Stuck on install - liner issue

[SculptureOfSound]

Hi Guys,

So I've got a bit of an issue. When we bought the house the fireplace was relined with a stainless rectangular liner, 9.75 x 5.75 inches. That liner is insulated.

For my coming insert install I ordered oval duraliner which should fit inside of the old liner no problem. I tested it at the roof and it fit in the original liner just fine.

BUT, then (like issue #5 so far this install, ugh!) I checked it out at the bottom and the original liner was a bit bent/warped - must have been from the install -and the duraliner wouldn't fit. The original liner was mortared in place bent up, so I had to break out the mortar and pound it into shape.

Ok, so that's where I'm at. Duraliner fits in the old liner just fine now. Of course, a *new* issue arose. When I broke out the mortar at the bottom the liner came loose from the mortar at the top. It's still suspended in the chimney (not sure from what - maybe friction from the insulation against the clay tiles?) but I can push it up or down a few inches.

Of course I can't leave the liner loosely suspended like that. If it somehow came full loose it would "fall" onto the duraliner inside of it of causing damage, possibly separation at a joint. Bad!

All of that being said, my options are:

1) Re-mortar in the original liner. Run the duraliner inside of it. I would prefer this method because I've then got an insulated liner inside of an insulated liner, which should be a benefit on my external chimney. Also, should we ever sell the house the fireplace is ready to be used as an open fireplace if preferred. Question is, what do I use to re-mortar this? The original installer used Chamber Tech 2000 but I'd prefer to spring for something cheaper as it's like $80 for a huge tub of the stuff, of which I'd only need a tiny bit.

2) Tear out the original liner and just go with the duraliner.


Would love to hear what you would do and, if option #1, how can I secure the old liner? Maybe something other than mortar for the time being - seeing as that liner isn't really being used. Not sure what code would dictate in this situation.

 

[bholler]

Hi Guys,

So I've got a bit of an issue. When we bought the house the fireplace was relined with a stainless rectangular liner, 9.75 x 5.75 inches. That liner is insulated.

For my coming insert install I ordered oval duraliner which should fit inside of the old liner no problem. I tested it at the roof and it fit in the original liner just fine.

BUT, then (like issue #5 so far this install, ugh!) I checked it out at the bottom and the original liner was a bit bent/warped - must have been from the install -and the duraliner wouldn't fit. The original liner was mortared in place bent up, so I had to break out the mortar and pound it into shape.

Ok, so that's where I'm at. Duraliner fits in the old liner just fine now. Of course, a *new* issue arose. When I broke out the mortar at the bottom the liner came loose from the mortar at the top. It's still suspended in the chimney (not sure from what - maybe friction from the insulation against the clay tiles?) but I can push it up or down a few inches.

Of course I can't leave the liner loosely suspended like that. If it somehow came full loose it would "fall" onto the duraliner inside of it of causing damage, possibly separation at a joint. Bad!

All of that being said, my options are:

1) Re-mortar in the original liner. Run the duraliner inside of it. I would prefer this method because I've then got an insulated liner inside of an insulated liner, which should be a benefit on my external chimney. Also, should we ever sell the house the fireplace is ready to be used as an open fireplace if preferred. Question is, what do I use to re-mortar this? The original installer used Chamber Tech 2000 but I'd prefer to spring for something cheaper as it's like $80 for a huge tub of the stuff, of which I'd only need a tiny bit.

2) Tear out the original liner and just go with the duraliner.


Would love to hear what you would do and, if option #1, how can I secure the old liner? Maybe something other than mortar for the time being - seeing as that liner isn't really being used. Not sure what code would dictate in this situation.

It needs to be suspended from the top.

 

[SculptureOfSound]

Bholler, the original liner was just for open fireplace use. It was cut such that it did not extend out of the clay tiles when it was installed. The clay tile was flush with the crown top and he cut this liner to be flush too, and then mortared it in at the top (mortar mostly between the clay tile and the liner) and bottom.

What can I use to mortar that liner in? Anything other than Chamber Tech 2000?

 

[bholler]

Bholler, the original liner was just for open fireplace use. It was cut such that it did not extend out of the clay tiles when it was installed. The clay tile was flush with the crown top and he cut this liner to be flush too, and then mortared it in at the top (mortar mostly between the clay tile and the liner) and bottom.

What can I use to mortar that liner in? Anything other than Chamber Tech 2000?

Then it was done wrong to start with it should be hung from the top

 

[SculptureOfSound]

Is just using mortar at the top and bottom against code everywhere?

Also, is there any good way to salvage that liner and do you think I could push for a refund or something from the installer? It was installed 2 years ago and barely used (it was also too small for the fireplace opening - it broke that 10:1 ratio - so smoke was an issue.)

 

[kennyp2339]

@bholler - what if the OP anchors the top of the original liner with tap cons to the clay tile, then installs the new liner using the proper anchor plate above the crown?
As long as the old liner isn't going anywhere it shouldn't be a problem right?

 

[bholler]

@bholler - what if the OP anchors the top of the original liner with tap cons to the clay tile, then installs the new liner using the proper anchor plate above the crown?
As long as the old liner isn't going anywhere it shouldn't be a problem right?

Right

 

[fire_man]

Seems like a tight fit to drill and install tap cons in that small liner. I Guess a right angle drill would work good.

 

[bholler]

Is just using mortar at the top and bottom against code everywhere?

Also, is there any good way to salvage that liner and do you think I could push for a refund or something from the installer? It was installed 2 years ago and barely used (it was also too small for the fireplace opening - it broke that 10:1 ratio - so smoke was an issue.)

The only reason it would be against code is code requires you follow manufacturers instructions. And no manufacturer tells you to do that because it doesnt work

 

[bholler]

@bholler - what if the OP anchors the top of the original liner with tap cons to the clay tile, then installs the new liner using the proper anchor plate above the crown?
As long as the old liner isn't going anywhere it shouldn't be a problem right?

That may work fine it may not the best bet would be to pull it up and put a top clamp on.

 

[SculptureOfSound]

Would it be possible some way to top clamp it and also top clamp the duraliner? I can't see how that would work.

If I was going to mortar it in place is there any special mortar I'd need to use? It did seem to hold well with the chamber tech 2000 the installer originally used, id just rather not spend $80+ on a big tub of the stuff (can only find large sizes online)