Stove in garage- Hmmm

[hardwood715]

Fire fighter injured reponding to fire at farm



STANFORDVILLE — A fire that started in a wood stove in the garage area of Rocky Reef Farm was brought under control within 20 minutes of fire fighters arriving on the scene.

Though the damage was minimal, one fire fighter was taken to Vassar Brothers Medical Center. The extent of his injuries is unknown.

Fire fighters from Standford responded to the fire at 6906 Route 82 in Stanfordville with assistance from Pine Plains and East Clinton fire departments.


Poughkeepsie Journal Online-2/27

 

[Metal]

Maybe those pesky codes aren't so bad after all?

 

[babalu87]

My neighbor has one in his garage, I wouldnt even know where to begin trying to tell him. Nice manufactured chimney, installation is top notch too.

 

[Highbeam]

I don't know, I weld, grind, and torch metal into fiery pieces in the garage all the time. A stove that causes a fire in the garage may have started the same fire in the house.

 

[begreen]

Perhaps. If one stores gasoline, solvents, paints, 2 cycle mix and a few vehicles in the house, then possibly true.

 

[Eric Johnson]

Well, it's a moot point since it's against code. However, when I had a wood-fired boiler (with an oil backup) in my basement, I also had a 250-gallon oil tank down there, paint, solvents, propane soldering tanks, some gasoline for the saws and my chain saws.

Your typical basement has all those things, except instead of a wood-fired boiler, you've got oil or gas water heaters, clothes dryers, boilers, furnaces and a variety of other things with flames and pilot lights and all kinds of wiring that could short out without notice.

I think it's a rather stupid law, but it is the law.

 

[elkimmeg]

I think it’s a rather stupid law, but it is the law.

Try telling that to the injured firefighter or his familly. He was fighting a fire caused by an illegal stove installation.

I willing to bet no firefighter in that town thinks its a stupid law. There are some codes to protect idiots from themselves and to protect the inocent who had no say in the installation

 

[nshif]

I know my gas fired water heater in my garage has to be 18" ( or maybe 24" ) above the floor. Idea being flammable fumes will fall to the ground. Wouldnt a woodstove mounted in the same way provide the same amount of protection?

 

[Rob From Wisconsin]

Well, it's a moot point since it's against code. However, when I had a wood-fired boiler (with an oil backup) in my basement, I also had a 250-gallon oil tank down there, paint, solvents, propane soldering tanks, some gasoline for the saws and my chain saws.

Your typical basement has all those things, except instead of a wood-fired boiler, you've got oil or gas water heaters, clothes dryers, boilers, furnaces and a variety of other things with flames and pilot lights and all kinds of wiring that could short out without notice.

I think it's a rather stupid law, but it is the law.

Agreed....
My son's friend nearly torched himself & his garage when gas vapors
were ignited by a SPACE HEATER (not a wood stove).
I would like to know how many senseless fires are caused by careless use
of cigarettes or candle mishaps also.
Laws aren't legislated against restricted use of those items....
Lot more fires caused by those items....

 

[Hogwildz]

When I get around to pouring concrete in my garage. I am thinking of adding a wood stove.
BUT, I have a 6 car garage, 3 cars wide x 3 cars deep actually 40 x 40, fairly large. I will close off two front bays for a shop & my bike. Ceiling, wallls etc. And make sure to keep flammables on the other side. Or maybe I'll get a used oil furnace, dunno yet. But as I said I will be enclosing 2 bays for a shop.

 

[saichele]

I know my gas fired water heater in my garage has to be 18" ( or maybe 24" ) above the floor. Idea being flammable fumes will fall to the ground. Wouldnt a woodstove mounted in the same way provide the same amount of protection?

Couple friends had a garage built with a woodstove, and they had to install the stove on a pedestal about 24" above the floor. Inspector signed off on it.

Although I always try to pay attention when I'm dealing with flame, it does seem like any number of things are apt to set a garage on fire, including your basic kero heater, welding, smoking, electrical shorts, and so on.

Steve

 

[Highbeam]

The firefighter was fighting a fire in accordance with his chosen profession. If he fell in and hurt himself I hardly would blame the woodstove that started the fire or the ember that popped out of the firebox in the home. He or she is a professional. We have crack houses that burn down on occasion out here and you can bet firefighters squirt water on those too despite them being caused by illegal activity.

So when does a shop become a garage and then the garage making a woodstove against code?

 

[Jags]

Hmmmm. I am all for safety and laws, and safety should obviously come first, but between the torch, welder, grinder and other assorted spark throwing devices, I find it difficult to believe that my woodstove is "more" dangerous. If anything it would promote air ventilation. Don't want to argue laws, they are what they are, but jeeez, torch, welder, grinder - thats what shops are for (unless your one of the wood working kinda guys %-P )

 

[Metal]

You are usually present when you are torching, welding, grinding, etc. The same isn't true for a wood stove that is burning. The reason more fires aren't started by wood burners in garages is that most people follow codes and don't install them there. It would be interesting to hear the Insurance Company's response on the above noted fire.

 

[Jags]

You are usually present when you are torching, welding, grinding, etc. The same isn't true for a wood stove that is burning. The reason more fires aren't started by wood burners in garages is that most people follow codes and don't install them there. It would be interesting to hear the Insurance Company's response on the above noted fire.

I will agree with that. But (and I may be on the rare side) other than a few smoldering coals, I am always there when a fire is lit as well.

 

[nshif]

And my gas fired water heater fires wheather Im there or not.

 

[Jags]

You are usually present when you are torching, welding, grinding, etc. The same isn't true for a wood stove that is burning. The reason more fires aren't started by wood burners in garages is that most people follow codes and don't install them there. It would be interesting to hear the Insurance Company's response on the above noted fire.

I re-read your response and if we are talking about garages, I would have to agree about the majority following the codes. On the other hand, around me when we are talking about "shops" MOST have some sort of heating method.

 

[laynes69]

There are alot of garages around here that heat with wood. Like Eric Said, I have chainsaws, gas, a Propane Furnace right beside my wood furnace. There is paint cans in the basement and solvents. I try to keep things away from the woodfurnace, but its just like a garage. Our basement is a place where I take things and work on them. In a garage I would think you need a high concentration of fumes to have a fire, maybe I'm wrong. Common sense tells you to store things away from the wood stove, or wherever there is a possibility for heat. I see kerosene space heaters more prone to a fire than a woodstove. As for the firefighter, thats his job to fight fires. They do it everyday and people depend on these people. Despite what people do, you can't point fingers and blame someone for an injury. It wasn't intentional. He was doing his job. They are there to help and save lives.

 

[restorer]

I spent a few hours with a fire marshall discussing heating my shop. The short story is, no wood stove. (period) not negotiable. But a pellet stove with AOK and raised 24 inches meets his standard. I have 1,200 sf, but part looks like a garage. That's 440 sf. I can not put any heating device in there except an explosion proof overhead heater. Now when I take out the 18 ft Overhead door, replace it with a 60 inch OHD and a pair of 48 inch pass through doors (person doors) it's no longer a garage and I can do the same as the other part of the shop. It's interesting to note that the two parts are separated by an 8 ft. OHD.

Plan this summer is to move all volatiles still in their paint safes into a two hour burn room in the corner of the "garage", install the spray booths there. I have two, one 9 X 7 and a 3 x 4. If I vent them out from the garage, and don't add heat I don't have to install a $34,000 make up air supply system. Spent an hour on this alone.

It's amazing to me that we regulate for the most irresponsible and only cripple the ones trying to do the right thing. The dope soaking auto parts in gasoline next to his Natural Gas water heater. When he blows the place up they say how tragic, and my dad did that for years and never had a problem. But if you call the regulators and they come out........ I think you get the point.

Elk, I would really like to know your honest opinion on the right way to heat a garage and wood shop/storage. Don't let the rules stop you, but if you could give someone the best advise, what would that be? Keep in mind we all want to save the most bucks we can.

 

[Roospike]

Elk, I would really like to know your honest opinion on the right way to heat a garage and wood shop/storage. Don’t let the rules stop you, but if you could give someone the best advise, what would that be? Keep in mind we all want to save the most bucks we can.

Lets make an unofficial list: (let all add)

Stove off the floor 24"
Out side air kit supply to the stove
leget stove install like as if it was in a home with leget chimney
Stove in its own space away from everything else
wood supple / other stored outside or contained
no storage around the stove
Combustibles ( paint ect ) other side of shop in its own room or storage cabinet.
All used rags and towels in a fireprotection metal can/bucket with lid
New rags and towels in a cabinet or contained area
no loose insulation (paper backing)
no gas and or other flammables of storage in shop
keep all cloths / jackets / gloves other stored in contained closet / area
Keep floors areas clean of junk well sweeped / espectally woodworking
pull out items away from walls to keep sweeped and or blown out - clean
proper ventilation
no exposed wall framing
keep all papers / notebooks ect kept in drawer or other contained cabinet
no storage boxes of cardboard / wood storage

Just a few off the top of my head that i try to strictly in force in my home shop ................

 

[elkimmeg]

the safest way to heat a garage are
floor radient heat
a zone of Fhw heat or a forced hot water overhead exchanger


the problem with wood stoves they are not sealed combustion chambers. Hey I do plenty of work in my garage just like a lot of folks today I making up 4 cabinet doors.

I have the wood and could get a sh*** kicker stove but I cannot do that what example would that set?

Roo has done a good job to mininize the dangers But as code officials we have to assume that this is not the case at all times.

The point was missed we all agree the injured fire fighter assumes this are part of the job risk But it hurts more when the situation should not have caused the situation.

Let them fight legit fires accidental fires but the stove should have never been there in the first place.
Rvery day we test our faith we drive on roads with other drivers we probably exceed speed limits and arive home safely. that does not mean it will work out that way everytime.

There had to be enough occurance of wood stove fires in gagages that the code had to address this location specifically by name.

Some codes are there to proctect the fools from themselves. If everything was done right you would not need police officers or inspectors

 

[Eric Johnson]

I think it’s a rather stupid law, but it is the law.

Try telling that to the injured firefighter or his familly. He was fighting a fire caused by an illegal stove installation.

I willing to bet no firefighter in that town thinks its a stupid law. There are some codes to protect idiots from themselves and to protect the inocent who had no say in the installation

I don't have to tell the firefighter anything.

My point was simply that I don't see any difference between a garage and a home or basement as a place to put a wood-burning appliance, for the reasons I stated. You can do a moronic installation in any one of the three that might result in a firefighter getting hurt.

But any law--stupid or not--should be obeyed.

 

[Andre B.]

But any law--stupid or not--should be obeyed.

Wrong.

"The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain
occasions, that I wish it to be always kept alive. It will often be
exercised when wrong, but better so than not to be exercised at
all. I like a little rebellion now and then. It is like a storm in the
atmosphere." --Thomas Jefferson

 

[Eric Johnson]

I should have added:

Or be willing to face the consequences. In this case, that would involve a denial of your claim by your insurance company and probably fines/penalties by the municipality.

 

[elkimmeg]

Lets face it by you pointing out the possible dangers in existance is step #1 you will avoid a stupid incident.

We all have days where we should have known better. It is best to limit these days and to learn not to repeat them