Tarm warranty for DIY install?

[penfrydd]

First a little background...I put in my own heating system in '92 up until I got to the boiler install. I let a pro do that.

As a result, I learned nothing about all the controls and each service call cost $.

I was hoping to install the Solo 40 myself, but see that their warranty is void unless installed by a pro. They also mention maintenance has to be done by a pro.

I've heard all these positive comments about the folks at Tarm, but this seems to be a way of making it hard to enforce a warranty issue. (I'll admit to being mildly paranoid...)

Anyone with any experience in this area?

Thanks

 

[Bad Wolf]

Huh? I missed that part. The people at Tarm never said a word in all the conversations I had with them. Not sure what has to be done by a pro, it was all very straight forward. Hook the brown wire to terminal "3" etc. I followed their piping layout to a "T". (no pun intended). I also only heard good things about them. The boiler itself is built like a tank. Other than a fan and some relays there are no moving parts.
With the $3,000 I saved doing it myself I coiuld pay for a lot of repairs.

 

[DaveBP]

My Tarm came with a form to fill out for the warranty. It asks for owner's and installer's names and addresses. No license no.
They say the warranty is void if it is installed by other than a professional plumbing and heating contractor AND it must be serviced/inspected every 2 years by same.

I don't see why the guy couldn't just sign off on your work to assure Tarm that the installation is according to code and manufacturer's recommendations.
If you can find one that will do that. That's what I've done on my electrical and plumbing on the house I'm building.

 

[pybyr]

I was going to say the same thing as DaveBP -talk to Tarm and ask if they will be OK if it is checked and signed off on ny someone who is experienced.

I don't know if your location in MA may require a licensed installer or whether it even issues licenses for installers, but in some places, all you need to do to be a "professional" is to call yourself one. I'm not trying to be flip-- it's just in rural areas, that is sometimes how it is.

From what I have seen, although these higher-end wood units are not rocket science, once you get into some of the install details, especially storage and system management (and even the layouts that let you use storage and management), they're way outside the bounds of regular oil or gas boilers, and so I've heard of many, many instances where the "pro" is not as far along the learning curve as an enthusiast homeowner. Again, not trying to slam any pros, or the heating trade in general -- there are some like Joe B or HR who obviously know more about any of this stuff, in both theory and practice, than a roomful of other people -- it's just that gasifiers and their optimal hook-ups seem to still be outside the realm of a lot of mainstream HVAC general experience.

 

[chuck172]

What can go wrong with a boiler. They aren't cast iron, so they won't crack. I have a Tarm and there is no computer on it. Just some gauges, a fan. I guess the combustion chamber can crack. Besides the combustion chamber, what is there that needs to be warranted?

 

[carbon neutral]

What can go wrong with a boiler. They aren't cast iron, so they won't crack. I have a Tarm and there is no computer on it. Just some gauges, a fan. I guess the combustion chamber can crack. Besides the combustion chamber, what is there that needs to be warranted?

The firebox can develop leaks. Usually this happens when the return temperature isn't kept up, the added condensation caused by the cold return temperatures can lead to premature failure in the area of the firebox where the water comes back into the boiler. I heard of one person who had his fire box fail after 6 years use. Tarm did supply the parts to repair the boiler but didn't cover all the labor costs involved. I don't know if the boiler was installed by a professional, it did not have heat storage.

 

[penfrydd]

Naturally, I will be doing most of the install, and having a local "pro" sign off on it. Other than setting the aquastats and knowing something about coordination of the expansion tank between the two systems (new wood, older oil backup), I don't see anything I haven't encountered before.

And I certainly agree that lots of "pros" aren't used to hooking up two systems at once.

I'm comfortable with the Tarm warranty. It's a schedule, just like most products, of reduced coverage over time, depending upon the component, and it seems to me, like one of the above writers, that return water temp is going to be critical to proper care and feeding of the unit.

Thanks for the responses. I'm still a ways from the install, due mostly to the drop in oil prices, and general sloth on my part.

 

[pybyr]

it seems to me, like one of the above writers, that return water temp is going to be critical to proper care and feeding of the unit.

suggestion-- take and mark the date on photos of your initial install once it is all working well, including photos showing what you have installed for your return temp protection, and better still, a photo of a gauge reading that it is what it should. photos, too, dated, of all of the other little details and settings that you were careful to do right and configure properly. Put them in a folder, with a short description of it all so that you will have them to go back to- for yourself, or anyone who may ask, if you need some support or coverage down the road, expecially if a company's management or personnel (or approach to these sorts of issues) change (which can happen sometimes).

Not that I see any sign that Tarm would change for the worse in those ways- it's just that if you wait 'til you need documentation that something was installed and run right from Day 1, then you've missed the opportunity to have that documentation when you need it

 

[jebatty]

Never paid attention, even if it applies, and still would not jump through the pro install/service warranty hoops.

I trust Tarm will be fair under reasonable circumstances. Besides, if my error causes a problem, why should Tarm pay for it? I guess I would sue my alternate personality and hope for a big recovery from the alternate assets.

I have a Browning shotgun, no warranty given whatsoever. Yet Browning stood 100% its fine reputation when I had a problem. As said, I trust Tarm will be fair, and if it elects to stand on the letter of its warranty, I guess I just took the risk and have to assume the responsibility.

Most of us argue for personal responsibility, and the best place to start is to make it personal.

 

[pybyr]

Never paid attention, even if it applies, and still would not jump through the pro install/service warranty hoops.

I trust Tarm will be fair under reasonable circumstances. Besides, if my error causes a problem, why should Tarm pay for it? I guess I would sue my alternate personality and hope for a big recovery from the alternate assets.

I have a Browning shotgun, no warranty given whatsoever. Yet Browning stood 100% its fine reputation when I had a problem. As said, I trust Tarm will be fair, and if it elects to stand on the letter of its warranty, I guess I just took the risk and have to assume the responsibility.

Most of us argue for personal responsibility, and the best place to start is to make it personal.

Standing Ovation on all you said and the thinking behind it! And if you figure out how to find an alternate personality of yourself with heretofore unknown assets, let us in on it

See, however, the other recent thread where some folks are applauding Tarm, while others mention some more rocky points in their past support. I am not looking to bash Tarm-- in fact I applaud them for sticking with the _quality_ wood boiler market in the US even during large portions of the last decade+ when it was probably a completely masochistic effort , and they were pretty much alone in a wilderness where no one except a few thought about coming to the door - it must have been a _really_ grim time to "be them." And I wish them the best for all their future endeavors. But the point behind my suggestion above to "document, document, document" is that most institutions (governments, companies, whatever) go through different phases and ups and downs (just like individuals), and if you are an individual dealing with a company during a phase when they're not as responsive as you'd like, then documentation that you did things right, and that shows that you did it right from Day 1, will be your best friend in helping to encourage a company to also do the right thing.

 

[DenaliChuck]

“document, document, document”

wise advice.

 

[DaveBP]

Most of us argue for personal responsibility, and the best place to start is to make it personal.

Bravo, Jim.

Thanks to Siegenthaler's book and the many kind (and brave!) contributors here on this forum I'm doing my own Tarm/propane storage install. I wouldn't have had the courage to try this otherwise. I am going to pay a pro, however, to inspect and certify my work because my farm insurance requires it. I built my own house and barn and outbuildings starting with a chainsaw and portable sawmill. No pros so far. If it were to burn down for whatever reason and insurance compensation were denied because of some technicality of paperwork I would take THAT very personally.