Zero clearance wood fireplace

[Den69RS96]

i currently have a propane fireplace. It's cheap and the flame looks fake. We used it for a couple of years until the propane company charged way to much per gallon since our useage was low. We used it occasionally. I decided I wasnt going to pay over 300 a year to run the pilot most of the time.

I was looking into zero clearance fireplaces, but with my existing set up, I'm not sure if I can do it or it is worth doing. I wanted to go wood because I have plenty of it in my yard. I currently have 2-4 cords of split oak sitting on pallets. Right now we use it as camp firewood.

I was looking to to supplement our existing oil furnace/ hot air. My wife likes to keep the house cool and I just want warm it up a bit when she is not home.

 

[begreen]

The propane installation doesn't have a full chase going up past the roof for a chimney and it looks like it lacks the depth for proper wood fireplace and chimney clearances even if a chase was added, but that would have to be measured to verify. To replace with a wood fireplace it might require demolition of the current setup and starting from scratch. Another option is to go to the gas forum here and enquire about replacing the pilot with a pilotless ignition system. Or consider another location for a wood stove.

 

[CountryBoy19]

Just a terminology lesson to make your searching easier. Zero-clearance fireplace is essentially a "stove" with a number of shrouds/shields around it to be able to be placed immediately next to combustibles. An insert is a stove without the shields and shrouds that is made to be placed inside an existing open fireplace.

You will not find an insert that is listed to be put inside any zero clearance fireplace (your LP fireplace is also considered zero-clearance). You will have to entirely replace the LP fireplace. The number of EPA high-efficiency ZC fireplaces on the market is limited so your odds of finding one to fit your opening perfectly are pretty slim. The scope of the project will depend what exactly is inside your enclave/enclosure.

Regarding chimney: you may be able to g right up through that little roof but it looks like it may be tight to do properly. You could also build that chase all the way up to the roofline to make it look less cheesy.

I have a KozyHeat Z42-CD that I'm very pleased with. We've heated 3,000+ square feet exclusively with it since 2010. It paid for itself midway through the 2nd winter.

 

[Den69RS96]

Thanks for the info. I was told they call that bump out a dog house. I wasn't a fan, but when we had the house built, I had zero interest in a fireplace whether it was gas or wood. After living here for over 10 years, I'm wishing we did not go with the gas fireplace. I'm not to up to date on the correct terminology, but I wanted to remove the existing fireplace and install a zero clearance wood burning fireplace. I wanted to go with wood just because I have access to lots of it on my property.

I took some measurements. The exposed part of the fireplace between the tiles measures 34W x 32H. The chase on the outside of the house sticks out 23 inches from the siding. I found of pic of whats inside there when the house was built. Its just wood.

 

[jatoxico]

If you want to go with wood you have two realistic options. A zero clearance fireplace as you mentioned which is typically purpose built, that is you buy the fireplace then construct to its specifications. Very nice look but costly. Will need a full chase on the exterior and more significant amount of interior work for hearth/mantel and so on.

Second you could install a free standing stove with a hearth as specified by the stove's requirements. Many very attractive installs and will be cheaper than a ZC since the chimney can be run up outside w/o a chase and typically less involved on the interior.

Fireplace Inserts would go into a preexisting masonry fireplace which wouldn't make sense for you.

 

[Den69RS96]

Thanks Jatoxico. I didn't even consider a free standing stove. I'm kind of against adding a chase to the exterior since matching the siding would be tough due to that part of the house getting full sun.

 

[jatoxico]

Thanks Jatoxico. I didn't even consider a free standing stove. I'm kind of against adding a chase to the exterior since matching the siding would be tough due to that part of the house getting full sun.

Well if you're willing to spend the chase can be covered in stone or other suitable material. The results can be beautiful but much more in materials and labor. What you decide may depend on how visible it is.

 

[CountryBoy19]

I took some measurements. The exposed part of the fireplace between the tiles measures 34W x 32H. The chase on the outside of the house sticks out 23 inches from the siding. I found of pic of whats inside there when the house was built. Its just wood.

Thats going to be a tough one, I doubt you'll find a wood-burning zc to fit an opening that size. So if you want ZC you're going to have to open up your wall and change the opening size (structure). Is the 23" dimension from surface of siding to surface of siding? If so that means the inside dimension from surface of the wall to surface of the wall should be similar Unless there is a wall thickness difference; is your main wall 2x6 studs? Tough to tell from the picture angle.

If you "bump out" into the room a little you can be ok on the depth, height and width is the problem. For example, the Kozyheat Z42 that I have is 38" high, 42" wide, and 26" deep. It looks like your chase has the room to expand the opening size to the top and sides, you just have to move out the structural supports in your wall and get a longer header over the opening.

If you want to go with wood you have two realistic options. A zero clearance fireplace as you mentioned which is typically purpose built, that is you buy the fireplace then construct to its specifications. Very nice look but costly. Will need a full chase on the exterior and more significant amount of interior work for hearth/mantel and so on.

I don't think the pipe has to stay within a chase. It should be able to pass through the roof of the chase and go up the exterior wall of the house. It will be nothing different than any other roof penetration and exterior wall-mounted chimney. Do you have any evidence that says it has to be inside a chase?

 

[begreen]

This may be a moot point if the current ZC fireplace enclosure is not deep enough. A freestanding stove in another location is worth considering.

 

[CountryBoy19]

This may be a moot point if the current ZC fireplace enclosure is not deep enough. A freestanding stove in another location is worth considering.

Definitely; it all goes out the window if you can't meet clearances with the current depth but most of the stovepipe adapters on ZC fireplaces are near the back so it's very likely he'll be able to "bump" the front of the fireplace out into the room a bit, get a hearth put down in front of it, and still route the pipe up...

 

[begreen]

Needs to be measured. There also needs be enough depth to have 12-14" clear around the chimney pipe. Most fireplaces I have seen have the flue exit close to the center, but I'm sure there are exceptions.

 

[jatoxico]

T
I don't think the pipe has to stay within a chase. It should be able to pass through the roof of the chase and go up the exterior wall of the house. It will be nothing different than any other roof penetration and exterior wall-mounted chimney. Do you have any evidence that says it has to be inside a chase?

Just saying what's typically done on an exterior install for a ZC.

 

[Den69RS96]

I think I need to take a trip to the store and check out some stoves and inserts. Maybe I can get an idea and see if I can make something work with the wife's approval of course.

 

[jatoxico]

Personally I think I would take the existing chase down and use the siding from it to patch it back in. Pick a free-stander requiring ember protection only. Tile the floor/wall to meet the code requirements and go through the wall and up the side with the chimney.

 

[CountryBoy19]

Needs to be measured. There also needs be enough depth to have 12-14" clear around the chimney pipe. Most fireplaces I have seen have the flue exit close to the center, but I'm sure there are exceptions.
View attachment 187229

12-14" clearance around the chimney? Doesn't Class A only require 2 inches?

Just saying what's typically done on an exterior install for a ZC.

And typically the stove wouldn't be retrofitted into an gas-fireplace doghouse, but sometimes you make do with what you have. As long as he complies with the UL listing and all codes there shouldn't be any issues.

Personally I think I would take the existing chase down and use the siding from it to patch it back in. Pick a free-stander requiring ember protection only. Tile the floor/wall to meet the code requirements and go through the wall and up the side with the chimney.

That's definitely an option, there is nothing wrong with giving a multitude of options and letting him choose what he feels is best. I just don't like to see things misrepresented, just because it's not your preferred option doesn't mean it wouldn't be he preferred option. He may not want to lose that much floor space.

 

[begreen]

12-14" clearance around the chimney? Doesn't Class A only require 2 inches?

Correct, the total clear area for 6" pipe is 12" and for 8" pipe 14". That includes pipe diameter and 2" clearance on all sides.

 

[Den69RS96]

Thanks for all the input. The living room is not very big so I really can't have a stove protrude too much in the room. It seems this might be much more expensive than I thought if I need to enlarge the chase. Thanks for all the help.

 

[CountryBoy19]

Thanks for all the input. The living room is not very big so I really can't have a stove protrude too much in the room. It seems this might be much more expensive than I thought if I need to enlarge the chase. Thanks for all the help.

It wouldn't have to be too much; for example you have 23" inches, and a ZC fireplace is 24-28" so you're looking at having it protrude 1-5" plus hearth (hearth has to be 16 or 18", I can't recall which is Canada and which is US).

 

[jatoxico]

And typically the stove wouldn't be retrofitted into an gas-fireplace doghouse, but sometimes you make do with what you have. As long as he complies with the UL listing and all codes there shouldn't be any issues.

How did I know someone was going to say what you're saying. I've never seen it done that way but OK you've successfully picked that nit.

 

[CountryBoy19]

How did I know someone was going to say what you're saying. I've never seen it done that way but OK you've successfully picked that nit.

What's your point? I've never seen it done that way either but if you consider how many times I've seen somebody retrofit a ZC woodfireplace into a ZC gas doghouse like the OP has (zero times) it's not surprising. Just because you haven't seen it done doesn't mean it can't be or shouldn't be done...

 

[jatoxico]

What's your point? I've never seen it done that way either

The point is, I was just trying to help the OP understand the different types of products and typical applications along with the terminology that's used since this can sometimes be confusing when you first start looking into wood burning, I know I was. I could have said ZC chimneys are "typically or normally" enclosed in a chase but chose to describe what one would find in any brochure or internet search of ZC fireplaces.

If you want to suggest alternatives go ahead, no one's arguing.