on how much wood is put in and how hard you run it (and your definition of burn time), you could see shorter or longer than that as well.
As for the Neo 2.5, I don't have that insert, but generally speaking on 2.5 cuft stoves and inserts, you'll get 6-8 hour burn time. Depending on how much wood is put in and how hard you run it (and your definition of burn time), you could see shorter or longer than that as well.
Heating the whole house would be ideal or at the very least assist the forced air furnace. The staircase is on the other side of the of the fireplace approx 15 feet away. There is currently a cold air return almost directly above the fp. Was planning on running the furnace fan and having another fan blowing cool air towards the insert. My definition of long burn times is load the stove around 10pm, turn it down and having enough hot coals at 6am to relight easily. We generally burn ash some maple and its all body wood.
prezes13
Minister of Fire
Those inserts you mentioned are all good, but I don't really think they would heat your whole house.
jetsam
Minister of Fire
For whole-house heat, I would only consider semiflush inserts like the BK Princess, and the more it sticks out the better.
On that note, you'd do even better to extend the hearth and put in a freestanding stove.
No stove will do a good job if the basement floors and walls are not insulated; tackle that before setting up a stove.
Given all the work that and cost that might be required for a functional basement stove, an upstairs freestander might fall into the same price range and do a far better job at heating the whole house.
I do heat about the same square footage with an insert, but my insert isn't fighting a basement install.
One last consideration: If you heat with wood and use 3 cords a year, you get to carry at least 6000 pounds of wood to the stove by hand. How many stairs do you want to be part of that process?
On that note, you'd do even better to extend the hearth and put in a freestanding stove.
No stove will do a good job if the basement floors and walls are not insulated; tackle that before setting up a stove.
Given all the work that and cost that might be required for a functional basement stove, an upstairs freestander might fall into the same price range and do a far better job at heating the whole house.
I do heat about the same square footage with an insert, but my insert isn't fighting a basement install.
One last consideration: If you heat with wood and use 3 cords a year, you get to carry at least 6000 pounds of wood to the stove by hand. How many stairs do you want to be part of that process?
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prezes13
Minister of Fire
I second that. If you have the money to do that, nice two BK stoves would keep you nice and warm regardless what the temps are outside.
They are all good, put in the largest possible. Basement heating can be a challenge, but it will at least help supplement the heat. Are the basement walls fully insulated? Do you have several cords of wood already split and stacked and drying?
Thank you for the reply. The basement walls are insulated. The floor however will only have a small amount of insulation on it. We prefer the look of the flush mount inserts but I will consider the Blaze King princess. Our basement is a walk out and access to the backyard is available by truck so I would only be bringing wood inside the house from the enclosure under the deck. Also, I can store about a cord and a half beside the insert.
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I was thinking that a 2.5 cubic foot Firebox would be the smallest for what I want to do. Yes the walls are fully insulated. We do have a large amount of wood already cut split and drying, mostly Ash and Maple as I stated before. Do you heat with a Neo 2.5? I can't remember if it was you that was talking about it.
We heat with the larger PE T6, which is a Summit in a cast iron jacket.
Good for you getting ahead on the wood. That will make a nice difference.
Good for you getting ahead on the wood. That will make a nice difference.
I shouldnt take any credit. My father sells 50+ cord a year.
I think i have eliminated the Supreme. They look nice but burn times are shorter according to the manufacturer and their dealer network is fairly limited in our area.
I would agree with others that you'll at best supplement your furnace - and agree from personal experience (also have an insert in the basement).
I wouldn't use your furnace fan to try to circulate air. Your best bet to get heat upstairs is to try to get as much cold air from upstairs flowing to the basement. For me, I have an open stairwell and a small floor fan at the bottom pointed towards the insert. If the insert has fan as optional, you'll need it.
It's ok not have your floors insulated, for multiple reasons but it's virtually a waste no matter what since it's within the building envelope. Heating from downstairs will warm that area and make the upstairs floors warmer.
I wouldn't use your furnace fan to try to circulate air. Your best bet to get heat upstairs is to try to get as much cold air from upstairs flowing to the basement. For me, I have an open stairwell and a small floor fan at the bottom pointed towards the insert. If the insert has fan as optional, you'll need it.
It's ok not have your floors insulated, for multiple reasons but it's virtually a waste no matter what since it's within the building envelope. Heating from downstairs will warm that area and make the upstairs floors warmer.
So instead of having some ducting with an inline fan blowing air upstairs it should be drawing air down towards the furnace?
If there is a large open stairwell to upstairs then air will naturally convect down the stairwell at the bottom of the entrance and hot air will convect up at the top of the doorway. To improve air convection it can help to cut some return air vents in the floor at a few strategic locations on the perimeter walls of the house. If this is done the vents need to be large enough and they should have a fusible-link damper in them.
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There is a stairway that has a door on it but will definetly have it open during burning season. Lots to think about.
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Unfortunately I have the ceiling pulled down for another reno. So i have access right now.
Normally I would agree to try it first for a season to see how well it works. If you're already doing reno work, I'd be more inclined to say go for it. But, you'll need to think about where to place those vents. I don't have experience with this, but ideally, I think, they should be placed in areas where heat will be less likely to transfer on its own, essentially pulling the warm air towards it as the cold air goes down.
WoodfireNewbie
Member
Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't catalytic wood stoves tend to have longer burn times and higher efficiency? I have the Supreme 24 and definitely wouldn't count on getting an 8 hour burn. I've seen up to 4 hours before everything was ashed over, and if I'm lucky I'll have enough coals in the morning to light another starter and not much else.
jetsam
Minister of Fire
The highest burn time stoves are pretty much all cats, but not all cat stoves are well designed stoves that offer long burn times.
Some large noncats (such as the Kuma Seqoia) used to advertise 12 hours plus, not sure how that has changed with 2020 emissions standards.
I don't know of any noncat that goes 24 hours plus.
Hearthstone is coming out with a Hybrid Clydesdale. Their similar sized new “true hybrid” stoves are advertising 30hr burn times.
Although they say 12+ hours for the current Clydesdale which is barely good for 8 hrs.
Although they say 12+ hours for the current Clydesdale which is barely good for 8 hrs.
Is that 2400 sf including the basement or 2400 plus the basement? Yes cat stoves can give you very long burn times but with those long burn times comes very low btu output. So yes the princess I am currently running can run for 24 hours with the fan off but the house will be cold unless it is almost 60 outside running that way. If I actually want to heat my house it usually gets similar burn times that my regency 3100 did.
I would seriously consider something like one of these
www.drolet.ca
www.caddyfurnaces.com
this is my first winter with inserts but I miss my wood furnace
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jetsam
Minister of Fire
I heat 2300sf of 2x4 70s construction with a Princess Insert on low for most of the year. I feel like maybe you have a window open or something.... if I do an 8 hour burn it is cold outside, lower than 20.
But yeah, when it's zero degrees out, 2.5cf is 2.5cf and I'd be just as happy with a 30nc as a Princess, because they're both going for 8 hours anyway.
(Not QUITE true, because I have the flexibility to do a 12 hour medium burn in the princess for work, then a real hot short one when I get home if needed. With most noncats, I'd be lighting a fire after every work day. But I could live with that, though I'm glad I don't have to.)
Low won't even get the downstairs to 70 if it's much below 50. And won't do anything for upstairs. I do 12 hour burns down to about 35 or so unless the wind is howling. Below that it is 8 hours sometimes less.
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