Is this stovepipe replace estimate reasonable?

[Louise]

I have a VC Encore (the Everburn, not catalytic) in my living room, which has a cathedral ceiling. Current pipe is single wall all the way up through a pair of 45 degree offsets (to allow for ceiling fan - stupid design). The box (I forget the correct term) at the top and through the ceiling/attic/roof is fine. I now(!) understand that any pipe over 8 feet above the stove should be double wall - I always do my research AFTER I develop a problem - and I need to replace the upper two straight segments because they're beginning to separate at the seams.

I received an estimate from a stove/incendiary device guy as follows:

"Furnish and install (1) 8” close clearance chimney system from existing wood stove to ceiling support with (1) set of 45 degree offsets. Price includes install, tax and labor.

"TOTAL………$1695.00"

That seemed high to me, so I asked him to break down materials and labor, and what the cost would be without new offsets (which aren't splitting, although they are still just single wall, I think), and he said:

"$1240 without the offsets, $400.00 labor"

I take this to mean that the straight sections cost $840, the labor is $400 and the offsets would be $55 (if I get them). Mr. Verbose didn't say, of course, whether the first 8 feet would be single wall - which they should be.

Does this seem reasonable to you all? Am I just in denial? (These are also the people who told me it would be $920 to repair my old VC Encore, and I suspected they just didn't want the job, but I could have been in denial, there, too.)

Thanks!
Louise-Annette

 

[overnight burn]

that quote seems a little high. He is refering to close clearance pipe, which is double wall stove pipe (air insulated) with a 6" clearance to combustables not class A pipe which is what you probably have from the ceiling box and up.

 

[Louise]

Thanks for your take on it - I keep wondering if he's trying to price himself out of the job because it's not worth it to him, or he thinks I don't know any better, or maybe he's just being perfectly straightforward and I'm being cynical. I'll check online prices for pipe. Oh, and one more question: how much time do you think it would take a reasonably experienced person to replace the stack?

 

[Wood Heat Stoves]

you shouldn't mix interior double wall with single wall

hard to answer your question w/o knowing the ceiling hieght, ie: how much pipe is he selling you?
ask for an itemized estimate

 

[Louise]

Thanks for your answer, Dave. So the whole stack should be double-wall? Will I be blowing most of the heat out the top, then? I tried to come up with an estimate of ceiling height before posting my question yesterday - my guess is about 20-25 feet, because its two stories' worth of a run, plus a little. How's that for precise?

 

[Jonsered]

Seems high to me for interior chimney work which should be very straight forward?

I agree with above...what is the ceiling height and how much pipe will he be installing?

 

[Louise]

I'm thinking - 20 feet? Normal ceiling height for each floor, run is 2 floors' worth - I guess I should measure, huh? I'll do that and post the results tomorrow (no internet at home). thanks for your input!

 

[begreen]

Figure roughly $150 per 48" section of 8" double-wall pipe. 20' should cost about $750. From the description it doesn't sound like there is more than $900 worth of materials involved unless the offset between the 45's is large.

http://www.northlineexpress.com/multiple_items.asp?cc=8DVL

 

[Louise]

Excellent! Thank you!

You guys are the best.

Louise

 

[begreen]

Note I updated the prices. I made a mistake and gave it for 6" pipe. The link and pricing is now for 8".

 

[SteveKG]

If this is just a straight-forward replacement of single- with double-walled pipe, as you described, it is either a ton of money for that job or you live in an area where handyman jobs cost a lot more than around where I live. I wonder why you don't do it yourself??? Have you had other bids? If there are other people/companies around you who do that sort of work, maybe you should talk to them, too, unless you already have. Stovepipe is really pricey these days, for sure, but that seems like a lot of money for a relatively simple job. Of course, you don't want to hire someone for cheap and have the place burn down. But, still....

 

[Louise]

You know, I did consider doing it myself, but there's just me and I thought it would take more than one person. Maybe I'll beg my ex to help me with it - he's the one who got me addicted to wood stoves in the first place, so it would be only fair. I have asked someone else to give me an estimate, but I think you're right - when you pay someone else to do work, it costs more than to have yourself do it for free.

 

[Slow1]

Consider calling sweeps as well as stores - you likely have more sweeps than stores in your area and if you find a certified sweep (i.e one who knows what he is doing vs someone who just bought a set of brushes and ladder figuring "it can't be all that hard to go into business") then you can get the confidence in the job being done right and perhaps get a more competitive bid in there.

 

[kevinmerchant]

Why is double wall needed when running interior. I'm about to install a similar set up but with a shorter interior run.
Ditto on the chimney sweep idea for the job if you cant do it your self. You will probably get better pricing, but get at least 3 quotes.

 

[begreen]

Doulbe-wall isn't needed for all interior connectors, only on long runs to limit the cooling of the flue gases. It can also be helpful if the draft is weak or necessary for reducing clearances.

 

[BrotherBart]

Some of that charge is for working 20' off the floor standing on a ladder with both hands full of a stove pipe.

 

[Louise]

Okay, I'm going to back up and start at the beginning. I have single wall up to the ceiling box, with the last section consisting of a pair of 45 degree offsets. The top two straight (not the elbows) sections are starting to split at the seams, so I need to replace them. (That may be related to the - ahem - small chimney fire I had last winter.)

Also, I've been having problems with controlling the burn temp on the stove. When I first got it, I carefully followed directions on getting flue temp up to whatever it was supposed to be and then I closed the damper and set the thermostat lever thingie somewhere towards the cooler side. The temp continued to climb for at least 200 degrees (per my flue thermometer), which I found very disturbing. It still does this - the temp continues to go up after I close the damper, even if I shut down the thermostat all the way. I don't know if this is a problem that is completely separate from and independent of my chimney issues - it doesn't seem like it is related, but what do I know.

I read on this site and in my Encore manual that if your run is more than 8 feet or so above the stove top, you should have double wall to prevent too much heat loss and consequent creosote build-up in the upper part of the stack. Last time I had the chimney cleaned, the sweep took the topmost piece off and all the way down to the ground to knock all the creosote out of it - he was very impressed by how thick the deposits were.

So - now my questions are:

(1) should I replace the existing pipe with double wall? all the way from stove to ceiling box?
(2) should I replace the offsets because they're single wall, too, even though they don't appear to be damaged?
(3) should I get a damper for above the stove?

Does anyone else really regret replacing their VC Encore catalytic with a VC Encore Everburn?

Louise

 

[Louise]

@BrotherBart: why, what could POSSIBLY go wrong? ;P

 

[begreen]

Okay, I'm going to back up and start at the beginning. I have single wall up to the ceiling box, with the last section consisting of a pair of 45 degree offsets. The top two straight (not the elbows) sections are starting to split at the seams, so I need to replace them. (That may be related to the - ahem - small chimney fire I had last winter.)

Also, I've been having problems with controlling the burn temp on the stove. When I first got it, I carefully followed directions on getting flue temp up to whatever it was supposed to be and then I closed the damper and set the thermostat lever thingie somewhere towards the cooler side. The temp continued to climb for at least 200 degrees (per my flue thermometer), which I found very disturbing. It still does this - the temp continues to go up after I close the damper, even if I shut down the thermostat all the way. I don't know if this is a problem that is completely separate from and independent of my chimney issues - it doesn't seem like it is related, but what do I know.

I read on this site and in my Encore manual that if your run is more than 8 feet or so above the stove top, you should have double wall to prevent too much heat loss and consequent creosote build-up in the upper part of the stack. Last time I had the chimney cleaned, the sweep took the topmost piece off and all the way down to the ground to knock all the creosote out of it - he was very impressed by how thick the deposits were.

So - now my questions are:

(1) should I replace the existing pipe with double wall? all the way from stove to ceiling box?
(2) should I replace the offsets because they're single wall, too, even though they don't appear to be damaged?
(3) should I get a damper for above the stove?

Does anyone else really regret replacing their VC Encore catalytic with a VC Encore Everburn?

Louise

(1) Replace the entire connector pipe from stove to the ceiling support box with double-wall connector
(2) Yes, replace the elbows too.
(3) no, there is no need indicated

(4) Be sure you are burning only well seasoned dry wood. Damp wood cools the fire and emits more smoke. This can create a creosote problem quickly.

 

[Pagey]

It is not uncommon to see your temps spike for a time period after strong secondary combustion takes off on a fresh load of wood. I can close the bypass damper on my Endeavor when the stove top is reading 400F, and it will continue to climb to 600-650F for at least an hour or two, even with the primary air reduced to almost fully closed.

 

[overnight burn]

that job should take 3 hours at most and thats a lot

 

[summit]

put in the double wall all the way to top. DW pipe costs big bucks. It's also guaranteed for life, and will improve your draft.

 

[Louise]

I LOVE THIS FORUM. Thank you all.

Louise