Single Wide Trailer - Want to heat water and forced air furnace from outside

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Zodiac_Speaking

New Member
Jan 3, 2023
11
Hickory, NC
I think the title pretty much says it all. About a 950 sq ft mobile home. Hickory, NC. We get some cold snaps during winter but it generally stays pretty mild. I do not want to put a wood stove / fireplace inside the trailer. I don't have the space for it and I do not want to cut holes in the ceiling or walls.
I'd rather avoid that altogether and fashion an outside the home furnace / boiler / (whatever) to not only heat my water tank but to also heat the space. Since it's a single wide trailer there is only one main duct running the length of the trailer.

2) We live way out in the sticks and have no neighbors. Home brewed engineering will not be a problem. I just really have no idea or clue where to start. In theory it should be a pretty simple setup but I'm a bit overwhelmed. Help?? Thanks.

3)Ps.... no, I'm not the Zodiac. I was born in 72'. Too young. It's just a unique username. :) compared to billybob1879545
 
I found these links on youtube and it looks promising but I'm having trouble putting everything together in my mind where the lightbulb comes on and I say "I've got this."

Forced air heat exchanger link >

Heat plate exchanger for the hot water. >

For the life of me I cannot figure out how to put this all together mentally to make it all work. Last, a link to a video of what I'm leaning towards doing / burn barrel inside a housing > although this guy is using waste oil instead of wood...... >

I have the freedom to "rig" anything I want where I live. Please help me put all the pieces of the puzzle together. Thank you.
 
Although I possess rudimentary welding skills, and own a MIG welder and a plasma cutter, I would be very hesitant to build wood boiler myself. I would do it if my life depended on it, but otherwise I think I’d say, “No, thanks.”
I have a gasifier wood boiler (Switzer) and heat close to 4,000 square feet with it. (Some of my ceilings are quite high, peaking at 20’, so the cubic feet would be large.) It heats my floor (radiant in-floor heating), my domestic hot water, and I have a water to air heat exchanger in my forced air furnace. I love my boiler for my setup.
With that being said, I think if you are set on a boiler, you’d be better off finding a used or new factory built unit. The water to air heat exchanger in the forced air furnace is the easy part.
 
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One issue is any boiler or furnace heating such a small area is going to be oversized with a firebox large enough to burn long enough to prevent running outside to maintain it constantly. That small of an area takes a very small fire that needs to be tended often.

Anywhere in the US requires NFPA-211 Standard as a minimum to be followed burning any solid fuel.

A hot air furnace requires a return air duct from the space heated by the positive pressure hot air ducts. Simply blowing hot air into the building will not work. The return air balances the pressure letting the hot air circulate without pressurizing the building forcing the hot air out.

A boiler circulating hot water to this small area needs to dump heat somewhere when not calling for heat with more waste than heat used. It would only be efficient heating 2 homes this size or more, in a northern climate.

Stoves made for this purpose (mobile home certified) can only be used inside with an outside air intake. They take up a 4x4 foot area, but are the most efficient and tended easily indoors. A propane or mini-split system should be considered for the minimal heat you need.
 
950SF is just to small for a wood boiler investment even if your wood is so called free.

In my opinion, an air source heat pump will do the the trick "heating" AND "cooling"
Assuming you are connected to the electrical grid

The cooling option is probably much more imprtant then the heating option
 
Build a little attached porch onto the side of the house and put an inexpensive wood stove in it to heat the house, if you are intent on wood heat...not sure what's gonna keep your water lines from freezing though...
 
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Build a little attached porch onto the side of the house and put an inexpensive wood stove in it to heat the house, if you are intent on wood heat...not sure what's gonna keep your water lines from freezing though...
This is what I'm talking about. I have thought about putting a little cement pad out back and converting one of those 55 gallon barrels into a wood burning stove and ordering the face plate stove kit, etc..... then constructing some sort of housing for it to draw the warm air out of the housing into the home for heat.

I get the feeling I'm getting a lot of push back here on this forum though - even though I linked 3 videos. Don't get me wrong, this site is great but I'm getting the feeling this a "how to do it right" kinda site and I'm looking for a "how to redneck it up and make it work period" site.....

Like I said, I have no neighbors and no inspectors to please and I'm never selling this property. The wood would be "free" / there's so much wood around here people literally give it away. Yes, I concede it will cost me gas $$ and my time to go and get it, split it, (possibly), cut it, etc.... but I don't mind doing all that and in NC climate, I certainly wouldn't mind tending to the fire twice a day. I'd love it.
 
This is what I'm talking about. I have thought about putting a little cement pad out back and converting one of those 55 gallon barrels into a wood burning stove and ordering the face plate stove kit, etc..... then constructing some sort of housing for it to draw the warm air out of the housing into the home for heat.

I get the feeling I'm getting a lot of push back here on this forum though - even though I linked 3 videos. Don't get me wrong, this site is great but I'm getting the feeling this a "how to do it right" kinda site and I'm looking for a "how to redneck it up and make it work period" site.....

Like I said, I have no neighbors and no inspectors to please and I'm never selling this property. The wood would be "free" / there's so much wood around here people literally give it away. Yes, I concede it will cost me gas $$ and my time to go and get it, split it, (possibly), cut it, etc.... but I don't mind doing all that and in NC climate, I certainly wouldn't mind tending to the fire twice a day. I'd love it.
I'd try to find a used wood stove on Craigslist. I know at least 4 people who have found free or at least very cheap quality used stoves. Put that sucker in a small lean- to off the house, and install a stainless steel pipe "loop" and use water to move the heat inside through copper pipe. Insulate the copper until it goes into the house into whatever you are using as a radiator. Maybe even cut a hole in the side of the house and install a closable register to blow some of the stoves heat into the house, assuming you close in the lean-to.

A used stoves is going to be a much better option than a barrel, and may be cheaper than buying a set of the hardware for a burn barrel.
 
This is what I'm talking about. I have thought about putting a little cement pad out back and converting one of those 55 gallon barrels into a wood burning stove and ordering the face plate stove kit, etc..... then constructing some sort of housing for it to draw the warm air out of the housing into the home for heat.

I get the feeling I'm getting a lot of push back here on this forum though - even though I linked 3 videos. Don't get me wrong, this site is great but I'm getting the feeling this a "how to do it right" kinda site and I'm looking for a "how to redneck it up and make it work period" site.....

Like I said, I have no neighbors and no inspectors to please and I'm never selling this property. The wood would be "free" / there's so much wood around here people literally give it away. Yes, I concede it will cost me gas $$ and my time to go and get it, split it, (possibly), cut it, etc.... but I don't mind doing all that and in NC climate, I certainly wouldn't mind tending to the fire twice a day. I'd love it.
Just said that because everything you proposed is going to be more money or more work than just buying a used wood boiler and being done with it...never said you are going to burn the place down, or kill yourself in the process, but yup, I was thinking it.
 
This is what I'm talking about. I have thought about putting a little cement pad out back and converting one of those 55 gallon barrels into a wood burning stove and ordering the face plate stove kit, etc..... then constructing some sort of housing for it to draw the warm air out of the housing into the home for heat.

I get the feeling I'm getting a lot of push back here on this forum though - even though I linked 3 videos. Don't get me wrong, this site is great but I'm getting the feeling this a "how to do it right" kinda site and I'm looking for a "how to redneck it up and make it work period" site.....

Like I said, I have no neighbors and no inspectors to please and I'm never selling this property. The wood would be "free" / there's so much wood around here people literally give it away. Yes, I concede it will cost me gas $$ and my time to go and get it, split it, (possibly), cut it, etc.... but I don't mind doing all that and in NC climate, I certainly wouldn't mind tending to the fire twice a day. I'd love it.
Do it right or redneck it up is an easy decision, just ask Robert. Oh never mind, he died in the fire, true story. He dun it just about exactly how you described your idea while we (not people here but those local to us) advised otherwise . Yeah folks on here are not so quick to give bad advice, it's a good thing.
 
Just said that because everything you proposed is going to be more money or more work than just buying a used wood boiler and being done with it...never said you are going to burn the place down, or kill yourself in the process, but yup, I was thinking it.
Eh? I liked your idea. It would be pretty easy for me to enclose the front deck into a 'mud room' of sorts..... Wood stove could go there easily. I will look into the buying a used wood boiler and being done with it...

I might just cave and give up the space and put a wood stove off to the side wall. I assume I can vent it out the side wall instead of up the ceiling. I'm 99% sure I could. (physics)
 
Do it right or redneck it up is an easy decision, just ask Robert. Oh never mind, he died in the fire, true story. He dun it just about exactly how you described your idea while we (not people here but those local to us) advised otherwise . Yeah folks on here are not so quick to give bad advice, it's a good thing.
Fair point. I thought this would be a fairly easy project and *I AM LEARNING* that it's not quite that simple.

Reminds me of a few months back when I was on a laser forum asking the question > "How can I start a brush fire with a laser from a distance of about 10 feet" ...... Talk about getting the cold shoulder. Lol. *NO ONE* wanted to help me because I didn't know what I didn't know. Long story short, I persisted on my own and did a ton of research on my own and finally understood *WHY* no one wanted to help me. The laser itself really wasn't the problem as you can order it right off of Amazon for $60. - The problem was the laser diode itself and that China gets away with shipping these lasers to us (In the USA) because they just slap a fake label on the laser and call it a day. If the consumer blinds himself , that's not their problem. Anyway, I figured out the actual power was such that if it were to accidentally hit a metal or reflective object and that beam came back into my eye - it would send a "pain" signal to my brain ~ my brain would respond by telling my body to close my eyelid to block the source of the pain ~ and all of that takes about 2/100ths of a second to happen.... and unfortunately, that's too slow. The very instant that laser beam comes back into your eye, you're blind. Forever. It's not going to get better in a few weeks. It's cooked.

Once I realized that, I spent $120 on the correct glasses. I'm honestly more afraid of that laser than I am my loaded firearms. In the end, I was able to accomplish setting a brush pile ablaze with a handheld laser at 10 feet. ~ I will not get into specifics for the same reason the "laser people" wouldn't help me in the first place. All I can say is it is extremely satisfying to light a brush fire that way.
 
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My person vote get a small woodstove inside. I think you said you don't want to cut holes in the wall or ceiling? I think no matter what setup you do you'll have to cut holes either to get heat in or get the smoke out
 
My person vote get a small woodstove inside. I think you said you don't want to cut holes in the wall or ceiling? I think no matter what setup you do you'll have to cut holes either to get heat in or get th

My person vote get a small woodstove inside. I think you said you don't want to cut holes in the wall or ceiling? I think no matter what setup you do you'll have to cut holes either to get heat in or get the smoke out
This is exactly what I done back when we were a family of 5 in my single wide. I took my sliding glass door out and built a 6x8 room on the covered porch and put a small Englander wood stove in it. It was a 13. I am not giving you any push back what so ever just merely something to watch for and mitigate because I am in Western NC and we grew up making things work and it is deeply ingrained in us hillbillies to fix it and make it work. I seen someone do as you are suggesting and while I'm not opposed to this, here is what happened. I am a Vol. Fire fighter btw. We went to a structure fire of a single wide. It's been long ago so I don't remember the particulars. Some how a wood stove was set up on the out side with an enclosure around it. It had a fan blowing air into the duct work. The stove was set several feet from the structure. What happens exactly I dont remember but an ember or overfire or something caused the wall where the duct work entered to catch fire. While we saved it, there was extensive damage to that wall. I would want the enclosure to be completely sealed off from the door. I wonder looking back if that's what happened, opened the door for a reload and an ember got into the duct work. Don't know if that was your idea or not but seems just heating water and using an exchanger to hear the home with the water would be best.
 
What you’re taking as push back from others is physics and why your ideas will not work, are not efficient and unnecessary. The videos are not relevant to what you need.

A boiler produces too much heat for the space being heated, and your outdoor temperatures. Setting it outside would have to be large enough to not require tending every couple hours, necessitating you to go outside constantly. The firebox would need to be tiny to heat such a small area. A boiler large enough to burn longer without running outside will heat far more hot water than you need. It will be dumping the hot water you are wasting time and fuel to heat on the ground. If outdoor temperatures go below freezing, a glycol mix is needed which would need replacing after dumping the hot fluid before pressure build up. Boilers have to have a temperature and pressure relief valve to release the pressure before exploding. Boilers in homes have many zones with pumps directing the hot water where needed. When no heat is required, it must be circulated to a garage, or other area to prevent the relief valve from opening, dumping boiling water and refilling with cold. A waste of fuel. A boiler the size of a bread box is what you need, filled every hour or so. Not happening.

A furnace needs to be inside the structure. A mobile home furnace heats indoor air, pushes it through ducts, and cooled air is returned to be reheated. You can’t push hot air into a sealed box without taking out as much air as pushing in. It will pressurize the box, pushing the hot air out where it can. Not much hot air will enter the box when very little is leaking out. A waste of fuel outside, with challenges to insulate the furnace and ducts outside, insulating both a hot air supply, and return air. This is why hot water is used outside moving heat inside. You would need to cut much more wall out for ductwork compared to a 12 inch opening to vent a stove.

You need something like 30,000 btu to heat, and maybe 10 or 15,000 btu to maintain. This is just within wood heating range for a small stove radiating into the structure. A water coil on the back of stove can heat water in a tank like the plate heat exchanger video. Set up correctly it can circulate without the need for a pump, but a circulation pump helps drastically.

Stoves in mobile homes must be mobile home certified for reasons other than being legal. They use outside air, (the smaller area you are heating depletes breathing oxygen levels - the stove is using indoor air, exhausting it outside) and have closer clearances to save space. Certified stoves use convection to heat the air, instead of radiation that sets things around it on fire. You don’t have that kind of space. A 4x4 foot area is required, and you tend it without going outside.

It doesn’t matter if you follow laws in place that actually DO pertain to you, the laws of physics will determine if it works. Safe clearances have been tested, and are given without the need for you to test them. They are given in the stove manual, and NFPA-211 we all strongly suggest you follow was started in 1896 for a reason. It is updated every 3 years, and older publications are available free on line. That will prevent you from burning your home down. Some of us here have been burning in our stoves before you were born, have tried many things, and are speaking from experience.

No matter what you do, the wood needs to be dried first. This takes time. Start with getting a moisture meter. Cut, split, stack and top cover for months to years before burning. No matter what you use, you need to dry the fuel before it will work.
 
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There is a guy in my town who has his wood furnace outside his house.
It is a bit lower than his floor and about 30 ft from his house.He has two big pipes going to the crawlspace under his floor.The stove is in a bit of an enclosure with the face of the furnace exposed under a roof.He said he found it the best to pull the cold air to the stove with a fan,the warm air moves on it's own by pulling the cold air to the furnace.
I also saw a shop with their wood furnace outside next to the wall with the hot air pushed into the shop through the wall.
 
Those outdoor forced air wood furnaces were popular around here for couple/few years...didn't take to long for them to disappear though...seems like they didn't work out too well for most people. I don't think there is even a dealer around for them anymore.
 
My person vote get a small woodstove inside. I think you said you don't want to cut holes in the wall or ceiling? I think no matter what setup you do you'll have to cut holes either to get heat in or get the smoke out
You are correct. It is an either or situation. My original idea was to cut a small, duct sized hole into the brick skirting we have and get in that way.

I think I failed to mention that the trailer is set onto / (not really set but you know what I mean) / a real brick skirting. I'll see if I can attach a photo. Yes, I know it's not really "set" on the brick skirt. I'm not entirely sure what our issue is with this trailer but I do know that we got a statement or projection of what our electric bill will be for this month and it is over $300 and that is not only unacceptable but absurd.

Contrast that to the summer time and the highest bill we ever had in the summer was about $120 which seems (to me at least) much more reasonable. We've only lived here for 1 year and are still working out the kinks. One of the kinks was we knew from day 1 that it needed a new vapor barrier put in and that will be done hopefully next week. (Should have already been done but that's another story)

Bottom line: I am going to have to crawl up under there and see what the heck is going on in there...... and.... I really, really, *REALLY* don't want to do that. They guy doing the vapor barrier is a friend of the family and knows what he's doing so he's going to remove all the old "crud" and stuff that's under there and put down the new barrier. Once that is down, I'll feel slightly better about getting under there and taking a look around. As some of you may know, in NC we just had a tremendous cold snap where it stayed about 15 degrees for about 3 solid days. That's plenty of time for pipes to burst, etc. I know some of you more northern state people will laugh at 3 days of 15 degree weather but here in NC, that's virtually unheard of.

I was a little happy about that cold snap because it really put my "well house" idea to the test and we passed that test with flying colors. The leading theory with well houses (and yes, our water bladder tank is inside it) is to use a fake plastic rock with insulation. Well, the going price for the size I needed was about $700 and that was absolutely not happening. I flat out refused to spend that kind of money on a fake rock. I racked my brain all summer long and came up with a "Little Tike" play house and lined the walls with 1/4 inch Styrofoam, wrapped the bladder tank in one of those insulating blankets and then stuffed the remaining empty space with R-19 regular insulation.

Grand total for all materials = $140. Playhouse housing and brick skirting shown.

Untitled-4.jpg Grass_After.png
 
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@Zodiac_Speaking I like your well house. Is this your first time living in a trailer? I lived in one for a while in Southern Indiana and sitting on the couch your hair would blow in the breeze even when the windows were closed. I'm assuming that's why your utility bills are so high. Very drafty and horrible insulation. Heattape pipe wrap was big to fight freezing pipes down there. My trailer was more expensive for utilities (and this was 14yrs ago) then our current 3k sqft 100yr old house is now. Woodstove help tremendously with wintertime bills. I think a well installed mobil home rated woodstove will fix alot of your problems.
 
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Very creative on the well insulation
 
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We hit -deg over here in the mountains with single digits and negatives ever night. Frost line is normally 18" and many peoples water froze in the ground. My mother-in-law has a 55gal drum over her well and it is completely lined and wrapped with fiberglass insulation. Hey, we make things work. It actually saved the well head when a tree fell on it crushing the old drum but not hurting the well. My trailer was not super drafty but it didn't have insulated windows. That little nc13 stove kept it nice and cozy. Made much less creasote with the class a insulated than my current masonry chimney with a 30nc. I tiled the floor and halfway up the walls with the stove also setting on a granite slab that was leftover counter top from a friend. My nc30 sets on it now in my basement. It made a nice mud/entrance room with all the easy to clean tile.
 
I lived in a double wide for 12 years,back when oil was affordable.
Never bothered with a wood stove,had R12 skirting.I cut a hole in the heat duct for under the trailer and never had frozen pipes,even during a -56C cold spell. At those temps the old windows never had an opening to look out of. Everytime the furnace shut off you kinda held your breath hopping it would start again. 1983-1996 I would bank up the shirting with snow when we had any.
 
@Zodiac_Speaking I like your well house. Is this your first time living in a trailer? I lived in one for a while in Southern Indiana and sitting on the couch your hair would blow in the breeze even when the windows were closed. I'm assuming that's why your utility bills are so high. Very drafty and horrible insulation. Heattape pipe wrap was big to fight freezing pipes down there. My trailer was more expensive for utilities (and this was 14yrs ago) then our current 3k sqft 100yr old house is now. Woodstove help tremendously with wintertime bills. I think a well installed mobil home rated woodstove will fix alot of your problems.
Yes, first time living in a trailer. I didn't even want to come look at it because it was a trailer and not a house. But from the front porch this is the view and I knew immediately, I had to have this spot.

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