Saw goes dull quick..

[Dustin]

Alright Hearth.com experts, I need your help!


This is my first year cutting my own wood. I have some family with property, and a bunch of down trees.


Anyway, for some reason, my chain is going dull FAST. I know that your never supposed to hit the ground, but i'm having a hard time avoiding this, are there any tips or tricks to keep from hitting the ground? Some of the rounds are big, so putting somthing under the tree is dangerous, and not possible. Do you stop your cut short and do something to bust it the rest of the way off?


Also, when I don't hit the ground, I still notice the saw going dull. Am I cutting for too long at a time? I'm running the saw non-stop cutting until it runs out of gas, putting more gas in it, and then going at it again till it runs out.

I look at the chain and notice it looks like, well, hot metal, nice purple hot colors. Will heating the chain up that much make it go dull fast?

I know some of these seem like dumb questions, but, i'm new!

Thanks guys
D/F

 

[aandabooks]

What are you running? Saw and chain.

Aside from that, don't hit the dirt. Stop short and then roll the log to finish the cuts. Maybe 4-5 worth. You could get a timberjack and lift the wood to cut clean through the round.

Are you running bar oil? I know you mentioned gas but didn't see anything on oil. Your purple chain indicates not enough oil. You don't want colored chain. Silver is the way it should look.

 

[Dustin]

Bar oil every time..

It's a stihl 046 long bar..not sure of the length. And an oregon chain. That's about all I know.

It goes through bar oil, so i'm assuming it's flowing as it should...

 

[aandabooks]

There should be an adjustable oiler setting on that saw. Look on the bottom for a small screwdriver slot right below where the clutch is.

File the rakers so they are .025-.030 below the level of the tooth. You're probably running LGX or LPX on that saw. Definately should be 3/8. Maybe order a new chain and test the results.

 

[Jack33]

Have you cleaned out the bar groove and the oil hole in the bar? Are there burrs on your bar rails? If you run the saw out of the wood is your chain wet with oil? Will it fling oil off the tip of the bar? Are you touching up your chains with a file? Is your chain too tight? Has this wood been skidded (dirty wood)?

As far as avoiding the dirt....if you can't lift or roll the log, you are going to hit dirt. I roll mine with a timberjack. But if I have to do it without, I make my cuts about 2/3 of the way through for the entire length of the log. Then I go back to one of the middle cuts and finish it all the way through with just the very tip. Then I only have to roll half the weight and make only 1 cut to the ground.

 

[savageactor7]

If the chain doesn't look oily or has burnt powdered wood sticking to it then you have a lube problem...that'll dull a chain too.

It's just the nature of the beast that chains will get dull with use. Of course if you can follow the advice by the fellows above you can maximize your sharp chain use. Next time you sharpen the chain try just letting the chain do the cutting...over time I've seen a lot of new users over using those spiked dogs for leverage and horsing the chain threw the wood. If you not already try just holding the handle bar without pressing hard against it.

Know when to quit...if your chain is dull just deal with it right then and there. Yeah, you can probably get away with limbing small stuff with a dull chain but when it comes to making real production bucking rounds there is no substitute for a sharp chain.

Compressed air is your friend if you want your saw to run at peak performance take it apart and hose it down inc the bar along the groves the drive links ride in and the oil ports on both sides.

 

[Adios Pantalones]

Here's what you do- and it might not seem obvious.

Cut most of the way through. If the log is suspended from the ends (curves up rainbow style), then don't go deep enough to pinch the bar.
Now make another cut, and another- cut most of the way through on rounds all the way up the trunk.
If the piece is short enough to handle- give it a push with your foot to roll it over, now you can finish those cuts from the other side with no danger of hitting ground.
Otherwise- find a place to cut a length free (often for me that's finishing with an up-cut), then you can roll the log over and finish cuts.

Also- always sharpen a sharp chain. I touch up almost every tank- just a few licks on each cutter when I'm filling up.

If you're sharpening with a grinder/Dremel- then don't grind so long! That will heat up the links and screw up the temper. That treatment could ruin a chain. The heat of cutting won't blue a chain like that.

Don't buy cheap chain- it dulls faster. Get a good quality name- Stihl is top notch. Oregon and a few others are well respected as well.

 

[smokinj]

Here's what you do- and it might not seem obvious.

Cut most of the way through. If the log is suspended from the ends (curves up rainbow style), then don't go deep enough to pinch the bar.
Now make another cut, and another- cut most of the way through on rounds all the way up the trunk.
If the piece is short enough to handle- give it a push with your foot to roll it over, now you can finish those cuts from the other side with no danger of hitting ground.
Otherwise- find a place to cut a length free (often for me that's finishing with an up-cut), then you can roll the log over and finish cuts.

Also- always sharpen a sharp chain. I touch up almost every tank- just a few licks on each cutter when I'm filling up.

If you're sharpening with a grinder/Dremel- then don't grind so long! That will heat up the links and screw up the temper. That treatment could ruin a chain. The heat of cutting won't blue a chain like that.

Don't buy cheap chain- it dulls faster. Get a good quality name- Stihl is top notch. Oregon and a few others are well respected as well.

I must be on your page today,only thing to add is the wood clean(no rotten spots )?

 

[CowboyAndy]

I switched to STIHL brand chains and have found that they stay sharper longer, even with the occasional date with dirt...

 

[smokinj]

I switched to STIHL brand chains and have found that they stay sharper longer, even with the occasional date with dirt...

Ive got many stihl and woodland pro,Stihl is a little better but you can get 2 for the price of one with the woodland pro(baileys carrys it) Change after every tank always good to go!

 

[lobsta1]

I have guys dropping off tree trunks at my house. Beggars can't be choosers, so I end up with a lot of trunks that are 3' plus in diameter. I cut 3/4ths of the way through & then drive in a few plastic wedges. Cut the rest of the way down & make sure I stop at the bark. (Must keep saw parallel to the ground. Then drive the wedges in some more. At least 90% of the time the piece will bust loose or at least allow me to roll the piece & break the bark off. I very rarely hit the dirt.
Al

 

[Dustin]

Have you cleaned out the bar groove and the oil hole in the bar? Are there burrs on your bar rails? If you run the saw out of the wood is your chain wet with oil? Will it fling oil off the tip of the bar? Are you touching up your chains with a file? Is your chain too tight? Has this wood been skidded (dirty wood)?

As far as avoiding the dirt....if you can't lift or roll the log, you are going to hit dirt. I roll mine with a timberjack. But if I have to do it without, I make my cuts about 2/3 of the way through for the entire length of the log. Then I go back to one of the middle cuts and finish it all the way through with just the very tip. Then I only have to roll half the weight and make only 1 cut to the ground.

I don't see oil all over the chain..it uses about half of the bar oil that it holds, for every tank of gas...

Should oil be flying off the chain? Should it fling off the tip of the bar? None of those things happen...

 

[glacialhills]

Should be pretty equal in use... when gas tank is empty so should bar oil. Sounds like you need to adjust the flow. And follow all other good tips given. I always touch up the chain after one tank of fuel.

 

[smokinj]

Have you cleaned out the bar groove and the oil hole in the bar? Are there burrs on your bar rails? If you run the saw out of the wood is your chain wet with oil? Will it fling oil off the tip of the bar? Are you touching up your chains with a file? Is your chain too tight? Has this wood been skidded (dirty wood)?

As far as avoiding the dirt....if you can't lift or roll the log, you are going to hit dirt. I roll mine with a timberjack. But if I have to do it without, I make my cuts about 2/3 of the way through for the entire length of the log. Then I go back to one of the middle cuts and finish it all the way through with just the very tip. Then I only have to roll half the weight and make only 1 cut to the ground.

I don't see oil all over the chain..it uses about half of the bar oil that it holds, for every tank of gas...

Should oil be flying off the chain? Should it fling off the tip of the bar? None of those things happen...

make sure the oiler is adjusted all the way up!Its getting colder out so if it is adjusted all the way out you may want to change to winter bar oil!

 

[savageactor7]

D/F yeah you have to adjust the oiler so that you run out of fuel first and have a little oil to spare. Next time you start up rev up the saw about 6" or so away from a fresh cut round and you should see the tip of the chain throwing a little oil off the end of the sprocket.

Sometimes while cutting chips can clog up proper bar oiling so it's a good idea to check the bar using the above method. Often you can just rev up and freewheel the chain to self clean the blockage...other times you have to remove the side cover.

 

[Corey]

You don't mention where on the chain these "blue hot colors" are. If the color is on the base of the links, then that would typically indicate an issue with oiling (but about 1/2 a tank of bar oil per tank of gas seems about average) - or you have a bent bar, or dry bar tip sprocket - or something else that is leading to high friction.

If the blue color is on the tips of the cutting links, this indicates that the metal was ground too hard and/or too fast when the chain was sharpened. The metal has been tempered (softened) due to the heat which will ABSOLUTELY make it softer and dull faster. If this is your doing, try to be less aggressive with the grinding. If someone did this to the saw, find a new guy to sharpen it or tell them to lighten up on the grinder.

IMHO, a full-on chain grinding is only needed after serious damage - hitting a rock, metal embedded in wood, etc. I touch up my chain after every tank of gas using either a file or a quick swipe with a dremel tool and chain sharpening stone. In either case, this is a very light 'dusting' to keep the chain razor sharp. You really can't run a saw chain like a lawn mower blade - sharpening only once a season or something like that.

 

[Tony H]

I seem to run the same ratio 1 tank oil for every two of gas and every time I add oil I use the hand file to keep the chain sharp. Once I got used to keeping it at the proper angle it just takes 3-4 strokes on each tooth to keep it nice and sharp the other thing I do is check/adjust the tightness each time, a loose sharp chain cuts just like a dull chain.

 

[jtb51b]

You don't mention where on the chain these "blue hot colors" are. If the color is on the base of the links, then that would typically indicate an issue with oiling (but about 1/2 a tank of bar oil per tank of gas seems about average) - or you have a bent bar, or dry bar tip sprocket - or something else that is leading to high friction.

If the blue color is on the tips of the cutting links, this indicates that the metal was ground too hard and/or too fast when the chain was sharpened. The metal has been tempered (softened) due to the heat which will ABSOLUTELY make it softer and dull faster. If this is your doing, try to be less aggressive with the grinding. If someone did this to the saw, find a new guy to sharpen it or tell them to lighten up on the grinder.

IMHO, a full-on chain grinding is only needed after serious damage - hitting a rock, metal embedded in wood, etc. I touch up my chain after every tank of gas using either a file or a quick swipe with a dremel tool and chain sharpening stone. In either case, this is a very light 'dusting' to keep the chain razor sharp. You really can't run a saw chain like a lawn mower blade - sharpening only once a season or something like that.

I agree.. I worked at a lawnmower shop that sharpened a lot of chains and you could tell the difference in who sharpened them.. We had one guy who was a bit older and notably slower-- his chains were sharp and lasted; the younger and more spry guy's chains were always blued and never good for more than one sharpening.. I touch my chains up when I notice they are no longer aggressively cutting. Every time I GRIND them, I lower the rakes so the chain actually gets more of a bite... If you sharpen your own chains for a while you will find the point at which your saw likes to work, I have an echo that for some reason LOVES to cut fast and hard, I find myself lowering the rakes beyond spec on this saw.. I have a Stihl MS292 that is the exact opposite it likes smaller chunks and actually "cuts" at the same rate in small wood as the big saw.. Your best course of action is to use the internet to learn to sharpen your own chains, and thereby learn where your saw likes to be..

Jason

 

[woodconvert]

I don't see oil all over the chain..it uses about half of the bar oil that it holds, for every tank of gas..

Should oil be flying off the chain? Should it fling off the tip of the bar? None of those things happen...

If you've got a long bar on it turn the oiler all the way up. You won't see oil all over the chain but if you hold the bar tip next to a log and rev it up you'll see oil hit the log (or you should). If with the oiler turned all the way up it's not slobbering like a St. Bernard then you may have to clean the oiler.

Just curious...you are not using some real thick bar oil are ya?

As far as bluing the chain...it's toast. It got hot...once you do that they won't hold an edge.

 

[flewism]

Yep, that chain is trashed, time to start over with a new chain. Good advice to follow on that oiler and sharpening. Are you sharpening with a file?

 

[downeast]

All good advice, especially from the "Pants" guy. Good stuff Adios !

Get a good hand filer such as the PFERD that will do the edge and the raker on each pass. The tool is what we call better than sliced bread.

Check the sharpness of the business end of the cutter by looking at it in the sun: if you can see a reflection, the edge is dull.

Get a stump vise. Bang it in a stump, place the bar in the vise, sharpen simply in the field.

Most of all learn how to hand file; it's not difficult but takes some time to get it right.

Look at the chips when cutting: if they are like sawdust, you have a dull chain. Don't force it like the man said, sharpen.

Oil: fill the oil with every tank mix. You can check to see if the oiler oils ( ! ) by running the saw at WOT holding the bar close to a board or tree---then looking for a line of oil on the surface.

Finally, stick to brand name chains from a good dealer. We find the Stihl steel ( ! ) to hold an edge longer. It is supposed to be chrome plated.....well over my head why. Seems to do the job. And, it does not matter whether or not you use a safety chain for cutting. We don't, but even a high quality safety chain ( with the extra rakers to help prevent kickback ) will cut well when sharp. Last week by mistake I put a new Stihl safety chain ( borrowed ) on the 260 , it bore cut and top bar cut as well as our regular non-safety Stihl chains.

 

[ourhouse]

Do you push hard on the when cutting?

 

[downeast]

Do you push hard on the when cutting?

Pardon moi ???

 

[deedub]

Do you push hard on the when cutting?

if you have to push the saw thru, then your chain is dull. let the saw do the work.

 

[stee6043]

Maybe I didn't read closely enough but I didn't catch any mention of the different chain types out there? My local Stihl dealer has "green" and "yellow" chains. The green has the anti-kickback and the yellow is a full chisel, no kickback "device". In my opinion the green chains are not for someone comfortable with a saw. They dull up very quickly. I have two that will very soon be relagated to back-up only when I have a few yellow's to keep me going.

Get the full chisel and don't look back....unless it's your first saw and first chain......then you should learn with a green...and check your oil...and everything else everyone else has recommended...