What are the real dangers with wood burning?

[gmtechguy]

Hello all,
I am new to wood burning and have recently purchased and installed a US Stove Company APS1100B EPA certified stove. I also installed the chimney which is a supervent insulated chimney system. I pulled a permit and had it inspected. The heat is fantastic! The stove is a little tricky to get going but once it is going, if you keep it hot and use smaller logs, it works well.

That being said, I have noticed lately that my lungs on some days feel a little funny. Could just be the dry air in the house, despite the cast iron kettle on top of the stove. I started researching wood burning health risks and am now quite concerned. I had no idea about the fine particulate matter and how harmful it can be. To help with ash, I bought a shop vac ash vac, which i feel is a bit of a rip off but I will see how it works. I know there are things like this that are heavily one sided, so I wanted to ask you folks, since you have much more experience with this.

Is it the ash or smoke that is the real worry?
Is there anything I can do to protect my family?
Is it safe once it is burning and door is closed? (Some environmental organizations say that 70% of the smoke particulates re-enter the home with doors and windows closed).


I'm sure some of you have read this stuff and have some insight, so thanks in advance for your input.

 

[SteveKG]

I don't have scientific instrumentation to check my home, with its three wood stoves. I've been heating and baking with wood stoves since the mid-70s, and I have noticed no health effects from the stoves. I do realize that breathing stove ash can be caustic and I would not want ash in my lungs.... As in, when emptying ash from the stove. We can smell no smoke coming back into the house. I suppose that, under unique weather conditions, smoke and its particulate matter could conceivably drift or be blown down from the chimney top and seep into the house as air is drawn inside to replace that lost during the burning process. However, again, we have never noticed that happening.

If you do happen to find out smoke is getting into the home, then, yes, it would be important to figure out a way to stop that. I know of no one around me that has the problem. There can be a lingering bit of smoke [smell] after you open the firebox door to add wood, of course, if some of the smoke escapes into the room. But as far as continually having smoke enter the home, that would be a health hazard, as you already realize.

We put kettles of water on our stoves, too, but in reality, I think most people would agree that it has very little effect at all on humidification. We do it anyway, but I cannot measure any change in the rel. humidity due to it. If you have a physiological problem with dry atmosphere inside the house, I would think a large humidifier would be the only solution. However, I am also not a doctor.

As to your question regarding ash and smoke, which would be worse, I don't know. Ash is caustic, which is not good for nasal and lung membranes; smoke contains all manner of nasty chemical compounds, none of which I want to breathe, personally.

 

[Beer Belly]

I never gave it any thought....there are dangers everywhere in every day life. As far as the dry air.....I don't think that pot on the stove will do much, we use ours with some smelly stuff the Wife likes....you may want to consider a Humidifier if it's too dry. Not trying to down play your concerns.

 

[doug crann]

Everything is bad for, depending on who you talk to. When I was a kid my Dad had a gutter business in NJ. All we burned for years was the old wooden gutters he pulled off of folks houses. We burned the tar and all. Never gave it a second thought.

 

[n3pro]

Prolonged exposure to wood smoke is very bad, hence the big push for the EPA certified stoves. If an EPA certified stove is ran correctly, wood smoke should be minimal. The ash like dust there are ways to minimize the effects but again as long as your careful the exposure shouldn't be a problem unless your are taking deep inhale as you are cleaning them out. As far as the re-entering of pollutants, that varies with weather, wind, and home so tough call. Your body will tell you, and yours apparently is that there is a problem.

The only thing I can say is make small changes to see what might be the cause, adding an humidifier in the room your occupy the most and the bedroom, maybe wear a dusk mask when cleaning the ashes, and see if any of these make a difference.

Just my two cents, hope it helps.

 

[Charles1981]

I'm allergic to cats and that is way worse to my allergies and breathing than the wood stove and i live with two cats...sigh.

However now with the wood stove the air is much drier and when my allergies flare up it seems worse. My nose is drier. I have to install a humidifier because the dryness in combination with my allergies is really starting to get to me.

I also need to stop putting tobacco smoke directly into my lungs too. I think the wood stove is the least of my concerns.

 

[Beer Belly]

I also need to stop putting tobacco smoke directly into my lungs too. I think the wood stove is the least of my concerns.

Amen....throw those things out....from a 2 pack smoker 20+ years ago

 

[BrotherBart]

With your chimney top being at a minimum sixteen feet in the air from the top of the stove and given that there are few times there isn't at least some breeze I have to wonder how somebody figures that 70% of what comes out of it could ever get into your house. Not even considering the dilution that occurs the moment the stuff leaves the stack.

Ain't happening.

 

[BrotherBart]

Amen....throw those things out....from a 2 pack smoker 20+ years ago

Around here the cat would go first.

 

[Charles1981]

If the cat's went so would the "lioness" around here and half of everything.

 

[Ram 1500 with an axe...]

Last year when I used my fireplace a lot, I would come home and smell smoke as well as possible creosote, but not 100% sure on that. Since I got my insert and cold starting 5-6 days a week, I and family don't smell wood upon entering the house, I do get smoke if I'm not super careful when reloading and I worry when I empty out the ash with a shovel, I also have a light dusting of ash on my insert, not sure exactly how or when that happens, I was reading about Washington state and how strict and worried they are about burning wood, they said if you can smell wood, you are inhaling all the bad things, I started to think that might be too much and they are trying to scare people. I can smell my neighbors chimney, I don't feel I am inhaling bad particles, just like you smell gas when filling your car with it, so, I don't have any answers but i have been thinking a lot about it lately, there are a lot of guys from Washington state here, maybe they can input on this situation, maybe we need to hear from a chemical engineer or a doctor, but anyways this is a good post. Thanks....

 

[CenterTree]

When my kids were younger and living at home, we couldn't have a wood stove due to my boy's asthma. The DOC told us that the fine particles that may escape during the opening of the door would not be so good for his breathing.

We always had to use HEPA filters in the house. OP: > You may want to invest in one if you notice some lung issues.
Also, they make a HEPA shop vac ( I have one from RIGID) that you may want to use for cleaning any spilled ashes around the stove. These are great for drywall work cleanup too.
Regular VACS can actually blow small harmful particulates BACK INTO the air.

I am just saying that lack of humidity may not be your only issue.

 

[jatoxico]

I was reading about Washington state and how strict and worried they are about burning wood, they said if you can smell wood, you are inhaling all the bad things,

I agree good thread. If you consistently smell smoke I would think that is a concern. I think it also makes sense to do the white glove test, not necessarily literally but swipe the furniture and shelves etc and check for ash and particulates. In my case my stove room is no dustier than any other and I don't notice an increase when I start burning. Smart to be aware of the potential problem and use good practices.

 

[tsquini]

It will take a bit to get use to the drier air. I find that stove top kettles done do much to add moisture to the air. We also have a humidifier going.

The killer is smoke. Carbon monoxide, nitrogen and suffer dioxide. The new stove technology is design to burn those flammable particulates before they get into the atmosphere or your neighbors house. That is 1/3 of the heat coming from wood.

 

[Luigi]

I also thought about this before deciding on a wood stove and after some research I come to find out that the diesel engines pretty much account for a large part of particulate pollution in our environment. I figure we breathe these particulates every day when we hit the road weather driving to work or the grocery store that a little bit from a wood stove in the house won't hurt.

 

[Charles1981]

My neighbors have out door wood boilers that smoke like the dickens. They order dump truck of green bucked wood a month and then throw in huge whole splits of green wood that is never seasoned. The damn smoke billows 1/4 a of mile to my house and stinks 10x more than my cat stove even during the 20-30 minute startup and reload period.

 

[Johnpolk]

Ever since god made man, we have been sitting around a fire to survive. I think a nice wood stove would be less of a worry than sitting around a campfire roasting some beast. Enjoy that stove and don't worry about it. Now excuse me while I search for some beast to roast.

 

[Cynnergy]

Just thought I'd chime in that clean burning is the goal for most of us here. Once the stove and chimney are warmed up and burning clean, there shouldn't be any smoke to worry about.

Best way to get to get a clean burn = dry wood. If you can only get a hot fire with small splits, that could indicate your wood might be wet. Do you have a moisture meter?

 

[Cynnergy]

Oh and we very rarely get a bit of a smoke smell in the cabin. Mostly this is from reloads (when my OH doesn't open the door slowly enough), and once in a blue moon on a cold start on still days - the smoke sometimes goes downwards and our cabin is old and leaky. I think this is a feature of our topography though and wouldn't apply to most.

 

[gmtechguy]

Wow, thank you all for the replies. I do not have a moisture meter but do think my wood is too damp. Someone gave me about 5 cords of oak that was cut into mostly 16 inch logs and stacked for almost 2 years. I have been hauling it home and splitting it with my buddies 27 ton splitter. I think it needs some more time now that it is split. I will have to invest in a moisture meter. I contacted the stove company to ask about the hard lighting and happened to ask if my stove has a secondary burn (doesn't have burn tubes or anything) and they said no. It is an epa certified stove though. I have a magnetic thermometer on the stove top and the highest it has gotten when burning real good was 450 but usually hangs around 300-350. Is that even hot enough to burn right?

As for the Washington state wood burning info, that is some of the stuff that started to worry me. I do have some health issues so I need to be careful, however, there are people out there that start scare tactics for other agendas. I think that the pollution caused by making a hybrid battery is just as bad a me driving my fuel injected Chevy truck. But there are people that hate people that drive trucks because of the info that is out there. If my emissions system is working properly with no faults detected and I maintain the truck, it isn't nearly as bad as some might think. Even the newer diesels (before mods) are burning cleaner than they used to. I know this is off topic, sorry, just saying that i do realize that there are people that are very one sided about these issues.

 

[semipro]

In a properly operating stove/flue system the stove operates under a vacuum created by a hot flue.
Smoke exiting the stove during hot operation indicates a problem with the flue. Some leakage may occur during start up until the flue heats up.
I feel that our exposure to airborne particulates results almost entirely from ash and firewood management not from actual leakage from the stove.

 

[DanCorcoran]

In a properly operating stove/flue system the stove operates under a vacuum created by a hot flue.

In other words, smoke and particulates won't come into your home when the stove is burning with the door closed. It is actually sucking air into the stove and into the stove pipe, not emitting it, and exhausting it into the air above your house.

The only two sources would be when you have the stove door open (loading wood and/or shoveling ashes) and from outside your home, via the chimney emissions. With an EPA-approved stove and even the mildest breeze, the latter should be negligible. The former you can control (technique and/or dust mask).

 

[begreen]

What stove are we talking about here?

 

[DanCorcoran]

US Stove Company APS1100B EPA certified stove

 

[begreen]

danke.