Wood Cook Stove (w/Oven)

[WhatIsChazaq]

Here's what we want to do...pull out a section of cabinets and the piece of crap gas stove and build in a solid hearth and shielding...then install a wood cook stove with oven to heat the house and cook on during the colder months. We have a full outdoor kitchen where I'm getting ready to build an outdoor cook stove/oven for use in the summer.

I've looked at a bunch on-line, like the Baker's Pride, Pioneer Princess, etc...but the clearance requirements are HUGE (between 25" and 36" to the rear, mostly 25" to the sides). Anyone know of any with closer clearance requirements? Oh...and for less than $2,500?? A nice option would be a water reservoir and/or a water coil for heating water in a holding tank...

 

[begreen]

Yes, woodstoves need safe margins. Can a wallshield be used to reduce clearances in your location? Maybe look at the Heartland and Esse stoves? These folks might be able to suggest some options too:

Use this link: http://tinyurl.com/25cvpjs, or copy and paste: "http://www.antiquestoves.com/general store/generalstore.index.htm"

and Tom sells some cookstoves:

http://www.chimneysweeponline.com

 

[soupy1957]

BeGreen: your first link there, gave me an "Error 404" message.

My wife has been campaigning strongly for a kitchen "stove" (wood burning) ...........she's done a ton of research on them, from the point of view of an interested consumer. I've been resisting her up to a point. I was willing to (since I like the looks of them too, frankly), let her find and buy one, but not so willing to use it for cooking. Not because they wouldn't do the job, or anything like that.........just didn't find it advisable with my wife's "M.S." since she has limits in her physical ability and I'm not much of a cook. I want to make the "cooking" chore as easy on her as I can, and using a wood stove requires a finesse or balancing act with the wood that adds more physical stuff to the chore (imho).

Turns out that these stoves usually come in sections, first off. These "sections" have to have some sort of special masonry cement to seal them, and apparently over time, they will need replacement of that cement. Basically, it sounded to me like the cost of having a stove (renovated and 2nd hand is cheaper than a "new" one, if indeed there truly ARE any "new" ones around............after all, these were the working horses of 100 years ago, and are mostly prized for their ornate designs), like this, and the cost of maintaining a stove like this, was a bit unattractive.

When I put in my stand alone wood stove for heat (not cooking), I made sure there was at LEAST 5/8" Dry Wall behind it, and a masonry layer of brick on top of THAT, both for heat reflection as well as appearance and safety. If I were truly going to install a kitchen COOK stove (wood heat fuel), I'd want a kitchen that had plenty of space available for a buffer.

Here's a short blurb from one of the websites we tapped into when WE were considering this item seriously:

"An antique wood-burning kitchen cook stove must be located a mimimum of 36 inches from unprotected woodwork and other combustible materials or furniture. The addition of a heat shield or other protective devices, to the wall or the stove, allows a reduction of those distances by 50% to a distance of 18 inches from a combustible wall and 9 inches from a noncombustible wall. The wood-burning stove needs to be vented. This is done through a class-A, double-walled chimney."

(broken link removed)

P.S.: With regard to the link location........the wife and I are celebrating 32 years of marriage next week, so I'm going to surprise her with a visit to this particular stove store location (link)
and I'd be happy to give you a report on it, after the 21st, if you want.

-Soupy1957

 

[Dakotas Dad]

BeGreen: your first link there, gave me an "Error 404" message.

-Soupy1957

Just as a note, copy and paste into your browser window the whole link, worked fine, good site.

 

[begreen]

Updated post. Added a no spaces url link and instructions.

 

[SteveKG]

Wood cookstoves are monsters...they take a while to heat up, but then they stay hot for a very long time. That is not necessarily a bad thing, except in the summer when I want to bake bread.

Cooking on/in them is an art, but it is not difficult to learn. Patience and planning are necessary. Items cooked in the oven often must be turned regularly to bake evenly. With loaves of bread, I turn them every ten or fifteen minutes, depending on the bread. Pies, casseroles, etc., I might turn once in an hour. This just means you cannot safely go away and do something else outside or whatever unless you are willing to go back into the house every quarter hour.

I don't see a problem for someone with MS. On the other hand, I don't have it and neither does my wife, so I am no expert. The only difference I can think using a wood range vs a gas/elec range is that the entire wood stove is hot, everything on it. Naturally you must be careful not to touch anything on the stove except the handles for the oven door(s). If MS or other restriction means a person is more apt to stumble against the stove...might be a problem. I don't know.

My range has two sheet-metal layers outside the stove body on all sides but the front. (I mean, the stove was manufactured this way. It is a RAIS brand, and our model is no longer made. I don't know whether RAIS makes anything like this now. Our stove is rectangular and the RAIS stoves I've happened across in stove stores the past couple years are all cylindrical.) This gives two heat shields plus the air space between them allows air to rise in the envelope and I can have the stove within a foot or less from combustibles. We have a kitchen stool on one side of the stove about four inches away and it remains cool. So there are some stoves out there built like that. The main limit to clearance is that the heat from the top of the stove can effect the wall behind it, and I have sheet steel bolted to the wall with an air space behind it beginning at the level of the top of the stove.

However, the other posters are correct that most of the ranges I've seen do not have those heat shields. I had an old classic-style range in my previous cabin [rented and not my stove] but the wall behind it was of stone and it was no problem for the stove to be right up close to it. Also, it had a water heating reservoir on the side against the firebox, and that completely insulated that side, cool to the touch.

 

[snowtime]

What you are looking for is an insulated cook stove. These are stoves usually insulated with rock wool and have very close clearances. The downside to this is they are just supplemental heaters. We have 2 cook stoves but they are not what you need .The PioneerMaid is a heat producer which needs lots of clearance but is a hell of a stove and its oven design means no turning of bake goods. The problem I see is cost. I know of no insulated stove for $2500 but then i have not made a search. Good luck.

 

[soupy1957]

How M.S. can affect using a wood stove............M.S. affects different patients in different ways, but the commonly shared issues are typically, vision, manual dexterity, strength, and stamina. When tending a fire, you need to be on your toes, watching for errant sparks, loading and shifting wood, etc. (some of the same issues when using a wood stove for heat).

Thus, "I" am the sole source of real tending of "the fire" regardless of what box it's in. Ever try and cook a meal with someone underfoot? Not only is it hard enough for her to cook a meal, start to finish, due to her M.S. (she's a wonderfully talented cook, who has had to give up a lot of that, due to her M.S.), but having "me" underfoot, trying to maintain the temp in a wood stove, would be logistically a nightmare for her in her wheelchair.

Nope. For us.........if we had an Antique Cook Stove, it would purely be decorative.

I hope that helps you get a window into how "M.S." affects cooking with wood, or even "cooking" in general.

On another note, I have to tell you that the wood stove used for heating, and the heat it generates, has brought her more winter comfort to her M.S., than the oil-fired furnace heat EVER did. Emotionally AND physically.

-Soupy1957

 

[cmonSTART]

My client yesterday afternoon had a beautifully restored Elmira cook stove. They actually had it professionally restored and the chimney relined. She actually used it too for both heat and cooking. They're not the most efficient things in the world but the do serve a purpose.

 

[benjamin]

I saw a "Mora" on fleabay a while back, but I wasn't exactly looking for one and the reserve wasn't met...

It was made by a company "Moravia" (broken link removed to http://www.kvs-ekodivize.cz/solid-fuel-appliances/cooking-stoves) It had a more modern style and may be something you'd be interested in, not that you'd ever find one again, but there may be something similar out there.

 

[Burn-1]

Tom sells some cookstoves: http://www.chimneysweeponline.com

Tom has a pretty screaming deal on one of the Rolls Royce brands of solid fuel stoves, the Aga, $4,795 $1,500 off. With double wall pipe I think most of the Heartland stoves have close clearances and he has those on sale as well. They do have jackets and small reservoir options. Now it's not $2,500 but I would say worth the investment. If I didn't owe the Uncle a bit extra on last year's taxes, I would be seriously looking at the Aga. The Esse Ironheart does have an option for a domestic water preheat but I'm not sure if this is available in the US.

We looked at a few others as well but there isn't as good a market for them here as there is in Europe and Australia.

I enjoyed the Youtube videos done by Pivot Heat in Australia but it makes you jealous seeing what else is out there.

(broken link removed to http://www.youtube.com/user/Pivotheat#p/u/13/Tq6vyAUUc2M)

(broken link removed to http://www.youtube.com/user/Pivotheat#p/u/13/GkAw36RhF4Y)

For your price range and desires you might try to find an older Tirolia. These were Austrian stoves imported in the 1970's and have a back boiler and insulated cooktop, back and sides.

 

[WhatIsChazaq]

Tom sells some cookstoves: http://www.chimneysweeponline.com

Tom has a pretty screaming deal on one of the Rolls Royce brands of solid fuel stoves, the Aga, $4,795 $1,500 off. With double wall pipe I think most of the Heartland stoves have close clearances and he has those on sale as well. They do have jackets and small reservoir options. Now it's not $2,500 but I would say worth the investment. If I didn't owe the Uncle a bit extra on last year's taxes, I would be seriously looking at the Aga. The Esse Ironheart does have an option for a domestic water preheat but I'm not sure if this is available in the US.

We looked at a few others as well but there isn't as good a market for them here as there is in Europe and Australia.

I enjoyed the Youtube videos done by Pivot Heat in Australia but it makes you jealous seeing what else is out there.

(broken link removed to http://www.youtube.com/user/Pivotheat#p/u/13/Tq6vyAUUc2M)

(broken link removed to http://www.youtube.com/user/Pivotheat#p/u/13/GkAw36RhF4Y)

For your price range and desires you might try to find an older Tirolia. These were Austrian stoves imported in the 1970's and have a back boiler and insulated cooktop, back and sides.

I don't see the Aga on the site...is it maybe a floor model or in-store only model?

 

[Burn-1]

I don't see the Aga on the site...is it maybe a floor model or in-store only model?

Link below. It's a Heartland badge but the stove is an AGA

(broken link removed to http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/htartisan.htm)

Heartland is one of the brands of the AGA Rangemaster group.

 

[SteveKG]

I don't see the Aga on the site...is it maybe a floor model or in-store only model?

Link below. It's a Heartland badge but the stove is an AGA

(broken link removed to http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/htartisan.htm)

Heartland is one of the brands of the AGA Rangemaster group.

According to the web site, with double-walled pipe the clearances get down in the range of 3" sides and back. Not counting heat from the cooktop. That is pretty good.

Also, again reading from the link above, trucking is free to a terminal, and that has to be worth as much as $400.

Someone we know in England bought one and paid about $6000. This was maybe ten years ago, and was not this model but an Aga. So that is a really decent price.

Anyone know someone who's baked/cooked with an Aga?? I would like to hear how they do. I know they are popular in upscale homes, but I don't know whether that's because they bake well or look so cool.

 

[SteveKG]

I became inspired to do some searching on the web last night, and what I read was that Aga bought the Heartland Co. in Canada. The story is, they took Heartland's woodstove knowledge and used it to come up with an Aga wood-fired cookstove. So, it has the classic Aga look. For what it's worth.

I also saw these stoves [The Heartland-Aga Artisan model] advertised a few other places for prices in the low- to mid-$6000s, plus trucking. So for less than $5000 shipped, decent savings. Of course, it is still a boatload of money.

What I can say is that using a poorly-designed wood cookstove is a misery, a good one is a true pleasure unless one wants very quickly heated ovens and cooktops [often you'll need one to two hours to get the oven up to desired temp unless you are just warming up leftovers, 450 degrees you need to think more toward that 2-hr time.] I doubt one would find a brand-new cookstove of the good-design variety for less than maybe $2500. Probably more. Our RAIS was $3500 almost 20 yr ago, list price. We found one for a lot less as the co. quit making them and wanted them gone from inventory, but it was still a lot of bucks. But I haven't bought a loaf of bread in years.....

As far as heating the kitchen, I've never used a wood cookstove that didn't pour out the heat, regardless whether it was any good for baking.


Edit: I just rec'd an email from ChimneySweeponline and stand corrected. Apparently the Artisan is not a new stove but is, indeed, a rebadged stove from one of the Aga sister lines in England. Goes to show, again, not everything one gets off the Internet is entirely accurate.

 

[WhatIsChazaq]

Oh gee thanks folks...now y'all got my wife and I in love with a $5k stove (Heartland Artisan)!!

What can I rework in my budget....

dog food for the next month? :-/ :shut:

 

[fraxinus]

Here's another possibility: Bryant Stove Works in Thorndike ME (www.bryantstove.com) has an amazing collection of fully restored antique cook stoves (and other types) for sale. I haven't been there for some time, but they have been in the stove restoration business for many years and their website has some beautiful stoves for sale. Thorndike is a trek from CT, but far from impossible. Bryant also ships and their prices seem to me very reasonable.

 

[WhatIsChazaq]

It's not quite around the corner from Southern Missouri!

 

[firefighterjake]

Here's another possibility: Bryant Stove Works in Thorndike ME (www.bryantstove.com) has an amazing collection of fully restored antique cook stoves (and other types) for sale. I haven't been there for some time, but they have been in the stove restoration business for many years and their website has some beautiful stoves for sale. Thorndike is a trek from CT, but far from impossible. Bryant also ships and their prices seem to me very reasonable.

Plus you could stop by and say hi to me . . . I live next door (well one town over) from Joe and Bea . . . they're good people.

 

[Burn-1]

(broken link removed) in Goshen, MA is another specialty store however, with stores like this and the one that Frax mentioned you're paying a certain amount for the antique value as much as you are for the functionality of the cookstove.

I say go for the AGA. If you peek around some of the UK back to the land/sustainability sites you will find a number of AGA and Rayburn users. Do a Google search like "our Rayburn" or "our AGA" domain:.uk

That should give you some more feedback. Good luck.

 

[fraxinus]

Sorry, WhatIsChazaq. I seem to have confused your home state with Soupy1957's. At any rate, Bryant Stove Works has some very good looking kitchen stoves on their website in the $1500 to $2000 dollar range. There's a $170 crating fee and then what ever the freight charges would be for a very heavy item. Still, with new Agas in the $4000 and up range, one of these old stoves would certainly seem to be price competitive even with shipping.

 

[WhatIsChazaq]

Just found what looks like a really good deal on a used Heartland Oval 1903. Driving down to take a look at it Tuesday morning. Has the heat shield so rear clearances are 8", right side is 10. This might work, but it's huge. I'd have to take an army with me to load it and I'd be removing part of a half wall to install it.

 

[soupy1957]

"Antique Wood-Burning Kitchen Cook Stove:
An antique wood-burning kitchen cook stove must be located a mimimum of 36 inches from unprotected woodwork and other combustible materials or furniture. The addition of a heat shield or other protective devices, to the wall or the stove, allows a reduction of those distances by 50% to a distance of 18 inches from a combustible wall and 9 inches from a noncombustible wall. The wood-burning stove needs to be vented. This is done through a class-A, double-walled chimney."

 

[WhatIsChazaq]

Install clearances for the Heartland Oval:

(broken link removed to http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/chtoval.htm)

...and here is the actual user and install manual from Heartland:
(broken link removed to http://www.heartlandapp.com/GetFile.ashx?idFile=15)

 

[begreen]

I got a close look at a Heartland Oval at a local artist's house. It looks like a very fine stove. I would love to have one of them, but it is a big fellow. Congratulations on your find!