Who has switched from an insert to a freestanding stove?

[TomMcDonald]

Hi all,

I'm hoping to hear from people who have switched from an insert to a freestanding stove and put in the same room.

What was your reason for changing? What was your experience? Would you recommend it or do it again yourself?

Thanks for any answers in advance.

Tom.

 

[mikey]

I went from a open fireplace to a wood stove inside that fireplace, I have family members who have inserts I believe a stove in a fireplace puts out more heat without the need for a blower. My stove is a Jotul 602 with the legs cut down.

 

[shadow_smoker]

I'm also considering changing an old insert out for a modern freestanding woodstove and am interested in any other peoples experiences doing the same or deciding to stick with an insert

 

[RI_FL_Line]

I switched from a Jotul Kennebec to a Jotul Greenville on November 12. Although I was happy with the Kennebec, we lose power quite often and I wanted a stove that didn’t use a fan. We live in a cape cod style house with stairs leading upstairs from our stove room and both stoves heat the upstairs really well. also if I ever need to, I can also cook on the new stovetop. Perfectly happy with the switch.

 

[begreen]

I switched from a Jotul Kennebec to a Jotul Greenville on November 12. Although I was happy with the Kennebec, we lose power quite often and I wanted a stove that didn’t use a fan. We live in a cape cod style house with stairs leading upstairs from our stove room and both stoves heat the upstairs really well. also if I ever need to, I can also cook on the new stovetop. Perfectly happy with the switch.

Was there a blockoff plate in place for the C450 or was one put in for the F45?

 

[RI_FL_Line]

Was there a blockoff plate in place for the C450 or was one put in for the F45?

There was a block-off plate already in place.

 

[PaulBunyun]

I went from a quadrafire insert to a complete fireplace remodel with a Lopi liberty. The reasoning behind it was I had limited space in my fireplace so the insert firebox was not very big. I was not able to heat the entire house. I also had other issues with the insert but I attributed that to the brand and it being poorly made. To move any sort of heat through the insert I had to have a blower running which got very annoying listening to even though it was "quite" for a fan. Frankly, cutting, splitting, stacking and hauling wood was not worth it because I could barely get half my house to 68 degrees with the insert. So, I bite the bullet, did the work and spent the money to completely remodel the fireplace, including removing the hearth and tiling the firebox and floor. I then bought a Lopi Liberty which is their biggest free standing stove and couldn't be happier. It keeps my WHOLE house at 75 degrees with ease and esthetically it looks much better. If your considering it then do it, it was very much worth it. Make sure you install a block off plate and do your research on the best stove for you. See my pics below and good luck.

 

[prezes13]

Paul your setup looks pretty cool, I love that look.

 

[EbS-P]

I have both. Both have blowers. Both need blowers. Interior chimney. An interior chimney is the only place I would install a stove. An insert you can insulate around not as easy with a stove and keep it looking nice. Stoves choices under 30” high is not a lot. You have much more selection if choosing an insert.

I’m pretty sure the efficiency of my insert is better. The stove radiates so much more Heat to the masonry. But it’s a cast iron stove. I’m not sure I could run

It probably depends more on specifics. I can generalize my experience. If you don’t have a high enough lintel you can often get a bigger better performing insert. If you have lots of room for a big stove see my interior chimney comment above.

 

[TomMcDonald]

I switched from a Jotul Kennebec to a Jotul Greenville on November 12. Although I was happy with the Kennebec, we lose power quite often and I wanted a stove that didn’t use a fan. We live in a cape cod style house with stairs leading upstairs from our stove room and both stoves heat the upstairs really well. also if I ever need to, I can also cook on the new stovetop. Perfectly happy with the switch.

View attachment 305542

Looks good. Would you say there's any discernible increase in heat with the freestander?

 

[TomMcDonald]

I have both. Both have blowers. Both need blowers. Interior chimney. An interior chimney is the only place I would install a stove. An insert you can insulate around not as easy with a stove and keep it looking nice. Stoves choices under 30” high is not a lot. You have much more selection if choosing an insert.

I’m pretty sure the efficiency of my insert is better. The stove radiates so much more Heat to the masonry. But it’s a cast iron stove. I’m not sure I could run

It probably depends more on specifics. I can generalize my experience. If you don’t have a high enough lintel you can often get a bigger better performing insert. If you have lots of room for a big stove see my interior chimney comment above.

If I were to do it I would relocate the stove and close up the external chimney.

 

[TomMcDonald]

I went from a quadrafire insert to a complete fireplace remodel with a Lopi liberty. The reasoning behind it was I had limited space in my fireplace so the insert firebox was not very big. I was not able to heat the entire house. I also had other issues with the insert but I attributed that to the brand and it being poorly made. To move any sort of heat through the insert I had to have a blower running which got very annoying listening to even though it was "quite" for a fan. Frankly, cutting, splitting, stacking and hauling wood was not worth it because I could barely get half my house to 68 degrees with the insert. So, I bite the bullet, did the work and spent the money to completely remodel the fireplace, including removing the hearth and tiling the firebox and floor. I then bought a Lopi Liberty which is their biggest free standing stove and couldn't be happier. It keeps my WHOLE house at 75 degrees with ease and esthetically it looks much better. If your considering it then do it, it was very much worth it. Make sure you install a block off plate and do your research on the best stove for you. See my pics below and good luck.

View attachment 305588 View attachment 305589 View attachment 305590

That looks great, well done .
If I decide to do it fortunately I have enough space to locate a freestanding stove elsewhere in the house and decommission the chimney.

I'm also sick of hearing the blower humming and rattling the fascia among other issues I'm having with my insert.

Thanks.

 

[Poindexter]

What is your ultimate goal? This is the fundamental question you must address. I understand you said "in the same room" in the original post.

If you have never demolished an entire fireplace, it is more work than you were thinking of.

I personally have a woodie against inserts. If your goal is BTUs in the house, lower heating bills; I see inserts as a poor compromise. Inserts are cheaper than a full on fireplace demolition, but you simply will not be getting BTUs into your house efficiently from an insert the way you can from a free standing wood stove. You will be buying more cordwood, hauling more cordwood, burning more cordwood, hauling out more ash, BTU per BTU than you will be if you bite the bullet and put in a freestanding stove.

But you don't "have to" demolish the fireplace to put in the freestanding stove. You can. I did. I have no regrets. I have enough land to have an outdoor burn pit in the months my wood stove isn't running. In the winter months if I wife wants to see "the fire" I just twist a knob on the freestander.

Look very very carefully at your floor plan, with respect to your needs; and see if having an ambience burner, a fireplace, to help your resale value - and a freestanding wood stove to lower your utility bills - is a possibility.

How are you going to move heat around your house from where your existing fireplace is? How much harder would it be if you leave the fireplace alone and put in a freestanding wood stove over there? I cannot answer these questions for you.

If I owned, which I do not, a relatively small house in the northeastern USA, putting a modern efficient insert into an existing massive stone fireplace might make sense- if I was going to sell the house in a few years.

In the north half of Alaska, with an imperative goal of efficient BTUs into the envelope, ripping out my stone veneered sheet metal fireplace to put in a free standing wood stove gave me a payback/ break even $ point on the order of 5-7 years. I have saved enough on my oil bill to pay for the stove and the pro chimney install, and all the wood I have burnt, to break even in the 5-7 year window, but my wood stove(s) have been burning for nine years come May 2023. I did most of the demo and construction myself.

I am now 'in tall cotton' - the kind of cotton you don't have to bend over to pick, so less back pain- and the money I am saving this winter is real money. I have the service life expectancy of my stove pegged at around 20 years. In 2022 US$ I am saving about $2k annually, and expect to spend about $2k on stove maintenance in the next 11 years. With the demolition of the fireplace covered, new pro-installed chimney covered, all the cordwood paid for and the current wood stove also paid for, I am already $ ahead and am looking to become another $18k ahead in the next 11 years.

Having put in the infrastructure, in 2022 $, my next stove will be about $4k, will pay for itself in 2 years, and then $2k/ annually x 18 years, I will be $36k ahead on the heating bill with the next stove- if I can still handle 8 cords of wood annually (about 16+ cubic meters annually ) in my mid 80s. I might put in a pellet burner in 2033.

In general I see fireplace inserts as having a relatively low install cost, but relatively high ongoing fuel usage for BTUs into the house.

 

[EbS-P]

Looks good. Would you say there's any discernible increase in heat with the freestander?

Too difficult to say. One is radiant 1.7 cu ft, other is convective 2.4 cu ft. Insert has 1000 sq ft of LVP on slab and a 17’ insulated glass garage door, stove is 15’ from kitchen. If giving up floor space and setting Al the way out front and rear venting it is time to start comparing individual models.

Rear vent under 30” the list is smallmake it, jotul woodstock,???? Compare it to inserts BK Princess, Osborn 3500(it’s a big one!), pacific energy and their 2.? Inserts. And a Drolet 1800i.

 

[RI_FL_Line]

Looks good. Would you say there's any discernible increase in heat with the freestander?

To be honest we probably got more heat upstairs with the insert blower. If we cranked up the insert, it could get into the upper 70’s upstairs which was not good for sleeping. With the Greenville the temp upstairs gets into the low 70’s which is fine. The insert had two fan speeds, low and high. Never used high as it was too noisy. We had the insert for 11 years and no complaints and so far no complaints with the Grennville. I’m getting the feeling that there will be more power outages in the future and just feel better about having a fan-less wood stove. If we wanted to add a fan next to the wood stove in the corner we could..

 

[TomMcDonald]

To be honest we probably got more heat upstairs with the insert blower. If we cranked up the insert, it could get into the upper 70’s upstairs which was not good for sleeping. With the Greenville the temp upstairs gets into the low 70’s which is fine. The insert had two fan speeds, low and high. Never used high as it was too noisy. We had the insert for 11 years and no complaints and so far no complaints with the Grennville. I’m getting the feeling that there will be more power outages in the future and just feel better about having a fan-less wood stove. If we wanted to add a fan next to the wood stove in the corner we could..

Thanks. I think you're right about power outages. Part of the reason in considering the switch.
My insert doesn't even get the room it's in up to 70 let alone other parts, which makes me believe there is an issue.

 

[TomMcDonald]

What is your ultimate goal? This is the fundamental question you must address. I understand you said "in the same room" in the original post.

If you have never demolished an entire fireplace, it is more work than you were thinking of.

I personally have a woodie against inserts. If your goal is BTUs in the house, lower heating bills; I see inserts as a poor compromise. Inserts are cheaper than a full on fireplace demolition, but you simply will not be getting BTUs into your house efficiently from an insert the way you can from a free standing wood stove. You will be buying more cordwood, hauling more cordwood, burning more cordwood, hauling out more ash, BTU per BTU than you will be if you bite the bullet and put in a freestanding stove.

But you don't "have to" demolish the fireplace to put in the freestanding stove. You can. I did. I have no regrets. I have enough land to have an outdoor burn pit in the months my wood stove isn't running. In the winter months if I wife wants to see "the fire" I just twist a knob on the freestander.

Look very very carefully at your floor plan, with respect to your needs; and see if having an ambience burner, a fireplace, to help your resale value - and a freestanding wood stove to lower your utility bills - is a possibility.

How are you going to move heat around your house from where your existing fireplace is? How much harder would it be if you leave the fireplace alone and put in a freestanding wood stove over there? I cannot answer these questions for you.

If I owned, which I do not, a relatively small house in the northeastern USA, putting a modern efficient insert into an existing massive stone fireplace might make sense- if I was going to sell the house in a few years.

In the north half of Alaska, with an imperative goal of efficient BTUs into the envelope, ripping out my stone veneered sheet metal fireplace to put in a free standing wood stove gave me a payback/ break even $ point on the order of 5-7 years. I have saved enough on my oil bill to pay for the stove and the pro chimney install, and all the wood I have burnt, to break even in the 5-7 year window, but my wood stove(s) have been burning for nine years come May 2023. I did most of the demo and construction myself.

I am now 'in tall cotton' - the kind of cotton you don't have to bend over to pick, so less back pain- and the money I am saving this winter is real money. I have the service life expectancy of my stove pegged at around 20 years. In 2022 US$ I am saving about $2k annually, and expect to spend about $2k on stove maintenance in the next 11 years. With the demolition of the fireplace covered, new pro-installed chimney covered, all the cordwood paid for and the current wood stove also paid for, I am already $ ahead and am looking to become another $18k ahead in the next 11 years.

Having put in the infrastructure, in 2022 $, my next stove will be about $4k, will pay for itself in 2 years, and then $2k/ annually x 18 years, I will be $36k ahead on the heating bill with the next stove- if I can still handle 8 cords of wood annually (about 16+ cubic meters annually ) in my mid 80s. I might put in a pellet burner in 2033.

In general I see fireplace inserts as having a relatively low install cost, but relatively high ongoing fuel usage for BTUs into the house.

My goal is to be able to heat with wood to the point that the main rooms are able to get to 75f if I want. I'd like to be able to cook or boil on the stove. I'd like to be able to heat my house without needing a blower rattling away on the stove.

Basically I want to get as much bang for my buck as possible, like you describe. I spend so much time and energy cutting, splitting and stacking wood that I'd like a more significant return on that investment.

I now have ducting in the ceiling with an inline fan that channels heat to distant rooms. The fan cannot be heard unless the house is really quiet, something that never happens (3 kids).

Although the insert is working ok, i know it should be better. Have had freestanding stoves in previous houses and there is no comparison.

Tom.

 

[Highbeam]

I tore out a fireplace with chimney because it was cracked wasted space and an inferior performer compared to modern pipe systems.

It was just a single story chimney but it was super easy to demo a chimney. It just comes apart in bricks! I had a nice block off plate above a modern large lopi insert. Sold the Lopi.

Then I built a hearth and the freestanding smaller noncat stove was installed. It was immediately easier to heat the same home. No blower required.

Get rid of the obsolete masonry. They often leak water, they all wick heat out of the home, they can fall over in an earthquake. Some look cool but that’s the only redeeming quality I can think of.

 

[TomMcDonald]

I tore out a fireplace with chimney because it was cracked wasted space and an inferior performer compared to modern pipe systems.

It was just a single story chimney but it was super easy to demo a chimney. It just comes apart in bricks! I had a nice block off plate above a modern large lopi insert. Sold the Lopi.

Then I built a hearth and the freestanding smaller noncat stove was installed. It was immediately easier to heat the same home. No blower required.

Get rid of the obsolete masonry. They often leak water, they all wick heat out of the home, they can fall over in an earthquake. Some look cool but that’s the only redeeming quality I can think of.

Sounds like it was a success. Thanks for sharing.

How much smaller was the freestanding?

 

[Highbeam]

Sounds like it was a success. Thanks for sharing.

How much smaller was the freestanding?

The lopi freedom bay model was over 3 cubic feet and the hearthstone heritage replacement measured under 2 cubic feet. The heritage in 2007 was not a cat stove but a straight noncat and it delivered on the marketing specifications to heat my 1700 sf from 1963.

I really like the silent heat of a freestanding stove. I’ve since moved to a blaze king for 24 hour reload cycles and much less effort for even better comfort.

 

[Poindexter]

I have no regrets demolishing my fireplace. There was simply no other good place to install a freestander while leaving the fireplace alone at my house.

I did hate every minute of the actual doing demolition. Pain in the neck, dust everywhere, loads and loads of stone to take to the dump. Once I was done taking motrin a couple weeks later, done and dusted.

 

[trailrated]

I went from a quadrafire insert to a complete fireplace remodel with a Lopi liberty. The reasoning behind it was I had limited space in my fireplace so the insert firebox was not very big. I was not able to heat the entire house. I also had other issues with the insert but I attributed that to the brand and it being poorly made. To move any sort of heat through the insert I had to have a blower running which got very annoying listening to even though it was "quite" for a fan. Frankly, cutting, splitting, stacking and hauling wood was not worth it because I could barely get half my house to 68 degrees with the insert. So, I bite the bullet, did the work and spent the money to completely remodel the fireplace, including removing the hearth and tiling the firebox and floor. I then bought a Lopi Liberty which is their biggest free standing stove and couldn't be happier. It keeps my WHOLE house at 75 degrees with ease and esthetically it looks much better. If your considering it then do it, it was very much worth it. Make sure you install a block off plate and do your research on the best stove for you. See my pics below and good luck.

View attachment 305588 View attachment 305589 View attachment 305590

I just got a Lopi Endeavor, basically your stove but smaller. Noticed in your pic where you have the magnetic thermometer. How's that working for you? They way I'm understanding their manual, it says place on top of the stove above the door. I take it as the top where your fan and water pot sits. I'm just curious as the rutland thermometer I have is not accurate compared to my infrared gun. I'm talking way over 100* difference. I also noticed during my first couple burns several areas of the top of the stove read different (which is common) so I'm just wondering where the best place is to place my thermometer.

 

[begreen]

I have both. Both have blowers. Both need blowers. Interior chimney. An interior chimney is the only place I would install a stove. An insert you can insulate around not as easy with a stove and keep it looking nice. Stoves choices under 30” high is not a lot. You have much more selection if choosing an insert.

Flush inserts, like the Quad that PB had, need to run the blower. Inserts that stick out a bit from the hearth generally do a better job at area heating even when the blower is off. If the fireplace has a 3 cu ft insert that projected out onto the hearth, the results may have ended up similar to the Lopi. That said, the change is a nice improvement both visually and functionally. The Liberty is a heating beast.

 

[mikey]

I have a Jotul 602 in my fireplace I know it’s to small for you but as for the stove or insert you can’t beat a stove more heat and no blower. I think your stove should be perfect it will create it’s own natural convection.

 

[bholler]

I just got a Lopi Endeavor, basically your stove but smaller. Noticed in your pic where you have the magnetic thermometer. How's that working for you? They way I'm understanding their manual, it says place on top of the stove above the door. I take it as the top where your fan and water pot sits. I'm just curious as the rutland thermometer I have is not accurate compared to my infrared gun. I'm talking way over 100* difference. I also noticed during my first couple burns several areas of the top of the stove read different (which is common) so I'm just wondering where the best place is to place my thermometer.

Is your ir gun accurate? Absolutely magnet thermometers can be off you can check them in the oven for accuracy. But assuming a cheap or thermometer is accurate isn't really a safe bet either