No secondary action?

mepellet said:

so sounds like I need to actually go up to 1000 with the flue thermometer prior to shutting the air down and perhaps try to develop a better coal/ash bed. What is a safe temp for the outside of class A chimney in the attic? It was hotter than I thought it was going to be. Could only leave my hand on it for a couple seconds.

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You are not the first person to question the outside temp of class a pipe, it will get hot to the touch and like Todd said if installed correctly will not be a problem. Hold your hand about 2 inches away from the pipe and see how hot that feels.

EDIT: Todd beat me......


Make sure you check your door gasket as well. If you close the damper the flames should die down quite a bit.

mepellet said:

Unfortunately the manual does not speak to the orientation of the baffle. I created a separate thread for that in hopes of another napoleon owner chiming in.

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Hi The baffles go on my 1450 Napoleon go on the outside walls. As for the secondary you need a good hot bed of coals usually start some Kinlen then add 3 to 4 inches mediums and get a good bed of coals. then add some large pieces and turn down the air in increments. Then you will see those secondaries burning away good for a while. They only last about one third of the burn time anyway then they usually go away.

I can get secondaries on my first fire without a bed of coals, dont want the OP to think he is trying to achieve the impossible.

oldspark said:

I can get secondaries on my first fire without a bed of coals, dont want the OP to think he is trying to achieve the impossible.

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It's a little more difficult but I can too. Have to time it right really

Get a stove top thermometer and you will notice that until the air is cut down the stove will not heat up very much. If I leave the air wide open on my Avalon the stack goes to the moon and the stove struggles to get hot. If the stove is not hot the bricks never get hot enough. I keep cutting the air so the stack slowly goes down to 500 with a probe and the stove temp keeps getting higher. I can not get secondarys until the stove has been over 450 for at least 15 minutes. I am not a firm believer in the ash in the bottom idea as it is a very good insulator so you are not heating the bricks on the bottom of the fire box. I am of the opinion you actually need hot coals on the floor to heat the bricks and keep the wood temp high enough but still playing around with that as thwe weather is not cold enough long enough to get into that testing very much.

." I can not get secondarys until the stove has been over 450 for at least 15 minutes"
It seems like there many different results with the brands of stoves, chimney variations and wood type (assuming dry wood), I can get a little secondary action off of the kindling but just a little, depending on the wood I can get secondaries before I reduce the primary air at 300 degrees or so on stove top (checked with IR testor).

oldspark said:

." I can not get secondarys until the stove has been over 450 for at least 15 minutes"
It seems like there many different results with the brands of stoves, chimney variations and wood type (assuming dry wood), I can get a little secondary action off of the kindling but just a little, depending on the wood I can get secondaries before I reduce the primary air at 300 degrees or so on stove top (checked with IR testor).

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With my little firebox there is not much in there burning and if not careful can cool quickly so maybe the difference there?

ddahlgren said:

With my little firebox there is not much in there burning and if not careful can cool quickly so maybe the difference there?

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Good point, smaller stove might get different results, for the most part results vary at least a little on most set ups.

FWIW here is mine doing a cold start.

Part 1
Part 2
Part 3

Unless I wasn't following the conversation right here are some of my tips, hopefully helps.

1) As far as the baffles, make sure your check them once a day. Mine liked to shift forward. In the morning before I cleaned out the ashes I would push them back.
2) I drilled a hole in the trivet and had a probe thermometer sticking in to read the stove top temp.
3) I would usually start with pallet wood for a starter (as in the video), get everything heated up fire. Flue temps would peak near 500 outside, 1000 inside and stove top would peak around 700.
4) Drop the air control down in steps.
5) Make sure the ash pan spring thingy is completely closed. I had ash build up that prevented the thingy from closing tightly. The thing that is above the ash pan and under the hole in the firebox.

Hopefully this helps. The secondaries in 1100C were much different then my Englander. They were cool swirls from the top to the sides down to the wood then back toward the top.

My Secondary's rip when I have a nice bed off coals in 30 min with 2 spits.

Seems to me a small fire should not make class A in the attic to hot to touch. The only part of mine hot is at the Tee. 2 ft above that its just luke warm. With the furnace, even the tee is not hot.

Even with a small fire the flue can get hot.

I second a stove top gauge, and just get used to the stove. Experience with a particular stove, and good dry wood (which should go without saying, but) will do wonders.