Saw a Seton 130k boiler for sale locally with storage tank, pumps, etc... I've got a friend of the family looking at gasification boilers, just wondered what the general opinion was on them? Should I recommend it to him?
Seton boilers? What's the general consensus?
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Seton is not a True Gasification boiler, so if that is what they are stuck on , you can rule the Seton out..As far as the overall design, I love them, like any other boiler it's important that they are set up Correctly, drafted, storage etc..having read about and experienced a few different designs, I am sold on the Seton design. The refractory really is what makes the design IMO..
maple1
Minister of Fire
I think there might be better choices out there, but it might come down to a preference thing.
Have had no experience with one though.
Have had no experience with one though.
I have a Seton 130, had it for about 7 years now. IMO, there are WAY better boilers out there. And yes, it is NOT a true gasification boiler. That said, it has worked OK for me ONLY after adding storage. Without storage they are creosote monsters that require a LOT of cleaning, at least once or twice a season to keep the tubes halfway efficient. People have had trouble with the skins rotting thru on them also. Mine are mostly OK yet, but the top is getting some small pinholes rusting thru. One thing I do like about it is that it will take a big piece of wood, over 2 feet long and over a foot wide. But as Genecop said, if you want a true gasser, you need to look elsewhere.
Pat
Pat
I agree with Pat. What the mfg. might tell you and what actually works are different animals.
First, don't burn green wood...they tend to creosote up enough without it. There is a series of pics on this site where I had to take the sides off to get to the creosote buildup and along the way I replace the sides, back and insulation...what fun.
2nd, I didn't add the extra storage...was told you didn't need it...you do.
3rd, the skins...we upgrades to SS after a few years...much better.
We have since upgraded to the GARN wood/electric, offset with a solar array to compensate for when we use the electric.
If anyone is looking for a large Seton for parts (the basic unit still looks okay, all the electric controls will need to be replaced), give Scotty a ring.
First, don't burn green wood...they tend to creosote up enough without it. There is a series of pics on this site where I had to take the sides off to get to the creosote buildup and along the way I replace the sides, back and insulation...what fun.
2nd, I didn't add the extra storage...was told you didn't need it...you do.
3rd, the skins...we upgrades to SS after a few years...much better.
We have since upgraded to the GARN wood/electric, offset with a solar array to compensate for when we use the electric.
If anyone is looking for a large Seton for parts (the basic unit still looks okay, all the electric controls will need to be replaced), give Scotty a ring.
Ialso have a season knock off an Adobe that could be had real cheap. I also have a 1000 gallon storage tank and heat exchanger
Scotty, I remember those pics....nasty indeed. A few weeks ago I went out to start my annual cleaning on the Seton, a job I dread that usually takes about 2 hours. I cut the skin on the side panel last year so that I could access the tubes and especially the bottom of the unit below the tubes. So I go out and take this small side panel off and couldn't believe my eyes.... the tubes were almost completely clean !! The tubes only had a few places with a little lose and peeling dried soot. None of the shiny hard creosote build-up that is a SOB to get off normally. I have no idea what made the difference, but what a pleasant surprise. I was done cleaning it out in 15 minutes. The only thing I can think of is that at the end of the season last spring I burnt some large pieces of cardboard, and that stuff burns very HOT, but it still seems hard to believe that could have got rid of the creosote that normally coats those tubes. I definitely do not get anywhere near the build-up on the tubes I used to before I added storage, but there is always some that needs to be scraped off. This year...NONE. Maybe there's hope for the 'ole Seton yet...LOL
Pat
Pat
Ours is the big Seton...Keep it in your files...I can always put in on a pallet and ship it to you...cheap...might even be able to break it down come summer for an easier load/storage.
Yes I know this is old. Beat me up if you have to. I just have to chime in here. Some have marketed the Seton design poorly. If you want a little box that you throw wood into once a day or so, this is not it. If you want something simple and reliable, here it is. I own a Greenwood 100, similar to a Seton 90. The guy I bought it from said it was awful. The web is full of reports of these being creosote monsters and all sorts of bad stuff.
Given my experience, I can understand their position, but I disagree.
I bought my boiler on strong recommendation by a close friend who has been heating a monstrous uninsulated Victorian with his mid size Seton, which he purchased new in the early 2000s. It's pretty much like trying to heat the great outdoors. In his case, he made an accurate measurement of how much energy was needed and made his purchase accordingly. The boiler keeps the house comfortable and has been very efficient. After running it for about a decade he had the chimney swept and removed about 20 gallons of ash from it.
I first installed mine in a 1300 sq. ft. cape and it was GOOD but not GREAT. When I first obtained it I planned to install storage and I expected to have less than stellar results. My heat load was only about 25kBTU/hr on average, so the boiler was clearly oversize. I used a timer for a "burn in" period where I would hold the air door open for at least an hour or so, which I would adjust according to which type of wood I was using, and then it was on-demand from that point on. If at any point the heating water went above a certain temperature the circulators would run to dump heat into the house regardless of the state of the thermostats. This resulted in frequent idling, which resulted in condensate puddles on the floor and the inevitable rusting of the flue connector, as well as glass hard creosote build up on the heat exchanger pipes. None of this surprised me.
Once I installed storage (550 gallon tank from American Solartechnics) I began heating with wood year round. No more condensate. I brushed out my connector from time to time and tested the residue with a torch, and it was seldom combustible. Cleaning the upper part of the heat exchanger was accomplished bu running a chimney brush in there while refueling about once a week. Each season I gave it a thorough brushing and easily removed the dried flaky creosote from the heat exchanger, then pulled the flue connector off and vacuumed out the debris from around the vent connector in the back of the stove. Not all that daunting of a task. The boiler was run on a timer still, but at a much extended time. I still had an aquastat turn the circulators on to dump heat if the water temperature rose above 175°F, as a means to protect the liner of my storage tank. Generally I had the timer set for about 4-1/2 to 6 hours, and I would usually throw a couple additional logs on during this time. Mild winter days would require 2 burns, cold windy days would require up to 3 but no more. During the summer I had a fire about every 5-6 days for domestic hot water and the hot tub (which ran year-round). Aside from overtemperature dumps, the heating system was on demand, drawing heat from the storage as needed per calls from the thermostats.
This is NOT an on-demand boiler by itself unless you have a large heat load, in which case you'll need to supplement for high demand days. It runs best on a long uninterrupted burn. Doing that, you can burn just about anything flammable in there, but moderate moisture content hardwood seems to be ideal. I have heated with green softwood and hardwood with no notable flammables in the flue connector.
Given my experience, I can understand their position, but I disagree.
I bought my boiler on strong recommendation by a close friend who has been heating a monstrous uninsulated Victorian with his mid size Seton, which he purchased new in the early 2000s. It's pretty much like trying to heat the great outdoors. In his case, he made an accurate measurement of how much energy was needed and made his purchase accordingly. The boiler keeps the house comfortable and has been very efficient. After running it for about a decade he had the chimney swept and removed about 20 gallons of ash from it.
I first installed mine in a 1300 sq. ft. cape and it was GOOD but not GREAT. When I first obtained it I planned to install storage and I expected to have less than stellar results. My heat load was only about 25kBTU/hr on average, so the boiler was clearly oversize. I used a timer for a "burn in" period where I would hold the air door open for at least an hour or so, which I would adjust according to which type of wood I was using, and then it was on-demand from that point on. If at any point the heating water went above a certain temperature the circulators would run to dump heat into the house regardless of the state of the thermostats. This resulted in frequent idling, which resulted in condensate puddles on the floor and the inevitable rusting of the flue connector, as well as glass hard creosote build up on the heat exchanger pipes. None of this surprised me.
Once I installed storage (550 gallon tank from American Solartechnics) I began heating with wood year round. No more condensate. I brushed out my connector from time to time and tested the residue with a torch, and it was seldom combustible. Cleaning the upper part of the heat exchanger was accomplished bu running a chimney brush in there while refueling about once a week. Each season I gave it a thorough brushing and easily removed the dried flaky creosote from the heat exchanger, then pulled the flue connector off and vacuumed out the debris from around the vent connector in the back of the stove. Not all that daunting of a task. The boiler was run on a timer still, but at a much extended time. I still had an aquastat turn the circulators on to dump heat if the water temperature rose above 175°F, as a means to protect the liner of my storage tank. Generally I had the timer set for about 4-1/2 to 6 hours, and I would usually throw a couple additional logs on during this time. Mild winter days would require 2 burns, cold windy days would require up to 3 but no more. During the summer I had a fire about every 5-6 days for domestic hot water and the hot tub (which ran year-round). Aside from overtemperature dumps, the heating system was on demand, drawing heat from the storage as needed per calls from the thermostats.
This is NOT an on-demand boiler by itself unless you have a large heat load, in which case you'll need to supplement for high demand days. It runs best on a long uninterrupted burn. Doing that, you can burn just about anything flammable in there, but moderate moisture content hardwood seems to be ideal. I have heated with green softwood and hardwood with no notable flammables in the flue connector.
I also run the Greenwood 100, it’s a beast that produces tons of hot water . It has been heating my home for 4 years , we are well insulated and over 3200 SQ Ft of heated space...
I think I got a little lucky during the design phase of my install...as mentioned these stoves don’t want to idol, they want to run wide open very hot. I think storage is a must even if only a 100 gallons, I run with a buffer tank that is central to my oil fired boiler and the Greenwood...
What I like best about the Greenwood is the non processing nature of what it will burn...When up to temperature ( 2000 Deg or so) she will burn anything I can lift and fit through the door...I would consider the Greenwood if I was doing it again, or maybe the Switzer or Garn....
I think I got a little lucky during the design phase of my install...as mentioned these stoves don’t want to idol, they want to run wide open very hot. I think storage is a must even if only a 100 gallons, I run with a buffer tank that is central to my oil fired boiler and the Greenwood...
What I like best about the Greenwood is the non processing nature of what it will burn...When up to temperature ( 2000 Deg or so) she will burn anything I can lift and fit through the door...I would consider the Greenwood if I was doing it again, or maybe the Switzer or Garn....
I have a Seton knock off unit lawn ornament that worked ok if you could keep it clean. I also have a 1000 gallon storage tank. Been through three boilers now. Guess its propane for me now. Loved cutting and burning wood can't keep up with the expense. The boiler could be had real cheap for a DIY project.
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