Rookie looking to pull the trigger - Need some strong advice

[mursebuzz]

Would like to thank everyone on here for all the information they have provided me thus far. My situation... I just purchased a 1330 sq ft split level house that has oil heat. I have researched many options and settled on a pellet stove to provide a large supplement to this expensive oil. I have been to a harman dealer and been shown a p43 and a p61.Guy told me p61 could handle the whole house if I placed my fans on to circulate the warmed air. I have also looked at numerous englander stoves online and honestly I'm perplexed at the options. I would like to ( and I know there is a very strong opposition to this) place my stove in the basement. The previous owners cut an approx. 2.5ft x1 ft area out in the living room floor above the basement and placed a fan to circulate heat up from a now defunct wood stove, grate on top of it. My basement is finished, but does not have the best insulation. It is 3/4 underground with a garage and laundry room attached to the far side. If you have seen a split level from the late 70's or 80's this is your stereotype. The upstairs is a living room, kitchen, and three rooms. The house is made of brick and has plaster walls. New windows in front, rear windows need replaced, single pane. I have resealed all the doors that can be sealed. I am not opposed to placing a stove in my living room in a corner area if it means burning less pellets and a guarantee of decent heat to our bed room. But... If I can place a stove in the basement area and radiate heat up will I be able to live comfortably this winter? I would really like to keep the stove downstairs and save the room upstairs. I have been over this a hundred times in my head. You guys absolutely are the experts! All suggestions, brands and ideas are welcome. Winter will be here soon. Thanks in advance!

 

[Bioburner]

The hole in the floor is probably not legal per fire code unless some method for a fire stop has been installed

 

[Don2222]

Hello
I have a 60's split with a p61 in the center of the basement with 2 registers cut. The p61 in the garage is just backup if I needed it which I really do not. Just nice to have if I want to work in my short sleeves in there in the dead of winter. So just get a p61 for the basement and show us some pics of the install,

I also picked up a 25-ep that I am testing for an outdoor Patio heater.
It was a little chili last night but comfy in front of the stove. What do u think?

Do not pay any attention to that Travis Avalon Astoria 45k btu pellet stove to the righ. That is in my "pimp your stove" program where we take out the ho hum stock 1 amp exhaust blower and short single paddle blades and supe it up with a whopping 1.75 amp ball bearing blower and double paddle blades for the best low drafting performance that stove has ever seen. Remember the best low drafter burns a flame a little higher! Sung to the tune "Low Rider"! Then replace the knob control panel with an upgraded digital touch panel and remove the old skanky bronze oilite auger bearing and replace it with space age nylon bearing backed with an ultra high performance GA auger motor and repaint the stove with Surf Sand modern color for the iron fire brick backing!

 

[mursebuzz]

bioburner, When I had the house inspected there was no mention of that hole being an issue. But from the looks of it it was just cut between the joists and a fan placed. It may not be to code, but Im hoping I can utilize it for better flow. The p61 seems so pricy at around 4100 installed. I don't mind getting my hands dirty is there is anything that is cheaper and will also heat well.

 

[TimfromMA]

You would be much better off to place the stove in the room where you will spend most of our time. I live in a 2400 sqft split level. We live on the upper level which is approximately 1600 sqft. We have a finished basement with a 1 car garage under the house. Our finished basement is only used for storage.

Our stove is upstairs in a corner of the living room. Our bedrooms are at the opposite end of the house.

 

[Mt Bob]

Before you decide on a stove,decide where you want it.A f/s in the basement will make the heat down there unliveable(not all the time,though).A f/s upstairs will allow more to be fanned to back bedrooms while burning less fuel.BUT there are f/s stoves factory made to accept ductwork.Fan in floor is only part of the setup as return air has to be setup properly also or you burn xtra fuel.Coming from a basement dweller stove,fan in floor,return air vents,who is getting older and in process of putting a second stove upstairs,to burn less fuel in shoulder seasons and have better heat on 3rd floor when below 0.Just my 2 cents from using basement dewller for over 15 years.

 

[rona]

Would like to thank everyone on here for all the information they have provided me thus far. My situation... I just purchased a 1330 sq ft split level house that has oil heat. I have researched many options and settled on a pellet stove to provide a large supplement to this expensive oil. I have been to a harman dealer and been shown a p43 and a p61.Guy told me p61 could handle the whole house if I placed my fans on to circulate the warmed air. I have also looked at numerous englander stoves online and honestly I'm perplexed at the options. I would like to ( and I know there is a very strong opposition to this) place my stove in the basement. The previous owners cut an approx. 2.5ft x1 ft area out in the living room floor above the basement and placed a fan to circulate heat up from a now defunct wood stove, grate on top of it. My basement is finished, but does not have the best insulation. It is 3/4 underground with a garage and laundry room attached to the far side. If you have seen a split level from the late 70's or 80's this is your stereotype. The upstairs is a living room, kitchen, and three rooms. The house is made of brick and has plaster walls. New windows in front, rear windows need replaced, single pane. I have resealed all the doors that can be sealed. I am not opposed to placing a stove in my living room in a corner area if it means burning less pellets and a guarantee of decent heat to our bed room. But... If I can place a stove in the basement area and radiate heat up will I be able to live comfortably this winter? I would really like to keep the stove downstairs and save the room upstairs. I have been over this a hundred times in my head. You guys absolutely are the experts! All suggestions, brands and ideas are welcome. Winter will be here soon. Thanks in advance!

I've tried the stove in the basement twice and finally took some good advice and put it on the main floor where we spend our time. The first time I figured the stove was to small. Second year I bought a larger stove which still wasn't working. Finally took the bull by the horns and cut a hole in the wall on the main floor where it needed to be and finally had control of the heat situation. Burned less fuel and was nice and comfortable.

 

[Mt Bob]

I've tried the stove in the basement twice and finally took some good advice and put it on the main floor where we spend our time. The first time I figured the stove was to small. Second year I bought a larger stove which still wasn't working. Finally took the bull by the horns and cut a hole in the wall on the main floor where it needed to be and finally had control of the heat situation. Burned less fuel and was nice and comfortable.

Yep,makes sense.Put mine down there because that is where the smoke dragon used to live.Still works well as floor venting had already been figured out(trial and error).But there are a lot of days I have to have unit running on low all day to allow heat upstairs.If I get the 2nd one installed I figure to lower usage by at least 3/4 ton and be warmer on 3rd floor bedroom.Reason not moving old one up is because it does not self light.Picked up a used accentra and have finished rebuilding it.

 

[mursebuzz]

With a harman p43 or an englander 25-EP upstairs I shouldent have a problem keeping the main living area warm. Not a lot of dust or smoke? I forgot to mention I have a propane in wall heater in the basment in case I need it, prob 20-30k btu. I appologize if my questions are off the wall, covering all my bases... any other suggestions on stoves?

 

[Bioburner]

Our basement dweller probably does a bit better is the basement walls are rated at R60 and the floor being heated plus the stove being in front of the stairwell. Three planned pluses for this particular install. Only time really need the new last year stove upstairs is when the temps draw down way below normal(-5)and probably could negate its use by installing a loop under the kitchen dining rooms. But the Elena is pretty stove and good for shouldering.

 

[Pellet_Pete]

I have a comparable 2-level setup, and 2 stoves. The upstairs stove (Harman XXV) is our main heating machine, even though it is by far not in an optimal location. I use the basement stove (P61A) to supplement when the ground is frozen solid (Jan-Feb or later), especially when nights get below 15 F. I've had a few times when my XXV was down, always on a frigid January day, and the P61A alone only keeps the upstairs at 62 or so, even with the basement door open and a 6x10 cutout for circulation. That's my story anyway.

 

[Mt Bob]

Bio-mine is a dirt floor basement,see why I want the 2nd?Also -5 cold?WUSS.But realisticly when -10 or more and wind blowing upstairs(3) bedrooms would be 58 and windows covered in ice.To OP research more,you are learning.Rare to see harman and england in same sentence.One is a caddillac,other is a nova.If you did not need all the fancy stuff,I would go for the england stove,plus the factory rep is a regular poster here and helps everyone,harman,not so much,they are like travis ind. where they wany you to call a dealer for everything.Smoke in the house?Not likely,usually from poor install or a problem.Dust(what would I know,I live in a log cabin with a dirt floor!)comes from poor cleaning procedures and cheap pellets(when dumping into hopper).BUT having a constant fan running will help move all house dust around.You can always tell the wife she is not cleaning well!

 

[Bioburner]

Well Bob I knew you had a dirt floor as you have posted pictures of your stove install. Had a friend that lived in a log home in northern MN and his self imposed nick name was "Jack Pine Savage". He was more than a bit rough around the edges

 

[DV]

Look at the drolet eco 65. You can duct it right into that hole in your floor. It's working great for me.

 

[Tonyray]

Thought about putting our P61A in the basement but was Not convinced we would be able to warm bedrooms Upstairs...[ 2 floors above the basement.]
So We put it in the living space and with a ceiling fan at the top of the steps on Low/Clockwise, we get plenty of heat upstairs.
Full Basement is just for storage anyways so God Knows what I was thinking back then...

 

[mursebuzz]

Yeah, I have learned a ton. So im convinced placing it in the main living space is the best solution. Prob gonna go with the p43 as it seems (as you said) like a a solid stove that will last a long time. I can place a fan in the hallway to throw some more heat back to the bed rooms. The downstairs will be used (man cave) and Id like to keep it warm, or at least warm when its gona be used. A small second stove, bad idea? As for the ECO, it can vent about 9 feet up right into the hole that has been cut? does all the heat vent up, or does some also go down through the blower to heat the room it is in?

 

[mursebuzz]

When I place it upstairs I dont really have the ability to place it in the open, however there is room near our kitchen, one wall will be next to it on the left. Still I feel the heat should disperse pretty well.

 

[Mt Bob]

Will give a little more,just having a beer,watching it rain,watching the race.First off,western pa--COAL?(had to get that in before tj smacks me ).Stove in an alcove will only cost you more fuel,sometimes that is the only choice.There are several stoves that can be ducted,do some research,do not depend on total answers from here.9 foot?And do not forget cold air return.Also do not forget a pellet stove is a space heater.If you wanted to do a real world test go buy 3 cheap 10k electric heaters,wait untill it gets cold out,then move the group of 3 around your house and take notes.Also what makes you think the harman will be a long life unit,price?There are also older austros,whitts,englanders and others in service.I like harmans(but they make me money,but so did fiats).Just thought I would throw another iron in the fire.

 

[Havilcek stole the ball]

Murse,
That hole in the floor deal sounds a little concerning to me. First, from the sound of it your cellar is kept pretty cool most of the time, so you'll be bringing extra cool air into the area you are trying to heat for no purpose. Second, and I know you said the house inspector said nothing about it, you should be sure whatever is in that opening is fire rated. There are code annoyances and then there is good practice, and in this case they actually coincide, in my opinion. You want to compartmentalize between spaces to the extent possible so that if the s*** hits the fan when everyone is sleeping, everyone gets out. Allowing a fire to jump up a whole floor without a fight (i.e., through that opening) loses a lot of critical time.

Aside from that, I totally agree that the stove should be in the living space. If you need some distribution assistance in the form of ceiling fans or other fans, you can look into it once the stove is in. Sometimes it's hard to know how the heat will travel around in the house. Also, and pretty much as a last resort, the stove really could be moved if it's not working out. I used a good installer (Harman), and he was invaluable in sizing up my situation and siting the stove.

 

[mursebuzz]

The hole in the floor is just cut in the subflooring between the joists, just a fan, plug and a vent grate on top. I can literally see down into the basement, could drop a football down there. How can I firerate this area? Correct, the basement is always very cool. I just wanted reaffrimation of my decision really . The harman, from my research seems like a solid stove. I dont have a vast amount of experience with pellet stoves. I want something that is going to last, and for the best price. Basically what everyone wants. I understand the maintence that is required and that things will need replaced.

 

[Havilcek stole the ball]

It's not my field, but I understand that the fan could be switched out with a fire rated damper which would close that opening in the event of a fire. See this discussion for example: https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/floor-register-fire-dampers.26515/. I have given this thought in the past because I have been sorely tempted to open up holes in the ceiling/floor to let the heat get into a bedroom upstairs where the door is closed. For now, we're using heavy blankets to keep warm instead of opening up holes to those rooms. Like I said, once the stove is in, you'll see where the heat is reaching and where's it not, and then do your tweaking accordingly.

 

[UpStateNY]

The real reason for my wife and I having the pellet stove upstairs in our split house living room is its nice and warm in the living room, kitchen/dining room where we spend most of our time. When I say warm I mean 72 to 75 degrees warm. We are not cold in the winter. And if you get a chill from being outside you can always stand over next to the pellet stove for a few minutes. We love it.

That said if I put some numbers into this calculator it says I save anywhere from $600 to $350 for then entire winter depending on pellet cost from $230 to $300 a ton. Fuel Oil right now is $3.43. I burn 3 tons in my split with the stove up stairs. Personally I think I save a lot more than this. The real savings for me we don't heat the down stairs and the 3 bedrooms upstairs are very cold during the day because we keep the doors closed. At night we open the doors to the bedrooms but they are still on cool side in the low 60s which is great for sleeping. Because all that bedrooms sq feet are cold during the day and cool at night, I am saving a lot more than $600 per year.

The question here is do you want to heat the down stair rooms "MOST" of the time or NOT? If yes put the stove down stairs. If NO then you will save a lot more $$$ putting the stove upstairs.

Hold on. More important! - Do you want a pellet stove because you want it nice and warm 74 degrees while watching TV or reading your favorite book? If so put the pellet stove in the room where you spend most of your time.

You have to figure out why you are getting a pellet stove in the first place. If its to save a few $100 a year to haul around 3+ tons of pellets each winter, personally I would not do it. I would stay with the oil. If its to have a really really warm place in the main living space of the house without breaking the bank, now it is worth buying a pellet stove.

Just my two cents.

So why exactly are you getting a pellet stove again ?

 

[Jaymaine34]

Location location location ! My best advise like others have said is put it where you want the heat .
Myself I keep about 2100 sq feet at 75 and burn about 3 tons in my home ( other stoves are at other locations ) last year was very cold as we all know . I burnt just about 3-1/2 tons . I have played with the idea of a basement install just didn't make sense from what others have had for results . I'm installing one in the basement as we speak ( got a great deal on a 4th stove ) but my intentions for that stove is only to heat 1100 sq feet as needed ( man cave )
Six tons put away with another 10 on the way . As far as savings go my Maine home with oil at its current cost would be about 2400 for the winter with the house at 68 with pellets I'll be under 900 with the house at 75 ! Add oil for my hot water ( about 100 gallons a year 320.00 ) I save over half the cost of oil !

 

[Tonyray]

With Oil, we would keep the house at 67, Not run around in Tshirts just to keep our Oil bill under $2,000 yr.
With Our Harman,,, Our house,[most of it] was around 73-74 and we spent just under $1,000 for pellets.
Even if we spent the same as Oil, I would still have a Stove for the reason of Staying much warmer all winter
and not having to keep the Thermostat in the 60's..
Picking up and un-loading/stacking few Skids of pellets for winter takes up a couple hours with help..Well worth it..even if it took All day once a year..

 

[TimfromMA]

I used 900 gallons of heating oil before pellets, 300 per year after.

Do the math.