Selecting a wood insert

[lygatm]

I'm looking to purchase a wood burning fireplace insert. My fireplace opening is 39 inches wide by 34 tall (but arched), and is 22 inches deep. It is in a 22 ft x 24 ft family room which is not directly open to the rest of the house (access by one doorway from kitchen). Since the fireplace is fairly wide I would like to put in an insert that can take as long a piece of wood as possible (20 inches would be nice), but don't want either too expensive an insert or one so big it will overheat the room. I also would prefer an insert that has a small heating (cooking?) shelf on it. The surround needs to be tall enough to cover the 34 inch arched opening, but not so wide as the fireplace has a small wood storage nook adjacent to it. Any surround wider than 54-55 inches will overlap this nook. Any recommendations would be appreciated.

 

[philaphire]

welcome to the forum - check out the avalon rainer - its can take a 19.5" log, if you get the 45 degree flue it has a 9 or so inch radiant cooktop surface, also, I believe there are different sized surrounds that you could get. Another similar option, not as wide - 18" log, but slightly bigger firebox and different look, is the Lopi Revere. They're not Cadillacs, but not chevy's either. It's also possible that you can get a surround cut to fit the arch of your fireplace. You can check my Rainer out in my avatar and picture forum.

 

[lygatm]

I got a look at a Lopi Freedom at a dealer today and I liked it's wide door and the small cooktop it has. It may be what I'm looking for, although it may actually produce more heat than I need for my family room. Does anyone think this is a problem, or should I just get the larger stove anyway since it will fit in my fireplace? What's a reasonable price that I should expect to pay for the Freedom?

 

[philaphire]

things to consider: how often will you burn - 24/7 or on occasion? how much of the house do you want to heat? How hot is too hot? How well insulated is the room/house? If overheating is a concern and if you want to fill your fireplace with a big insert to look at a big fire, then those 2 issues conflict IMHO. Having said all that, if you're looking to heat as much as possible and heat 24/7 I think many will say to get the biggest stove you can fit and afford.

$2500 -$3000 range for the unit itself is what I would think the Freedom runs.

 

[Rhone]

The "cooking shelf" you mention, just an FYI most inserts their "cooking shelf" is insulated. That will twiddle your selections right down, actually the only inserts I know that have a true cooking surface Philiphire nailed, the Lopi & Avalon so you're on the right track. The reason most are insulated, they will work in more fireplaces as it reduces your clearance to combustibles above. Another way of saying it, if you want a functional "cooking" surface on your insert your mantel usually needs to be non-combustible (stone perhaps), non existent, or unusually high above the insert. With the Lopi Freedom your mantel needs to be at a minumum 52 1/4" above your hearth, and the Avalon Rainier it needs 52 5/8". They make mantel shields to lower the requirement but they're especially ugly (it would lower the requirement to 37 1/4" for the Freedom and 37 5/8ths for the Rainier). So, pay particular attention to your mantel and it's height above the hearth. Inserts with insulated cooking surfaces (like the Hearthstone Clydesdale, Pacific Energy, Osburn) their cooking surface (or warming is more like it) won't get much above 200-300F but their clearance above to the mantel is only in the 42-44" range without needing a mantel shield.

As for overheating the room it's harder to do that with inserts vs. stoves as inserts make mostly convection heat (hot air) which wants to travel to the colder parts of your house so the heat doesn't particularly stick around the room it's in. They also produce very little radiant heat, which is the type that can only be used in the room and frequent cause of feeling overheated. Often just its blowers are sufficient and the hot air spreads naturally out but worse case just have a fan blowing the hot air out of the room. Does the room have cathedral ceilings?

 

[lygatm]

Thanks for all the good feedback. Some more particulars about the room and fireplace. No cathedral ceilings in the room except for a 3 ft x 12 ft "bump" out I built on the front wall of the room, with a large window with a half round window above it. This portion is cathedral, with a small section that breaks thru the ceiling into the rest of the room. I only have one doorway from this room to the rest of the house thru the kitchen, but I may punch another doorway to the dining room, since I would like to open things up a bit. The fireplace is along the middle of the wall between the family room and the main portion of the house, which is a fairly standard colonial. The one doorway into the kitchen is on the right side of the fireplace, and if I put another doorway in it would be on the left of the fireplace. Besides making the room less isolated, I would hope that this would set up some air circulation to the rest of the house if I get an insert. With the fireplace as it is, I have a hard time keeping the room warm even with a roaring fire going. I guess that's since so much heat goes up the chimney. As for the fireplace, it has a brick face that's exposed all the way up to the ceiling. The fireplace has no mantel, and the hearth extends out 18.5 inches, and is about 6 inches above the wood floor. I guess I would have to add some fire protection to the floor if I install an insert that protrudes from the fireplace as much as a Lopi Freedom or Avalon Olympic does (about 7 inches or so). Can I just tear out a 6 foot by 2 foot section of wood flooring from in front of the fireplace and put in a layer of cement board and tile or stone? Will that meet code? I guess I would really only need a 1 foot extension, but might as well make it 2 feet and make it look nice! Or do I even need the fireproof extension since the hearth is raised? Also, what's a good quality brand of chimney liner to get? This forum has been a source of much information. I love the sections dealing with cutting out damper frames! I almost can't wait to start hacking away at mine! I think a nice plasma cutter will do the trick!

 

[thechimneysweep]

Cyclone, before you go whacking up your floor, check out the Pacific D1 Insert. This model was specifically tested and listed to go on your raised hearth without the need for an extension.

 

[lygatm]

I really do like the D1, except that the max wood size is 18 inches. I like the Summit even more as its max wood size is 20. Will the upper heating surface of either model get hot enough for a kettle? Still, the bigger doors on the Avalon and Lopi units seem to make sense as far as ease of loading. What are the opinions out there on this? I have no experience on the topic, as I'm used to throwing wood onto my 39 inch wide fireplace, which, even with the doors I have on it still gives me a 36 inch opening.

 

[lygatm]

I finally have my insert installed and burning. I settled on the Pacific Energy Summit and so far it exceeds my expectations. Thanks to everyone on hearth.com as well as Tom at Chimney Sweep Online for all the great advice! You all helped me make the right choices! I put in everything myself, including the insulated chimney liner per Tom's instructions. The liner kit from Chimneysweeponline had everything I needed (except for the silicone sealer!), and the quality of the stainless steel top plate and connectors is first rate! Had to cut out the damper bracket, but by using the angle grinder with the cutting wheel it was easy! Messy, but easy. The insulated liner slid right down the chimney. Instead of a guide cone, I used a big coffee can with a hole in the end that I was able to tie a rope to in order pull from the inside while my brother fed it in from the roof. With the insulation on, as well as the wire mesh, it doesn't bend as easy as you'd like, but it was still no problem. With the insert going at night the furnace doesn't even go on. Heats the whole house, 2400 sq. ft. We'll see if that still holds true in January! And the unit looks pretty good in the fireplace as well! I left off the surround, as the fireplace has an arched opening and it didn't look right with the rectangular surround. I've been using my open fireplace for years, trying to coax some heat out of it to no avail, and I now recommend putting in an insert to anyone with a fireplace. Just read this forum for tips, and do it right. Don't take any shortcuts! Now I just wish those half kettles weren't so expensive ($80) It would sure dress it up. Anyone know of a good quality $30 half kettle? Also, whats the best material to get a hearth rug in?

 

[MrGriz]

Congratulations on the new install! Why is it that the 1/2 kettle is still the full price ;-)