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770 degrees stovetop temp

Post in 'The Hearth Room - Wood Stoves and Fireplaces' started by mtcates, Nov 3, 2010.

  1. mtcates

    mtcates Member

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    I've had my new stove for about 3 weeks now and every time I reach a new high temperature there is a little paint still curing and the smell happens again. Its not as strong as it was the first week but I still get it if I reach that new max high. This morning I set out to reach a new high to cure the last little bit of paint and to test the stove operation a little. From a cold start I had my Englander 30 at 770 degrees stovetop in about 30 minutes time. I only used 4 medium sized oak splits running east to west and they were laying on top of two small wrist sized pieces running north to south used just to hold the 4 oak splits about 2 inches off the bottom so the little air jet could blow air under them. What an inferno. At 770 stovetop and still climbing I shut the primary air off totally and it cooled down to 600 in about 10 minutes. I actually killed the fire by shutting the primary off. It will not burn for long unless I crack the primary a little. I feel more confident in the stove now as I know I can shut it off by closing the primary air. My chimney is an insulated 6 inch liner 21 linear feet with no elbows. Now I wont smell that darn paint anymore as I'll never get it hotter than that, at least not on purpose.

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  2. begreen

    begreen Mooderator Staff Member

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    That is pretty hot, I wouldn't push it that hard too often. What were the room temps like?

    Can you add your stove make/model to your signature line?
  3. Monkey Wrench

    Monkey Wrench Feeling the Heat

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  4. joefrompa

    joefrompa New Member

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    I've had a bunch of fires now up to 550-600 degrees and one up to 700. Each time I crack 600-625, I can FEEL it in the room and there is a slight smell. Could be paint curing, or could simply be the smell of a masonry fireplace holding a 600+ degree 400 pound lump of steel inside a room with paint only a few months old.
  5. pen

    pen There are some who call me...mod. Staff Member

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    I agree that 750 is about as high as I'd want to take the stove. On a regular basis, I shoot to keep it under 700.

    Any time you reach a new high temp you'll get a whisp of the smell you mention. But remember, this will continue to happen right up to 1000 or 1100 degrees at which point your paint will completely vaporize.

    pen
  6. corey21

    corey21 Minister of Fire

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    I got a new stove this year. last year i had the wondercoal in the house hit 750 one day that solved the paint smell on it. i put it in the workshop now have the mag in the house only had it up to 450 so far. i learned about the epa thing and the burn tubes had to get me one.
  7. weatherguy

    weatherguy Minister of Fire

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    That would probably put an end to any paint curing smells :cheese:
  8. Backwoods Savage

    Backwoods Savage Minister of Fire

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    Ya, anything over 700 I'd start getting a little nervous.
  9. eman5oh

    eman5oh Member

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    Same story with my NC-30, the first fire at 450 the whole top of the stove started to smoke and set off the some alarms and stunk up the house. The second and third fires still did it just not as bad. So on a warmer day I loaded it up and ran it up to 700-750 for a hour or so and let it cruise at 600 for several more hours, with the windows open to get rid of the smell. I keep it under 600 during normal burning now and no smell or smoke, just a warm house :)
  10. BrotherBart

    BrotherBart Hearth.com LLC Mid-Atlantic Division Staff Member

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    At 1143 degrees the paint on a Rutland thermometer goes "poof".
  11. greythorn3

    greythorn3 Minister of Fire

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    got pics to prove it?
  12. Nate Finch

    Nate Finch New Member

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    Along these lines - what are the safe operating temperatures for these stoves? I got my quad up to 600 and that made me and my wife freak out, but here people are talking 750+ .. I'd probably be dumping a bucket of water on the stove at that point.

    What's a safe everyday running temp?
  13. mtcates

    mtcates Member

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    Here are pictures of the new englander 30 I am talking about. I just installed it about a month ago. Pictured also is my old englander stove that heated this house for 33 years. Funny thing is that the new stove at 770 degrees was not nearly as hot as I have got the old stove. Until recently I had no idea of an over fire and many many times I have gotten the old stove red on the top. I mean painfully hot to even be within a few feet of the thing. It is 33 years old and not warped at all and has probably seen 900+ degrees well over a hundred times, if not several hundred times in its history. With the new stove, if I stay below 700 for fear of damaging the stove, it will never put out the searing heat that the old stove did, but I sure am glad I have upgraded. I love the view of the fire through the glass. The fires do last longer and it does burn a little cleaner. The old stove burned surprisingly clean as I only had to clean the chimney twice a year and even then got only a few handful of soot out. Maybe because of my fire burning habit is to burn hot and fast several times a day.

    The room the stove is in is nearly 500 square feet and the stove is nearly in the center of the house. I have only R7 insulation in the roof and there is 200 square feet of windows in the stove room. I need a lot of BTU's on a cold day but even with an extremely hot fire it rarely gets too hot in the stove room. With all the masonry around and above my stove it absorbs a huge amount of heat from the initial hot burn and is obviously released over time. The fire can go out and it stays warm for many hours afterwards.

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  14. jharkin

    jharkin Minister of Fire

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    It varies by stove and manufacturer. Your owners manual should state some limits.

    My VC manual says nothing over 750 on the griddle. I know from experience that if I go over 650, the catalyst can go north of 1800 which leads to glowing metal inside the stove. So I try and keep it around 500-600 most of the time.

    Soapstone stoves I think have even lower rated operating temps.

    Also keep in mind that I think the metal coil stove thermometers we use are not all that accurate. Ive got 2 and they will read 50 degees different when placed together. So when mine is reading 600 who knows it might really be 650... or 550.

    ~Jeremy
  15. ckarotka

    ckarotka Minister of Fire

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    I know the new thermo I just picked up for the top of the stove is almost off 50-75 compared to the IR gun. When it says 550 it's really around 500 and thats a hot spot. The average stove temp is closer to 475. I haven't seen 650 or higher yet to see if it more accurate at higher temps. I got sick and tired of looking for the IR gun all the time and sprung for the second thermo. I leave the IR gun on the mantle of the second stove since it's in the hearth a thermo on top is unreadable.

    I could just about run the stove off the pipe temp though. At 300 (singlewall) the stove is cruising great with no smoke.
  16. Nate Finch

    Nate Finch New Member

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    Unfortunately, it doesn't... it says "don't over fire" and doesn't really explain what that means, except like "if your stove is glowing red" :/
  17. yanksforever

    yanksforever Member

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    I usually don't reload until my stove top gets down to 300 to 325 degrees. If you reload when it is still around 450 to 500 it can definitely overfire!
  18. Nate Finch

    Nate Finch New Member

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    I put six very dry splits approximately 5" diameter in the stove from a weak bed of coals. Top of the stove was at like 150. Stoked it until it hit 350, and cranked the air all the way down. Wife called 45 minutes later (after I'd left for work) to say the stove was at 600º and she was freaked out. Is 600 dangerous? From the temps quoted here, it sounds like maybe not.
  19. agartner

    agartner Feeling the Heat

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    Every stove is different. I consider 600 to be getting towards the "high side" and my Kent typically "peaks" out anywhere between 600-650, holds it for a bit, and then slowly starts to come back down. I get worried, and start taking action at 700+ temps - but normally I only hit that when I do something wrong, like leave the air too open for too long or forget to disengage my bypass.
  20. mtcates

    mtcates Member

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    From what I experienced with the little test I did was that I can kill the fire completely be closing the primary air valve. Apparently there are no air leaks in the stove so when I closed the air off there wasn't enough oxygen to sustain the primary burn, and when the heat cooled off enough the secondary burn stopped also. At least thats what it did on this test. I wonder if for those people that can sustain a burn with the primary air shut off if they have a leak somewhere or does the primary air still allow enough air volume in to sustain the burn even when put to the closed position. Apparently thats not the case with my Englander 30.
  21. eman5oh

    eman5oh Member

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    I have the same results with my nc-30 as well, if I close th eair all the way down the secondary burns till she cools off and the fire goes out.
  22. Pagey

    Pagey Minister of Fire

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    That's a fine looking install. That big Englander looks right at home there. Judging by those high ceilings, you picked the right stove.
  23. iceman

    iceman Minister of Fire

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    I am surprised BB hasn't given you some pointers... with a new epa stove you don't kill the air at 770..if I am understanding you right you had it wide open till 770? Forgive me if I have misunderstood you.... most of us start to close our stoves down between 350-500. Usually in stages, the stove top will continue to rise up to 6-700 degrees.... and stay there for.awhile before slowly going down...
    I am not sure if I have misunderstood you because I wouldn't leave my stove wide open to 770 as that might damage the stove or possibly the chimney
  24. branchburner

    branchburner Minister of Fire

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    Early in the secondaries, I can sometimes sustain a burn with my primary air shut off, but it turns into a dirty smolder if the wood is not perfect. My fully closed primary air control will easily sustain the burn if it is in the later stages of the secondaries, approaching the coaling stage, but the Harman burns best for me if the primary is open just a crack for the second half of the burn cycle.

    Personally, I consider 700 to be getting “high”, but my stove easily settles back into cruising mode, once the bypass is shut, at between 500-550 for a long duration of the burn. Many stoves like to cruise at 650, so I don't think there is much reason for concern unless your temps over 700 are sustained for a while. I only get very worried about overfire at 800+ temps.
  25. mtcates

    mtcates Member

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    This was not my normal practice in burning. It was just an experiment as well as to get the stove to a new high temp so the darn paint will stop smelling every time I reach a new high. The air control was about half open and I purposely let it climb to 770 and then shut it off completely. It did extinguish the fire when I shut it off, and now the paint wont smell anymore unless I get near that temp again which I do not intend to do so.

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