Something else for Dutchwest owners to look forward to

[bsa0021]

For the past year, I have been talking on this forum about how fragile DW stoves are but I did't think it would go this far or this soon. You can't really see in my picture (cheap camera) but I have 2 cracks in the damper shelf (one on each corner) visable from the top of the shelf. I'm no welder, but I don't believe that cast can be repaired. I was hoping to get a couple more years out of this stove before I sold it but now it is useless. It a good thing I put an insert in this year. Terrible stove.

 

[ecocavalier02]

Yet just one more excuse why this is it for me. This stove has made my wife think im crazy. Looking forward to getting a blaze king. Good luck to those of you that have this stove.

 

[Hanko]

Over fire any stove many times as Im pretty sure thats what has been done to this stove and you will get similar results.

 

[ecocavalier02]

To many people having problems with this stove is just one way to say that it may have been because of over firing. Who knows. There is definitely something wrong in the design of this frekin thing for all the problems people have been having. especially when people who have been burning for many years and still have problems. i've been able to get this stove to work work correctly but it takes 20 to 45 minutes of babysitting after dampering down to do so. something just isnt right. nor do i have the patience anymore which is why i shut it down completely. waiting till next year to get the blazeking. Now my wood supply will be 3 years split and dried which is perfect for the blaze king. i won't even feel somewhat sad to see this thing go. It's put me thru hell.

 

[Hanko]

I appreciate your frustration eco, and i would feel like you if I were dealing with what you are, but I and other folks I know, family and friends have had nothing but good results with ours. Now maybe in might go to crap in a few years, but I keep an eye on it and I have noticed nothing as to what you and others are reporting.

 

[rkymtnoffgrid]

There must be a ton of people with these stoves, I know I'ts infurating just trying to properly fire the darn thing, but how many others also have these type of issues too? I'd be willing to bet the vast majority of the owners of these stoves don't consistently get the secondary combustion lit off in a fashion thats stable and hot. Like my stove, they problabily think the smoldering, smoking, belching, and low stove temps is normal when the bypass is closed and Its on a "slow" burn. If the majority of the owners of these stoves would actually fire these stoves properly with I bet the reliablily issues concerning the fountain and other internal refractory parts would be 10-fold what they are now. I have never been able to use my stove in a fashion that puts that much heat through the secondary combustion chamber as such, perhaps it will last longer. So, here is my question, it just the dw, or do all the downdraft designs have these reliabilty issues, what about the other VC "everburn" designs...do they have all the same issues as these dws?

 

[Hanko]

Im getting tired of these DW bashing threads. At 3:30 this after noon, (its now 6:30 in michigan) I put 3 splits as everyone calls them, I grabbed the camera and here is what I have 500 stove top. and still a good secondary burn. The 1500 ft shop is 74, was 66 and after the last load at 6 am. You guys got something screwed up in your system, because Ive never got anything but outstanding service from mine.

 

[Hanko]

heres the other photo

 

[bsa0021]

I'm not sure what created the cracks in my stove but I know I never overfire the stove if you consider an overfire as glowing cast iron. I may have gotten the stove hotter than I would like at times, but that was due to the stove running away when I was home. The big question is did it ever go into hyperfire when I wasn't home???
I do know that when I compare my operating procedures to others on this site (some w/ videos) I didn't run my stove nearly as hot as the others. I did use this stove as my only heat source for 4 years in a 1400 sq ft. house. I don't know if others posted here are doing the same. I'm sure others are checking their stoves as closely as I am (I hope). My 1 year old fountain has a crack between the two exit passage ways and the front seam is separating as well. Is anyone else finding pieces of the fountain on top of the shoe?? That's the first sign of failure. I'd like to know why or what is causing these failures. I was considering the possibility that the cracks in the damper shelf could have been aided by the damper slamming shut at times. I gently close the damper but on occasion when I was cleaning or reloading I'd bump the damper and cause it to slam.
The bottom line (for me) is that as a new wood burner purchasing my first stove 4 years ago I was not given any warning or real direction in operating the stove from the dealer or from VC through their operating manual (my manual even neglected to warn about using caution when cleaning the flue due to the fountain...this was changed in later manuals). I used a magnetic thermometer to guide me. If this stove required special operating procedures (it does) and contained fragile parts (it does ....fountain, shoe all refractory materials) why didn't VC or the dealer warn me. Even if my operating procedures are incorrect (I doubt it) and I replace all the failed parts I will have more money in this than the original cost of the stove since the company screwed me out of my warranty. If I don't scrap this stove I will sell it for parts only and walk away and try not to think about my loss. I just hope down the road that we don't find that the design of ALL EPA stoves are such that they burn hotter than what the fireboxes can handle for years and years of use. I know old pre EPA wood burners that are still running after 20+ years w/o problems but there is another post on this site w/ concerns over PE EPA inserts cracking. A stove that I just purchased this year. Are we sacrificing reliability for emissions??? I hope we can have both.

 

[bsa0021]

Im getting tired of these DW bashing threads. At 3:30 this after noon, (its now 6:30 in michigan) I put 3 splits as everyone calls them, I grabbed the camera and here is what I have 500 stove top. and still a good secondary burn. The 1500 ft shop is 74, was 66 and after the last load at 6 am. You guys got something screwed up in your system, because Ive never got anything but outstanding service from mine.

My stove ran great just not reliable. Eco's not falling apart but burns terrible. If your stove runs so well and has not disintegrated like mine, give everyone more info/pictures. What are your flue temps about 18" up on the pipe? Show use the install. Give us some picture of secondary burn etc.

 

[Hanko]

Glowing cast Iron!!. Geez guy Ive run mine at 900 before and never seen a glow. I would hate to see what temp glowing is. maybe 12 1400 degrees. chit, you could do horse shoes at that temp. Now theres a thought

 

[Hanko]

the photo above is secondary. i thought I explained that. anyway I will take some other photos for you

 

[bsa0021]

Glowing cast Iron!!. Geez guy Ive run mine at 900 before and never seen a glow. I would hate to see what temp glowing is. maybe 12 1400 degrees. chit, you could do horse shoes at that temp. Now theres a thought

Others on this site have commented on the stove glowing red......never mine.

 

[bsa0021]

Glowing cast Iron!!. Geez guy Ive run mine at 900 before and never seen a glow. I would hate to see what temp glowing is. maybe 12 1400 degrees. chit, you could do horse shoes at that temp. Now theres a thought

Others on this site have commented on the stove glowing red......never mine.

I missed 900 the first read. I never hit 900 when it ran away from me. I've always got it to cool off before it exceeded 800 which I thought was way too hot.
And I'm the one with reliablity problems???

 

[Hanko]

I guess you are.

 

[ecocavalier02]

yes hanko but what are your flue temps? my stove wil. read that hot on the stove top but in the flue its down to 4 to 500 internal and sometimes lower and smoke billowing and clogging the chimney with 2 year dried wood. the only time no smoke is when i hear the rumble and temps are always 600 and above except on cool down.

 

[fire_man]

When I researched stoves two years ago I read numerous feedbacks from VC Neverburn owners. Glad I stayed away.

 

[jmichigan]

I feel your pain. We installed our Dutchwest everburn med. cast iron stove last fall so this is our second year of burning our damper is cracked in the same exact spots as yours and is now warped because of the cracks. The gasket on the back wall is hanging down as of yesterday. The whole stove is A PIECE OF CRAP. We called the dealer and had them put in a claim because we are under warranty. I guess we will see what happens. I am sick over it.

 

[ecocavalier02]

i know the feeling of being sick over it. you pay upwards of 2000 dollars and get results like this. im so upset i didnt research this thing when i bought it. but i went on opinion of my brother in law who just throws wood in there and lets it smolder and i did not know a thing about burning a stove at the time. but its a good lesson to learn. i will stand clear away from vermont casting for the rest of my life.

 

[madrone]

I just hope down the road that we don't find that the design of ALL EPA stoves are such that they burn hotter than what the fireboxes can handle for years and years of use. I know old pre EPA wood burners that are still running after 20+ years w/o problems but there is another post on this site w/ concerns over PE EPA inserts cracking. A stove that I just purchased this year. Are we sacrificing reliability for emissions??? I hope we can have both.

My stove is 10 years old and hasn't required much of anything by way of repair and maintenance. New pins for the burn tubes, which are showing no signs of wearing out, and some touch-up on the paint.
i have no experience with the VC, but it sounds like a bad combination of casting issues and a complicated/fragile design. I have no doubt that my steel stove with burn tubes will running for another 10. At worst, it might need new tubes or bricks before then, but at this point, I doubt it.

 

[greythorn3]

you can weld cast, by preheating it and then welding it with a high nickle rod, then slowly cooling it in cycles.

 

[firefighterjake]

i know the feeling of being sick over it. you pay upwards of 2000 dollars and get results like this. im so upset i didnt research this thing when i bought it. but i went on opinion of my brother in law who just throws wood in there and lets it smolder and i did not know a thing about burning a stove at the time. but its a good lesson to learn. i will stand clear away from vermont casting and advice from my brother-in-law, especially his advice to buy stock in Enron for the rest of my life.

I "fixed" your thread.

 

[bsa0021]

I just hope down the road that we don't find that the design of ALL EPA stoves are such that they burn hotter than what the fireboxes can handle for years and years of use. I know old pre EPA wood burners that are still running after 20+ years w/o problems but there is another post on this site w/ concerns over PE EPA inserts cracking. A stove that I just purchased this year. Are we sacrificing reliability for emissions??? I hope we can have both.

My stove is 10 years old and hasn't required much of anything by way of repair and maintenance. New pins for the burn tubes, which are showing no signs of wearing out, and some touch-up on the paint.
i have no experience with the VC, but it sounds like a bad combination of casting issues and a complicated/fragile design. I have no doubt that my steel stove with burn tubes will running for another 10. At worst, it might need new tubes or bricks before then, but at this point, I doubt it.

That's good to hear you haven't had any problems in 10 years. I didn't know EPA stoves have been around that long. It gives me hope that my PE will be ok.