Woodstock Soapstone Absolute Steel Beta Install

[Oldhippie]

This past Monday I took a ride up to Lebanon NH with a neighbor from my home in north central Mass. to pick up a Beta Absolute Steel for their second round of field testing this soon to be released stove. Their first test sites were mainly employees of the company local to the factory. This 2nd round of sites are customers homes and I had expressed interest in testing this stove as a replacement for my "seen it's better days Vermont Castings Resolute 1988 vintage that I use as a secondary stove to heat my family room/home office area.

I had a 1988 vintage VC REsolute in the family room that has seen better days. The Resolute did an okay job heating that downstairs space and we found that we could also use that stove as a secondary stove for very cold winter days and especially for below zero winter days. Also, we found that in shoulder season, when our previous to the Fireview main stove/smoke dragon was a bit much for the main floors, just getting the downstairs stove going would provide sufficient heat for the upstairs without baking us out of the living room.

So the Absolute Steel has been of interest to me, as I have been very impressed with the results of the hybrid technology of the Woodstock Progress and the Ideal Steel, although both those stoves were too large and much more stove than I needed for my purposes of a secondary heater in the family room. It isn't a bad thing at all that this new stove from Woodstock has the hybrid technology, a good size (for me) firebox of 2.45 cu ft, a price below $2k AND the same very nice ashpan/grate system used in the Progress and Ideal Steel.

So the following pics are from my install experience with some and initial thoughts on operation as I get this stove up and running and take a few days to get used to the operation and features of the stove. On MOnday it was -2'F when I left to pick up the stove. It had been -15'F both Saturday and Sunday before this trip.


I used my Chevy Impala and small aluminum motorcycle trailer for the pick up.



Arrived at Woodstock Soapstone mid morning. My "install crew" Steve H.


This is a pic of my "install crew"/neighbor who owns a Progress and Lorin (Woodstock Field Test coordinator and Marketing Director)

This is the Woodstock Staff that walked me through the various features and helped with the loading and logistics of the field test.
left-to-right
Chris, Lorin and Mike.


We arrived home at about 4PM and unloaded the stove off the motorcycle trailer. Since the trailer has a low bed, it has a nice ramp with a slow slope and we were just able to slide the stove down the ramp into my garage. I'll add install pics in the next post to this thread.

 

[Oldhippie]

On Tuesday myself and Steve took on the task of moving the Resolute out and installing the Absolute Steel. Both are heavy stoves, the Absolute weighs in at just under 500lbs. If you are interested here is link to the stove specs. with a nice cutaway pic of the innards of the stove. (broken link removed to http://www.woodstove.com/wood-stoves/new-absolute-steel-hybrid)
You can see that the Absolute is a larger stove than the old Resolute. Although this pic distorts that somewhat as it is still on the dolly and closer to the camera than the Resolute. Also notice that I disassembled many of the pieces that I could from the stove to lighten the load. This was easy, not nuts/bolts or screwdrivers required, and did a good job minimizing the weight we needed to deal with. I removed the hinged top front cover to the catalyst chamber, the cat, the "hoodscoop" (more about that later), the firebox door (just lift out two door pins), the ash grate (quite heavy), the ashpan, the bottom soapstone and firebrick and the andirons.



We needed to walk the stove off the pallet and onto this dolly we made which needed to be a 25" width for clearance between my main family room area and around the staircase leading to the main living area. Here's a pic of me after getting the stove on the dolly.


Note, the ashpan heat shield/case is bolted to the stove bottom, so care must be used to keep the weight of the stove on legs and not on any other part of the bottom of the stove. I'll post a better pic of this in a subsequent pic.


To get the stove onto the hearth we employed my motorcycle jack and some spare boards from the pallet to deal with the height difference.


Finally, with the stove in place we easily reinstalled to ahspan grate, the floor soapstone side skirts and firebrick, the firebox door and the cat and hinged top cover. That was enough work for this post. I waited till the next day to do my break in fires.


Live, learn and plan.....when I finished off the basement 30 years ago, I did not foresee putting a stove of any larger size on the hearth. I specifically built the hearth to be sized and support clearances for a Consolidate Dutchwest I had at the time. Although this stove fits on the hearth, the clearances not yet published and in testing at Woodstock, will most likely mean that I'll need to enlarge the hearth. It won't be all that difficult to do, but I think I'll extend out the raised hearth forward and most likely also on the right side. The good news is the tile in back and on the side has Durock panels behind it and then the cinderblock chimney.

 

[realstihl]

Them stoves ain't much to look at. I don't like the big elephant ears on them. I'm sure they are top quality stoves though.

 

[LocustBurner]

Like they say, “beauty is in the eye of the beholder” and IMO, this is a beautiful piece of metal art.
Especially like the color combo. Since many on this particular board favor traditional stoves like the oft referenced Blaze Kings, Jotul, etc., they also seem to favor the basic styles they offer.

But having lived with an Ideal Seel for almost a season, I have had compliments on my stove – charcoal on charcoal - and the only negative opinions on the Woodstock products I've heard or seen have been here.

Fact: no other stove builder offers the level of customization that Woodstock does.

 

[Oldhippie]

Well, I am day 3 into the install and operation of the Absolute Steel, aka "The Big Mama" in the basement. Here are some random thoughts.

• This is a serious heater, it will easily run longer than 12 hours on less than a full load of wood. The firebox has good width and height. Quite a bit larger than what the numbers indicate. I believe the Fv is a 2.2cu ft stove and the AS in a 2.45cu ft box. But it sure seems more than that to me.
• The cruise range for my stove/flue/climate etc seems to be STT @400+'F and single wall flue temp of 210'F give or take a 20 degrees depending on burn stage.
• Even though the stove's STT is very similar to the Fv, the actual amount of heat that translates into is much, much more. I am guessing this is due to 2 factors
  • surface area
  • steel vs soapstone (although there is a soapstone liner in the AS it also has a lot of steel)
• LOVE the ash-grate/ash-pan system! (I just feel like I'm cleaning out ashes too frequently with the Fv.)
• The Hybrid system is all things to all people! It works seamlessly. Set it and forget it.
• One nit: The draft control on the stove is this fairly long "Stick shift" labled from high and the top to low at the bottom. It runs along a serrated steel guide. The lever has plenty of granularity, almost infinite control, but it makes a lot of noise running along the steel serrated guide, which holds it steady at whatever setting you pick. The noise is annoying as it moves along the serrated edge. You can pull it away from the edge, but then run the risk of bending the lever, they are working on an improved guide/lever system for this.
• The looks of this stove is really growing on me, in a form-follows function kind of way. It's not pretty and decorative, but the various decorative designs do give it personality. But on the other hand, this stove has a "Industrial Strength" look and feel to it, that it backs up with impressive performance in both BTUs and length of burn, that I can't help be impressed by, especially given it's competitive price point.

I am still getting used to the stove. It is still fogging over the glass after a couple days of running. I will let the fire go out soon, clean it off and that will most likely be the end of the fogging. Having the ability to pull the andirons for cleaning is a definite plus in this case. I'm not obsessive about clean glass, but I do like clean glass. (It's prettier in the pictures. )

 

[begreen]

Wish Woodstock would work with VC to come up with a good looking stove. They do a great job with engineering an efficient stove but the last two designs would never make it past my wife. She absolutely hates the look of the new stoves.

 

[DougA]

I actually like the design, probably a notch better than the IS IMHO. Is loading always from the side? I like the dual doors on my Equinox. I seem to load from the front most of the time but use the side a lot. The Equinox does not have andirons so I have sometimes put splits in the side and had them flip onto the glass. That's a huge PITA with a roaring fire. With the high andirons, I assume you can't load from the front?

My only complaint is that I would rather see the soapstone on the outside on at least the front for aesthetic reasons.
If I ever have to rebuild my Equinox, I will take one soapstone panel off the top and replace it with a cast iron piece. Cooking on soapstone sucks big time. Simmering is great but I cannot get a hard boil on mine, even with a hot fire. The big advantage of the soapstone for soft, even heat makes it less desirable for cooking.

 

[Oldhippie]

Wish Woodstock would work with VC to come up with a good looking stove. They do a great job with engineering an efficient stove but the last two designs would never make it past my wife. She absolutely hates the look of the new stoves.

I think that is good feedback to WS, their primary focus with this stove was to get to Zero Emissions. At their open house this fall they gave out T-shirts with R2Z ("Race to Zero") as the challenge ahead. They came up with a very impressive number like .5 grams per hour emissions with this one in their EPA testing. This science is far beyond me, but their focus was the emissions and this is their 3rd generation or what they started with the Progress.

But, now that they've got this technology down, a logical next step might be leveraging the technology into a variety of styles and sizes.

 

[Oldhippie]

I actually like the design, probably a notch better than the IS IMHO. Is loading always from the side? I like the dual doors on my Equinox. I seem to load from the front most of the time but use the side a lot. The Equinox does not have andirons so I have sometimes put splits in the side and had them flip onto the glass. That's a huge PITA with a roaring fire. With the high andirons, I assume you can't load from the front?

My only complaint is that I would rather see the soapstone on the outside on at least the front for aesthetic reasons.
If I ever have to rebuild my Equinox, I will take one soapstone panel off the top and replace it with a cast iron piece. Cooking on soapstone sucks big time. Simmering is great but I cannot get a hard boil on mine, even with a hot fire. The big advantage of the soapstone for soft, even heat makes it less desirable for cooking.

Loading is only from the side. You can get left hand or right hand loading, and the ash-pan door follows the loading door, but that's it, not fron loading. The andirons are removeable to ease cleaning the glass and they are now using longer ones based on the intial early field testing of the first few stoves.

 

[begreen]

I think that is good feedback to WS, their primary focus with this stove was to get to Zero Emissions. At their open house this fall they gave out T-shirts with R2Z ("Race to Zero") as the challenge ahead. They came up with a very impressive number like .5 grams per hour emissions with this one in their EPA testing. This science is far beyond me, but their focus was the emissions and this is their 3rd generation or what they started with the Progress.

But, now that they've got this technology down, a logical next step might be leveraging the technology into a variety of styles and sizes.

Not sure if they will go this direction. Their last two designs rely heavily on bling tacked onto the stove body. It doesn't work for many. With a classically designed cast iron jacket on the stove, it could take on a whole new look. This is what Pacific Energy did when they created the successful Alderlea series. Jotul and Enviro followed. Fortunately, they have one of the best stove foundries in the US as neighbors. VC makes good looking stoves but needs the guts redesigned. Seems like there could be a nice marriage of the best of the two.

 

[Oldhippie]

Here are some more pics of the stove and the initial break-in fires. I'm trying to capture some of the controls and operations of the stove.
Here is a look inside the top lid down to the cat. Also, not that directly in front of the cat is the bypass opening from the firebox and it is in the open position right now. The small handle with the circular end on the right is the lever that controls the bypass. The cat is slanted forward, directing heat toward the front. The cat can be easily lifted out for leaning of needed. In the next pic you will see the "Cat hood-scoop" which just sits atop of the cat and directs the heat forward.

Here's how the hood-scoop sits atop the cat. It's a cool little feature.


Here's what the hood scoop looks like off the cat.


The bypass control is down when the bypass is closed, and it prevents the door from being open. When the bypass in open then the firebox door can be open.

Here's a pic of the firebox door handle, it works really well, a nice solid closure.

 

[3650]

WOW that thing looks huge compare to the Fireview. I'm guessing the rear exhaust isn't the same height as the fireview? I can't have any other stove that has a different exhaust height. I was kind of hoping they would be the same so that down the road I could swap em out if I decided to take the plunge. Maybe I could chop the legs off some.

 

[Woody Stover]

the last two designs would never make it past my wife. She absolutely hates the look of the new stoves.

Well, maybe there's still hope. She's already gotten past the elephant in the room; The big, black pipe which is the first thing anyone sees when they enter.

 

[begreen]

Nope. It'll never happen with the current setup. I thought about the PH, but we need a front loading stove with close clearances for our corner installation.

 

[OhioBurner©]

Them stoves ain't much to look at. I don't like the big elephant ears on them. I'm sure they are top quality stoves though.

Just realize the wings are optional, as is the various different artworks.

 

[Oldhippie]

I've got a nasty cold. Woke up last night in the middle of the night, after going to bed about 11:00PM so I wondered downstairs to check the stoves.

The Fireview in the living room was just doing it's normal cruise with a 400'STT so then I went down to the next floor to check the Absolute Steel. I was surprised to see that there was a beautiful light show going on of the secondaries, a 525'F STT and yet no flames off the wood which was down a bit to about 2/3s of a box. But that entire secondary plate was lit up like a Xmas tree.

Really pretty, first time I had seen it and sat and watched for 5 mins before the Nyquil kicked in.

Love the extra room this box has over the Fv! I used to have to rush down to the family room at 6:00AM if I wanted to keep the stove going without a cold start. Not this one, I think anytime before noon and I'll be fine. It's not got the size of an IS but at 2.5cu ft it's more than I'm used to by a long shot.

 

[OhioBurner©]

With milder temps have you tried for a long burn? I've lost track of all the ASH threads but I'm not sure if anyone yet has tried to see how long of a burn they can get? I'm only really interested in this stove if it can reliably hit a ~15hr burn. Let me explain. My work day is 12 hours, and I drive 40 miles each way, plus need to be there a bit early for shift turnover. Plus you can't load the stove right at the time you leave, I like at least 30 minutes to get it settled out. So here is my typical day. Up around 4am and jump in the shower. About 4:20 load the stove. Leave for work about 4:50. Leave from work a bit after 6pm, arrive home usually around 7-7:15pm, closer to 8 if I stop for groceries on way home (I try to combine my trips during work commute since it is so far to go for groceries from my house). So say ~15 hours from a bit after 4am to 7pm.

 

[Oldhippie]

With milder temps have you tried for a long burn? I've lost track of all the ASH threads but I'm not sure if anyone yet has tried to see how long of a burn they can get? I'm only really interested in this stove if it can reliably hit a ~15hr burn. Let me explain. My work day is 12 hours, and I drive 40 miles each way, plus need to be there a bit early for shift turnover. Plus you can't load the stove right at the time you leave, I like at least 30 minutes to get it settled out. So here is my typical day. Up around 4am and jump in the shower. About 4:20 load the stove. Leave for work about 4:50. Leave from work a bit after 6pm, arrive home usually around 7-7:15pm, closer to 8 if I stop for groceries on way home (I try to combine my trips during work commute since it is so far to go for groceries from my house). So say ~15 hours from a bit after 4am to 7pm.

First off, you work too hard. ...just kidding.

I am going to try for a long burn sometime soon. I've been learning a lot about the stove over the last few weeks and am now getting around to this kind of experiement. I'll make sure I do get this type of test done. I'll say this; just based on burns I've done to date, if you are looking for a 15 hour burn with just a lot of hot coals for the last couple hours, that will be no problem at all. I've done that a couple times just because I didn't need the heat and hadn't gotten around to loading, and I've yet to actually stuff the box full.

But let me ask; Do you have any other criteria regarding clearances, size or cost? Just thinking you could move up to an IS or BK for even more size/burn time, if you needed to.

 

[branchburner]

I was surprised to see that there was a beautiful light show going on of the secondaries, a 525'F STT and yet no flames off the wood which was down a bit to about 2/3s of a box. But that entire secondary plate was lit up like a Xmas tree.

Yes, the light show in my ASH beta has been amazing... very often the bluish flames dance from the plate down to the wood, disappear for a moment and then reappear. But sometimes there is just a steady ripple of flame along the plate. Best light show I've ever seen in a stove, sometimes seems like a mini-version of a Northern Lights display.

I have also been amazed at how the glass has been self-cleaning to provide a great, crystal-clear view of the secondaries. Yes, it has fogged up on low burns, but has always regained full clarity on a high burn, so I have yet to see any need to clean it manually.

You mentioned a typical cruising STT in the 400f range, which is what I've seen, but I've noticed the hottest spots on the sides of the stove seem to run 100-150f higher. You say you got a 525f SST a few hours into the burn cycle...I don't think I've gotten quite up to 525F, just a bit over 500f with the side peaking around 675f at that point, and that was pretty early in the cycle with the stove throwing a ton of heat. Where was the air set when you hit 525f, and have you seen temps much higher?

 

[branchburner]

reliably hit a ~15hr burn

If you want coals enough to rebuild 15 hours after a full load, I don't think that will be a problem. But the stove will still have a typical heating cycle where most of the useful heat is going to come earlier in the burn. The soapstone lining does hold and re-radiate an impressive amount of heat well into the cycle, especially when it is not all that cold out. But when it is very cold that retained heat may be useful in keeping the stove warm enough for a pretty quick reload, but not so useful in heating a not-so-well insulated house. So I am generally opening the air back up and reloading without stretching the cycle to its limit.

I'm pretty sure when it gets warmer I will not be pushing for the maximum burn times, either, because loading the stove full will probably mean the heat output (and re-radiated heat from the stone) will be a little more than I need. My impression so far is that even with the air shut to zero, the hybrid technology will allow for a clean "smolder" but one that still generates decent heat and will not cruise much below 350f in the earlier part of the cycle.

So I anticipate more generally I'd want to build a smaller fire and stretch its burn out over as many hours as possible. I'm assuming the smaller volume of wood will give a shorter overall burn, as well as lower heat output. But I wouldn't be surprised to see coals 15 hours after burning only a 1/3 full load vs. a full load. Of course, at some point I have to shoot for 24 hours just to see how it goes.

 

[Woody Stover]

You say you got a 525f SST a few hours into the burn cycle...I don't think I've gotten quite up to 525F, just a bit over 500f with the side peaking around 675f at that point,

I'm assuming that if it's like the Keystone or Fireview, temps on the side will be hotter with flame in the box than they will in a cat-only burn. With the stone stoves I never see side temps hotter than STT, though.

 

[branchburner]

Regardless of flame activity at the top of the firebox, I always seem to see side temps hotter than STT, except at the very early stage of the burn. That would be the upper portion of the sides only, which run a good deal hotter than the mid-to-lower sides or the top (by 50-150f).

 

[zelachowski]

I really like the engineering of the ASH, but it failed the wife test. She's an artist and if it doesn't look good........you know the answer. I'd like to see it with a soap stone body with all the latest technology inside. We're going to go with the Fireview again most likely at our new place. I love their products and service.

 

[Oldhippie]

Yeah, it's not the work of art that the Fireview is. I've actually got the Fireview in our livingroom, and we love it. But different people like different things, that's what makes the world go round, or something like that.

How many sq ft will you be heating. I'm heating 1600sq ft of well insulated cape style home on the Mass/NH border in central Mass and the Fv does fine, but if you are really looking to heat a 150 year old Victorian you might want to think about a Progress or other bigger box if your heating bigger area in an older home.

 

[OhioBurner©]

I really like the engineering of the ASH, but it failed the wife test. She's an artist and if it doesn't look good........you know the answer.

They are fairly plain boxes, with just a little bit of design added to them, so not always everyone's cup o tea. But if she is an artist, have you thought about the Ideal Steel Hybrid with custom art? It is really neat how you can design your own stove, themed with your own interests and design yourself - just has to be slightly adapted to what there machine can handle and cut out of steel. Still the basic shape of course remains, but just an idea. That is what really sold me... I didn't think the basic stove looked half bad, but I'd much rather have a nice curvy gothic looking cast iron stove. But putting mine together with an Adirondack mountain theme was really fun. And if you ever want to change the theme all the artwork is romovable and you can always buy more from woodstock, perhaps even a theme for the holidays or seasons. The Fireview is a real beauty though, love the look!

I would have had the same problem with the wife test, and that is one reason we went with the flush Jotul Rockland insert initially. But we both failed the marriage test unfortunately so now I can do whatever I please and the first thing was rip out the Rockland and put it a real heater! There are some advantages to being single at least.