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[daveswoodhauler]

Ok, so I was cleaning out the stove today prepping for the chimney sweep, and I found a small crack in the upper right hand corner, seems to be right on a weld.
Insert is a Lopi Answer, installed new in 2008...the stove has not been over fired....I don't think she has seen a stovetop temp above 650...and that was for a short time only.

Here is a pic....

Seems like some rust as well....perhaps the cap is not sealed properly?
Call the dealer/installer?

 

[BrotherBart]

Dealer.

I am having a hard time picturing where that is located on the stove.

 

[daveswoodhauler]

Dealer.

I am having a hard time picturing where that is located on the stove.

Its basically in the top/right/rear side of the fire box. Above the crack is the right hand side of the rear burn tube.

Another pic...cant really see the crack, but its where the rust mark is.

 

[Highbeam]

I wonder what kind of yahoo from Lopi drilled those holes in the back tube? It looks like they used a machine gun.

I am not positive how the Lopi is put together but on my heritage, the secondary manifold is not part of the main stove body. It has leaks and casting seams that leak worse than that crack ever will.

 

[daveswoodhauler]

Thanks Highbeam...so you are saying it might not be a big issue? (Havent had my coffee yet)
Going to give the dealer a call.....funny, not that I look at the pics I see what you are saying about the holes in the burntube.

 

[BrotherBart]

I agree with Highbeam. Since it is the secondary air manifold, not the stove body, I wouldn't be too concerned about it. It looks like something was on the metal and the weld just didn't stick. My 30-NC has a flubbed weld on the secondary manifold and I just cleaned the spot and applied furnace cement to it. That tube drilling job is weird. Not something that will hurt anything but weird.

 

[Jags]

Just adding another "fugitaboutit". That crack does not appear to be structural to the stove body. No harm, no foul.

Huh, drunken employees, what do ya do about 'em. ;-)

 

[johnn]

It`s difficult to really tell from the pictures, and I wasn`t able to enlarge those images> From what I see,,this weld was made outside the fire box, lying flat,,The start was at top nearest the burn tube and proceedede two inches (?) before it became overheated , due to a poor fit the last inch or so.There was a gap too fill and too much heat to do so. You can see in pic 1, where the weld went concave almost dripping through (or did) and he stopped. You can see where the weld becomes more crowned and thicker about an inch up from the bottom (at the concave point) This is where he started welding again. This area got hot as he tried to fill the gap (you can see on the right piece where wire fused to the metal tubing) (hot) Directly across from it on the left piece you can see a wart of weld (blob) this was an attempt at filling in a bad undercut. At this point if not before,,you have introduced too much thermal stress to the thin guage tubing.He came back later flipped thing over and finished the bottom welds,,,you can see where he started this weld and did not tie-in well, (it appears to be sitting on top of the previous weld) The crack runs from here to the blob, and is anyones guess which end it started from. I`d be surprised if you were not to see secondary burn coming from this area, and that the thermal exchange of air vs. burn will cause the crack to grow. Good odds even without secondary burn. My impression based on limited pictures,,,clearly construction defect,,,craftsman warranty issue.











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[Highbeam]

As far as rust, well every good burning firebox that I've seen has what appears to be rust on the inside. I think it is the bare metal from a clean burn since it doesn't deposit that layer of protective creosote. The bare metal is exposed to water vapor and corrosive gasses along with immense heat which is pretty much a recipe for corrosion. This is why they don't use mild steel for chimneys, and the connector pipes that are plain steel have a limited lifespan.

 

[johnn]

Stranger even yet,,,,both tubes are drilled or punched the same,,,must be a jig hick-up! :-S

 

[CrappieKeith]

Steel is not steel as in not all steel have the same qualities.
There is definitly an issue with the steel here.
If it was overfired the steel would have turned white in color....in my opinion.
1 year old and it cracked....you get what you pay for.
I will say this is only a stove and they are not made to heat whole homes although you did say it has never been abused.

 

[daveswoodhauler]

Not sure about ya get what you pay for comment....this wasn't a used stove when purchased. Installed in July 2008, Started using in October 2008 for 4-5 days/week for 8-10 hours per day.
Spend about $1500 on the insert with a total of appx $3500 with installation.
A stove with less than a year of use, not overfired, not abused, should not have a crack in the weld imho.
I would have liked to get a higher end stove, but we had some big limitations due to the fireplace size, and had to go with a small insert.....i.e. this or a Regency was the only one the would have fit, and after lots of reviews it seemed as though Lopi/Travis was a bit of a better product.

From the posts hear it would seem like its not a major issue, but I wam going to give the dealer and discuss.....don't want this to turn into a "larger" crack down the road and have the dealer tell me that its not covered as it out of the warrantee period.

Thanks.

 

[johnn]

Look at the weld in the opposing corner,,,see if theres not a significate difference,,,see if it was completed in one pass, including rounding the corner to complete the bottom weld. (As this would be the desired procedure)

 

[daveswoodhauler]

Thanks ML. I'll have to check the other side of the firebox....good idea, didn't even dawn on me to check for a similarity.

 

[CrappieKeith]

That crack is not going to stop.Sorta like a crack in your car windshield.
It will keep traveling.It's not the weld that crack ...it is the steel that was super heated during the weld. That bottom glob was put there to act as some extra support ,but too much heat hit that corner from the wire feed welder.

I was just saying that stoves for the most part(new) do not have long warranties because they do fail quickly.
Now if it was made of 7 gauge it would last longer.
Our furnaces see 20-30 years of operation on average.

 

[daveswoodhauler]

Got it. Thanks Crappie.....feel weird calling someone that, but I guess thats your screen name
Gave the dealer a call and they are sending someone out to take a look....sent the dealer a pic of the stove and said it wil be covered by warrantee....so my question is how will they repair it? Or perhaps, they will replace it?)
I'll let all know how things shake out...thanks for the replys

 

[Highbeam]

I don't think that this is a "you get what you pay for" issue. Lopi is about as high end as plate steel stoves get. You paid dearly for it.

Finally, I disagree that rust is abnormal in a firebox. By rust I mean the surface orange color that is present in the photo and not bubbly cancer style corrosion. My firebox has orange surface rust at certain high temps spots right now and it is cast iron. The steel is fine.

Do contact the dealer and get this on record though.

 

[CrappieKeith]

I'm a guide and spend time on many fishing forums...have my own www.ckoutdoors.com and so the locals say that if anyone can find crappies it's me...then they started to call me CK .It stuck so that's what I go by.

Back to your stove....it looks patchable.
Drill a small hole at the end of the crack,then wire feed a bead over the crack.
Get it in writting that if this fix does not last ...that a new stove would be in order.

 

[Hogwildz]

Look like a bad weld to me. The upper part of the weld, you can see is penetrating the steel good. The lower part looks like there was never any penetration. Looks ike the lower part is merely surface weld, and it let loose.
A new stove, I myself would want it right. You don't pay all that cash for a half ass weld job.

 

[summit]

Lopi stoves are notorius for this kinda stuff... but it usually takes quite a few years to minifest... this is a warranty issue, and if the stove is >5 yrs than it should be covered under the warranty, and you could make a case up to 7 yrs as per their warranty. we sell these, but these problems you usually see after 10 + yrs. those tubes and air inlets get pretty hot!

 

[webbie]

Looks like a bad weld - but, as mentioned, it is in a part which in many stoves is not welded at all. Some of 'em just fit together, especially cast stoves. It is simply an air manifold.

As to the hole pattern, that is probably on purpose to introduce more turbulence.

 

[tjnamtiw]

I'm a guide and spend time on many fishing forums...have my own www.ckoutdoors.com and so the locals say that if anyone can find crappies it's me...then they started to call me CK .It stuck so that's what I go by.

Back to your stove....it looks patchable.
Drill a small hole at the end of the crack,then wire feed a bead over the crack.
Get it in writting that if this fix does not last ...that a new stove would be in order.

I think you're right, Crappie. The hole at the end of a crack stops the crack dead. Then weld in the crack. Someone must have been practicing on his stove. It almost looks like a defect in the steel itself.

 

[daveswoodhauler]

Well, just an update on this one.
I checked the other side of the firebox this morning, and guess what, another crack right on the weld...basically looks as though the weld seperated from the steel. I'm thinking my stove must have been the practice box for the new employees of Lopi/Travis?
Basically, this crack is on the upper/left/rear...almost exactly in the same place as the other....thanks to the person who had me check the other side...Almost wondering if there are more cracks in the areas I cannot see?
Thanks for all opinions and feedback... dealer called me right back, and I am thinking that based on 2 bad welds, this is the case for a new unit?

 

[daveswoodhauler]

Lopi stoves are notorius for this kinda stuff... but it usually takes quite a few years to minifest... this is a warranty issue, and if the stove is >5 yrs than it should be covered under the warranty, and you could make a case up to 7 yrs as per their warranty. we sell these, but these problems you usually see after 10 + yrs. those tubes and air inlets get pretty hot!

Thanks Summit. When you run into issues like this, do you offer a replacement? (Not looking to gain here, just want the stove corrected)

 

[CrappieKeith]

Well, just an update on this one.
I checked the other side of the firebox this morning, and guess what, another crack right on the weld...basically looks as though the weld seperated from the steel. I'm thinking my stove must have been the practice box for the new employees of Lopi/Travis?
Basically, this crack is on the upper/left/rear...almost exactly in the same place as the other....thanks to the person who had me check the other side...Almost wondering if there are more cracks in the areas I cannot see?
Thanks for all opinions and feedback... dealer called me right back, and I am thinking that based on 2 bad welds, this is the case for a new unit?

You can see how the crack follows the outside of the weld....too much heat is being applied which comes from trying to produce too fast as the wire feed speed gets cranked along with the high heat for penetration.
My advice would be to have this welder drop his heat and slow his wire speed down.
You can get just as good of a bead without pre-fatiguing the steel.

Since both corners reflect the same craftsmenship you could assume there's a run of stoves out there that have the same issue.
A warranty should be covered as this issue could be common and known by the company.