To buy or not to buy

[pipelayer]

Never owned a wood stove, but my brother does and I love it for the common reasons, including a cheaper source of heat. Seems I spend around $100 per month in the winter to run the furnace (more or less). I can get a cord of wood for anywhere from $150 dry split wood delivered, or free if I want to cut it.

Have the opportunity to buy a Shrader for $125. It's 3 cubic feet firebox. I've only seen pictures, but the owner describes it in good condition, but it needs new firebricks. The only functional issue is that the base was for some reason cut off or removed (two vertical stands). I'm not sure if that's cosmetic of functional.

I know Schrader closed in the 80s or 90s. I know this isn't an EPA certified stove and therefore less efficient.

I live in WA on the edge of the burn ban (about 10 days per year). I don't have the thousands to invest in a new EPA approved wood stove. I'm just on the outside of the ring of where it will be illegal to operate a non-EPA certified stove later this year. So, I'm safe, for now. Within the ring, they do offer a buyback program of $350 or a $1500 credit on a new device... so it seems they offer compensation when they do decide to clamp down on these old devices.

My house is 3000 square feet. It is a two story build. Front room is a living room with 20' vaulted ceiling which leads upstairs or into the main floor (dining room, kitchen, 2 bedrooms, the main living room in the back of the house. Upstairs is a few bedrooms. The heat would probably naturally rise up into the upstairs and some fans would help circulate the heat into the main floor. The vaulted room is likely where I'd place the wood stove.

Our winters are not generally harsh, but we have lost power for a few days at times and it does get cold enough to run the furnace about 6-7 months out of the year, and that is expensive.

I'm fairly determined to buy one... and trying to spend as little as possible. I know I'll need to build a brick an/or tile hearth. Piping for 20-30 feet is going to be very expensive too. I'm fairly handy, but not sure if I'm confident enough to install myself or hire someone. So any advice on the difficulties with installation is appreciated (level of risk, difficulty, etc.).

So, the main question I need to know is whether the missing "legs" is functional or cosmetic. I could just set it on a few decorative flat stones to keep air circulation under the stove if necessary.

 

[begreen]

Pass. It's not legal to install in WA state and this is a fireplace insert, not a freestanding stove. It won't pass inspection. Have you checked with your insurance company? They would not approve either.

If you are going to buy, invest in a decent modern stove. It will save you money by burning less wood and will be able to burn during Phase 1 ban days. A decent new stove can be had for under $1000. And get wood now, split and stacked. It will need the whole season to dry. Don't believe a seller when they say the wood is dry. 90% of the time it is not.

We can help you save a bit, but not at the cost of safety. Don't be penny wise and pound foolish. This is infrastructure containing some very high temps in your house. Do the chimney and stove connection right by the books. If you can tell us more about the house we can better assess the difficulty level. If you are reasonably good with tools and follow directions well you should be able to do this. It might take a helper at some point, but mostly it is not cutting corners and paying attention to code plus the pipe mfg. directions. Hopefully you will save enough to pay for the new stove. How large an area are you heating and what area of WA state are you in?

 

[pipelayer]

Thanks for the information.

To clarify, I live just outside the "red zone" or whatever in Pierce county. Does the burn ban apply statewide, or just in the red zone, or in all of Pierce County? I know the red zone is where the buyback is authorized... but how does the burn ban work?

 

[begreen]

The burn ban is on a county wide basis. Bummer about being just outside the zone. That looks like it would pay for a decent replacement stove.

 

[pipelayer]

Yep, as I understand it the tax credit also expired? So double loss. If I lived a block closer I'd be in the zone, and I should have done this last year... grrrr....

 

[begreen]

How large an area do you want to heat? How tall would the chimney be? Can you run it up straight though the ceiling and up through the roof?

 

[pipelayer]

The entry room is 300 square feet, with a 20' vaulted ceiling. From there, there are various rooms (kitchen, bedrooms, back living room areas). Main floor is partitioned quite badly, but around 1700 sq. ft. This is the only room I could run the chimney pipe up through the roof and I'd likely do it near the middle of the room where the roof is about 15'. From this entry room, there are stairs leading to the 2nd floor, another 1400 sq. ft or so.

There are other possible rooms, but none would allow the heat to move upstairs very efficiently, and all other rooms would require an elbow pipe.

The best room seems to be the entry vaulted ceiling room unless there's reason not to.

 

[Bret Chase]

A hundred a month? before I pulled the monitors out and put a wood stove back in w/ new chimney... I was paying around $150/wk to heat my house.

 

[begreen]

Sounds good. Going straight up with no floor penetrations will save some bucks. The interior stove pipe though should be double-wall for that long a run. Your call though. You'll need a cathedral ceiling support box. Here is a pretty good place for piping - http://woodstovepro.com/

For a stove I would look at the Englander 30-NC. Haunt the local Home Depots. They are moving them out now to make room for garden equipment. Sometimes you can work a deal for a floor model. Also see about getting a 10% off coupon if you are a vet. This stove is a good heater, but one caveat, it needs a well insulated hearth. An alternative would be the Drolet Baltic or better yet the Drolet HT2000 which just needs ember protection for a hearth.

 

[pipelayer]

A hundred a month? before I pulled the monitors out and put a wood stove back in w/ new chimney... I was paying around $150/wk to heat my house.

I don't pay very close attention, but yeah I have a gas furnace and water heater. It's not broken out as to which is which, I just pay it without much thought. But it seems it's about $100 a month more or less. Might be $150 in the peak of winter. About 1/2 in the summer when the furnace is off, so maybe $50-$75 or even $100 a month to heat approximately. Not an exact measure.

I also have several rooms closed off, so that's another factor. I don't use perhaps 1/2 of my house for living at the moment. So when/if I do start using more of the house, that will increase the usage.

Gas prices fluctuate of course. Cheap now, but what if it goes higher or is unavailable from time to time.

Wood is much cheaper, but then there's the outlay of the initial costs. And the effort.

 

[begreen]

If you have natural gas that's a pretty cheap way to heat.

 

[Bret Chase]

I don't pay very close attention, but yeah I have a gas furnace and water heater. It's not broken out as to which is which, I just pay it without much thought. But it seems it's about $100 a month more or less. Might be $150 in the peak of winter. About 1/2 in the summer when the furnace is off, so maybe $50-$75 or even $100 a month to heat approximately. Not an exact measure.

I also have several rooms closed off, so that's another factor. I don't use perhaps 1/2 of my house for living at the moment. So when/if I do start using more of the house, that will increase the usage.

Gas prices fluctuate of course. Cheap now, but what if it goes higher or is unavailable from time to time.

Wood is much cheaper, but then there's the outlay of the initial costs. And the effort.

Amortizing costs.. even wood is going to have a tough time beating $100 a month..

 

[devilsbullet]

Natural gas is nice and cheap, but always nice to have alternatives. I live in sw Washington, have a gas furnace, a pellet stove, and am looking at getting a wood stove as well. Way I figure it, there's always gonna be price fluctuations and I'd rather be prepared for them than scrambling when they happen. My gas cost is about what the ops is, but that's to keep my house at 68. Wife is cold blooded, and likes things closer to 75+ which is closer to 250 a month for me.between the 3 I'll be able to keep her happy

 

[bholler]

$100 a month for a 3000 squ ft house why are you looking to mess with anything. But regardless i would not put that stove in my house They really are not that great even from that time period there are allot better stoves out there but i would double check the legality of it before going any further at all

 

[jatoxico]

I vote to pass too, might as well get with the times. I don't know what size flue the Schrader would use but a lot of those older stoves used 8" whereas many newer ones use 6". The flue will be an expense you won't want to have to do twice. Also if you're in neighborhood with other houses nearby you'd probably be better to run a newer stove that puts out relatively little smoke and particulate than an older model. Most of my guests don't even know I have a stove, no smell in the house.

To piggy back onto what BG said, the NC30 goes on sale and some have gotten them for $650 or so IIRC. So not $125 but not crazy expensive and the Drolets seems to get love here too in a similar price range.

If you do go forward and are trying to keep the cost down avoid some of the real cheap brands. Some are leaky and dangerous and 600 deg box of steel in the middle of your living room is nothing to be cavalier about. Check here for honest opinions on any prospects. Good luck!